Latest / The Steve Harvey Morning Show / Interview of the Week: Don Lemon hosts "CNN Tonight with Don Lemon," and "Silence is Not an Option" podcast, and author of the new book, "This is the Fire: What I Say To My Friends About Racism"

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Interview of the Week: Don Lemon hosts "CNN Tonight with Don Lemon," and "Silence is Not an Option" podcast, and author of the new book, "This is the Fire: What I Say To My Friends About Racism" · The Steve Harvey Morning Show

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Speaker 1: Likes to share. Now it's time to hear from my man,
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Speaker 1: Rashan McDonald money Making conver sections. Working the money making Conversation.
0:08
Speaker 1: I'm back again, your host, Rashan McDonald. I always tell
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Speaker 1: people it's time to start reading other people's success stories.
0:13
Speaker 1: I say that every time I start this show. It's
0:15
Speaker 1: time you start doing your job and writing your own story.
0:18
Speaker 1: And I always tell people leave with their gifts and
0:19
Speaker 1: don't let their friends age, especially age, stop you from
0:23
Speaker 1: playing your dreams or living your dreams. My INM interviewers
0:26
Speaker 1: always include consumers, uh CEOs, entrepreneurs, and what I call
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Speaker 1: industry decision maker. My next guest, he's an interesting decision maker.
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Speaker 1: He's a celebrity because he's on TV every night. He's
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Speaker 1: an entrepreneur. His name is Don Lemon. He's the host
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Speaker 1: of Seeing n Tonight with Don Lemon, and he's America's
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Speaker 1: only black prime time anchor. In Done was the leading
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Speaker 1: voice on CNN guided viewers like me through the death
0:50
Speaker 1: of George Floyds on the summer nationwide protests and riots.
0:54
Speaker 1: The viewers and myself we depended on him nightly to
0:56
Speaker 1: god us through the global pandemic. I recently got a vaccine,
1:00
Speaker 1: I woul tell you them. He guided me through the
1:02
Speaker 1: process of being mature enough to deal with that and
1:04
Speaker 1: go get the vaccine. I got it yesterday. Now an urgent,
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Speaker 1: deeply personal and rivetem plead his new book shows us
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Speaker 1: how deep our problem live with racism and what we
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Speaker 1: can do to begin to fix the problem. The book
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Speaker 1: is entitled This is the Fire What I Say to
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Speaker 1: my friends about racism. Don brings his vast audience and
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Speaker 1: experience as a reporter and a black man to today's
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Speaker 1: most urgent question, how can we end racism in America
1:28
Speaker 1: in our lifetime? Please? Welcome to Money Making Conversation. Don Lemon,
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Speaker 1: Chris Shawan, Thank you so much. It's good to be
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Speaker 1: with you again. And wow, what an introduction. Well, you know,
1:39
Speaker 1: some man, it was. It was emotional, you know, because
1:41
Speaker 1: I read the book and the book was a journey.
1:44
Speaker 1: And I say that to everybody that before I get
1:48
Speaker 1: into detail about the book. One of the things that
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Speaker 1: I love what you said is somebody says they have
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Speaker 1: the answer to the racism, basically walk away from because
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Speaker 1: they lie. And you said that in the book, because
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Speaker 1: that's true. Talk to us about that. Well, it's said,
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Speaker 1: I wanted to write this book because I thought I
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Speaker 1: had some things that I could speak to and that
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Speaker 1: I could speak because I'm at the really at the
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Speaker 1: matrix of, as you so keenly pointed out, of everything
2:11
Speaker 1: that happens in this country every single night, every weeknight,
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Speaker 1: at least sometimes on weekends, sometimes seven nights a week. Uh,
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Speaker 1: And I'm just sort of guiding people through the process
2:21
Speaker 1: and so, um, so you're right on about that. I
2:28
Speaker 1: it was, it was. It was a tough thing to
2:32
Speaker 1: write this book, knowing, um what I know, and experiencing
2:36
Speaker 1: what I've experienced, and it was, as you said, very personal.
2:42
Speaker 1: Just before just before I hung up with you a
2:45
Speaker 1: couple of minutes and just before I got on with
2:46
Speaker 1: you a couple of minutes ago. Um, you know, my
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Speaker 1: I write the letter to my nephew in the beginning
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Speaker 1: of the book. My niece and her husband called, which
2:56
Speaker 1: is Trishad my great nephew who I write the letter to.
2:59
Speaker 1: It's his mom and stepdad. And they called me and
3:01
Speaker 1: they were so emotional about the book, and they didn't
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Speaker 1: realize just how personal and how candid it would be.
3:07
Speaker 1: And they said they were actually crying reading the book.
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Speaker 1: And he's like, and you know, his stepdad Jeffrey said,
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Speaker 1: I'm not an emotional person, but don you made me cry.
3:15
Speaker 1: I believe this book is going to be a classic
3:17
Speaker 1: and a hundred years people are going to be reading.
3:19
Speaker 1: And I said, what, So there you go. But you
3:23
Speaker 1: know in that letter it was it was a couple
3:25
Speaker 1: of things. Maybe smile when you said we share the
3:27
Speaker 1: same fourhead nose and we're articulated m bones. What is that?
3:33
Speaker 1: What is that? Then you know you know well articulated
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Speaker 1: on bones, that everything is in the right place. Um, um,
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Speaker 1: there's a there's a photo of us at the beach
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Speaker 1: from a couple of summers ago, and um, very similar.
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Speaker 1: He's he has the younger body, uh, the younger version
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Speaker 1: of me. And so I looked at it. I said, look,
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Speaker 1: we have the same arms and we have the same
4:01
Speaker 1: weird and so that I said, how would I put
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Speaker 1: that in there? Instead of saying, you know, it's so
4:05
Speaker 1: simple to say we have the same arm and say, well,
4:07
Speaker 1: don't want to say the same well articulated arm. But
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Speaker 1: I loved it. It may be smile because the book
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Speaker 1: like this want to smile. You want to find those
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Speaker 1: moments of happiness because it's the truth. And sometimes when
4:17
Speaker 1: you deal with racism and that, and you know, white people,
4:20
Speaker 1: they always say, you have to say, white people, can
4:22
Speaker 1: you just move on? You know, we know there's a problem.
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Speaker 1: Can we move on. That's not me. They don't really
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Speaker 1: realize the vast nature of hot racism is so undercover.
4:32
Speaker 1: The beauty of electing a person like you said with
4:34
Speaker 1: Donald Trump in to me, you said, he led us
4:38
Speaker 1: to the fire. And what exactly is the fire? Well,
4:43
Speaker 1: he glowed us to the fire and then pour gasoline
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Speaker 1: on it. Um. The Fire is James Bowen's book, Um,
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Speaker 1: The Fire Next Time, which was this was a tribute
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Speaker 1: to right. That's why one of the reasons that I
4:55
Speaker 1: um fashioned the book in the way that I fashioned
4:57
Speaker 1: it is because James Bowen is my literal very hero
5:01
Speaker 1: UM as I was as I read I read The
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Speaker 1: Fire Next Time a couple of times a year, and
5:04
Speaker 1: as all of these events were unfolding UM in the
5:08
Speaker 1: last few years, and especially the last year in the
5:10
Speaker 1: summer of I wanted to write something. I was inspired
5:14
Speaker 1: to write something that was short, that was concise, and
5:16
Speaker 1: that was powerful, and I wrote it in the fashion
5:19
Speaker 1: of James Baldwin. That's why James Balwan starts to fire
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Speaker 1: Next Time with a letter to his nephew one hundred
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Speaker 1: years after the Emancipation Proclamation on the anniversary one hundred
5:27
Speaker 1: years and he starts by saying something like, we know
5:30
Speaker 1: that we're celebrating or we're writing this. You know, I've
5:32
Speaker 1: begun this letter, UM a thousand times and I've torn
5:36
Speaker 1: it up. And then he says, we know that we're
5:38
Speaker 1: celebrating this anniversary a hundred years too soon, even though
5:41
Speaker 1: it's a hundred year anniversary of the Emancipation Patient Proclamation.
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Speaker 1: And when he said God gave no oh the rainbow
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Speaker 1: sign no more water to fire next time, to me,
5:50
Speaker 1: that was an indication in a call after watching someone
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Speaker 1: die on camera, UM, that we were in the fire
5:57
Speaker 1: and that we were at an inflection point in our society, UM,
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Speaker 1: and either we could decide as a group of people
6:04
Speaker 1: to continue on towards a more perfect union rather than
6:09
Speaker 1: a divisive union, or regressing to a time where UM,
6:13
Speaker 1: people of color and marginalized people did not have equal
6:16
Speaker 1: rights under the law under the Constitution, or at least
6:19
Speaker 1: under the law unto the Constitution, they should have, but
6:22
Speaker 1: not more treated that way, and so I believe that
6:25
Speaker 1: we are. This is the fire that we're in right now.
6:27
Speaker 1: If we don't fix this, then it's going to get
6:30
Speaker 1: hotter and worse, and we will never fix it. We're
6:32
Speaker 1: at an inflection point where it needs to change. And
6:35
Speaker 1: then in the book we talked about it. I think
6:37
Speaker 1: it's a great segument because you say we're a perfect
6:39
Speaker 1: union because at the age of back three new book,
6:41
Speaker 1: you talk about Thomas Jefferson and he's writing. But before
6:45
Speaker 1: we go there, let's go back to sixteen nineteen as
6:47
Speaker 1: you're talking a book when they really all started. You know,
6:50
Speaker 1: you know many women are dark complexion of color, collection
6:55
Speaker 1: skin well sold as slave in sixteen and then you
6:58
Speaker 1: jumped to Thomas Jefferson at the age of thirty two
7:02
Speaker 1: and when they wanted to do right, but they were
7:04
Speaker 1: shouted down by men who didn't want to do right
7:07
Speaker 1: because they said, who's going to pick the cotton? I'm
7:09
Speaker 1: not picking the cotton, so's not gonna pick itself right.
7:13
Speaker 1: And then because it was, like I said, it was
7:16
Speaker 1: a beautiful book. First of all, I want to compliment
7:18
Speaker 1: you on that because I read a lot of books
7:19
Speaker 1: and and what captures me as a as a reader
7:22
Speaker 1: is emotion and it also you're very colorful writer. In
7:27
Speaker 1: other words, I actually felt the moments I felt uh
7:31
Speaker 1: Thomas Jefferson's issues that he had in your writing. And
7:34
Speaker 1: then you jumped to uh Miss moul Terry in nineteen
7:37
Speaker 1: forty seven. It gets personal with you because you start
7:39
Speaker 1: talking about your life. You know, you start talking about
7:41
Speaker 1: this is an area of the country that you live in,
7:44
Speaker 1: and she, as a black woman, was in a position
7:46
Speaker 1: to purchase land and the issues that she had to
7:49
Speaker 1: deal with. And then you jump even further to George Floyda.
7:53
Speaker 1: Why was it important to have these transitional time moments
7:56
Speaker 1: in your book to set the stage because I think
7:59
Speaker 1: it was importan to show that the true history of
8:02
Speaker 1: the country and the contributions of black people, of people
8:05
Speaker 1: of color, of um people who were descendants of slaves.
8:10
Speaker 1: I thought it was important to be able to point
8:12
Speaker 1: that out because I don't think that we can solve
8:14
Speaker 1: this unless we start at the beginning. In the beginning
8:16
Speaker 1: is a true history of this country. You mentioned sixteen nineteen,
8:19
Speaker 1: and there's a sixteen nineteen project, But there's also what
8:23
Speaker 1: we should realize is that long before the Mayflower was here.
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Speaker 1: There were people who came over who made the journey
8:28
Speaker 1: across the Atlantic, and they were Africans, and there were
8:30
Speaker 1: people who helped to build this country for free. So
8:32
Speaker 1: while we look upon the descendants are the people who
8:36
Speaker 1: came over on the Mayflower as some sort of sort
8:38
Speaker 1: of vaunted or celebrated position. Um, perhaps that we should
8:42
Speaker 1: teach the history of the people who came over before
8:45
Speaker 1: them as well, and who actually built the country for
8:48
Speaker 1: free as slave slave labor. And um, so I used
8:52
Speaker 1: mon terry, because mon terry that should be taught in
8:54
Speaker 1: our history books to American history to kids, as we
8:58
Speaker 1: teach Christopher columb Us discovered America. Christopher Columbus did not
9:02
Speaker 1: discover America. America was here long before Christopher Columbus. Columbus
9:06
Speaker 1: is here, just asked any native American. And it's insulting
9:10
Speaker 1: to people actually to learn that, because it's not the truth.
9:12
Speaker 1: If you want to say Christopher Columbus conquered America, or
9:16
Speaker 1: that um that Europeans conquered America, Okay, that might be
9:20
Speaker 1: a fair statement. So that um, people like Mone Terry
9:25
Speaker 1: and his sister a Maza, and um, the German coast Uprising,
9:29
Speaker 1: which I write about, and a number of other things
9:31
Speaker 1: that instances in the book that include African Americans or
9:35
Speaker 1: African how African people contributed to this country. I think
9:40
Speaker 1: that's where we start with the truth from the beginning,
9:43
Speaker 1: and that's why I wove all of those instances into
9:46
Speaker 1: the book to try to bring it all from the past,
9:49
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11:45
Speaker 1: and the ad Council. Now you're saying the book you
11:48
Speaker 1: do not pretend to have any answers. And then the
11:51
Speaker 1: book is this is the fire. What I say to
11:54
Speaker 1: my friends about racism? What what response are you given
11:57
Speaker 1: to your friends? So the response that the biggest responses
12:02
Speaker 1: that we have to do the work is that there's
12:05
Speaker 1: a shared responsibility that we all have as Americans where
12:08
Speaker 1: we can't say, well, you know, my people didn't do this,
12:10
Speaker 1: and my people didn't do that, and I didn't know
12:12
Speaker 1: in plays and I didn't know, but um, there but
12:17
Speaker 1: there were people in this country, um, who weren't able
12:21
Speaker 1: to vote, weren't able to get an education, who were
12:24
Speaker 1: not able to live with they where they wanted and
12:28
Speaker 1: weren't able to which is the biggest part of it
12:31
Speaker 1: is to earn generational wealth. And but who helped to
12:35
Speaker 1: build the wealth for wealthy people, and which offers what
12:39
Speaker 1: an ease in society and a comfort and a level
12:43
Speaker 1: of privilege that that isn't afforded to most people of
12:47
Speaker 1: color in this country. And so what I tell them
12:50
Speaker 1: is that again they must know their history starts from
12:52
Speaker 1: the beginning and teaching their children the real history of
12:55
Speaker 1: this country. But I also tell people that the difference
12:59
Speaker 1: is going to be made with the relationship because when
13:03
Speaker 1: you see people as human, when you see people's humanity,
13:06
Speaker 1: it's hard to discriminate against them. It's hard to be
13:09
Speaker 1: humanize them. And it's even more difficult to put your
13:13
Speaker 1: knee on their neck for almost nine minutes on a
13:15
Speaker 1: street in front of the world to see you. So relationships,
13:19
Speaker 1: get to know people who don't look like you, that's
13:22
Speaker 1: really important, and really it was. It was interesting things
13:25
Speaker 1: when I talk I try to talk out of when
13:27
Speaker 1: I talked about staff, I talked to my family and
13:29
Speaker 1: talked to my my daughter. I would talk about the
13:31
Speaker 1: reality of what Donald Trump was to this country. I
13:34
Speaker 1: always felt that and I tell the people that I
13:36
Speaker 1: said equipment with the one in twenty sixteen, I think
13:39
Speaker 1: that we needed this gut check because I felt that
13:42
Speaker 1: Donald Trump pushed this country into a state of racist reality,
13:46
Speaker 1: and it brought out a lot of people who are
13:47
Speaker 1: boldly let them know how they feel about race, but
13:50
Speaker 1: boldly letting them know, let you know what side of
13:53
Speaker 1: the eye they're willing to stand on. Do you think
13:55
Speaker 1: that's good or bad? Because myself, I think I want
13:58
Speaker 1: to know what a person thinks. Is that of them
14:00
Speaker 1: hiding what they think? I want to know as well.
14:03
Speaker 1: I would rather someone tell me who they are. I
14:05
Speaker 1: would rather know who they are, and we do now.
14:07
Speaker 1: And that's why I stayed in the book that he
14:09
Speaker 1: was the president we deserved and probably the president we needed.
14:11
Speaker 1: Now what would it have been better iFIT if we
14:14
Speaker 1: could have learned the same lessons through a different person
14:17
Speaker 1: with a different experience. Yes, But all things being what
14:21
Speaker 1: they were and what they are right now, we must
14:24
Speaker 1: look at the reality, and that is that he exposed
14:27
Speaker 1: um for us, the symptoms of what was boiling or
14:34
Speaker 1: going on beneath the surface, and he's the one that
14:37
Speaker 1: sent us into the doctor's office to have it diagnosed
14:40
Speaker 1: and then fixed. Whatever that is, whether it's a long
14:45
Speaker 1: process of of convalescing and trying to get better and
14:49
Speaker 1: um and recovery, or whether it's just to excite the
14:52
Speaker 1: problem and try to do it immediately and as fast
14:55
Speaker 1: as possible. But whatever it is, he led it, He
14:58
Speaker 1: exposed it, and he led us here and now we
15:01
Speaker 1: know we don't have to live in um some false
15:07
Speaker 1: reality that we thought that we were post racial, because
15:09
Speaker 1: we're not. Absolutely. You know the thing about it, here's
15:13
Speaker 1: an interesting part about my life. And you know, when you,
15:15
Speaker 1: you know, you develop a relationship with a person like you,
15:18
Speaker 1: You know, I value the time I spend with you now,
15:20
Speaker 1: but I even value the time I spend with you
15:22
Speaker 1: whenever at my home. And I turned you on and
15:25
Speaker 1: as a as an honesty about you done it. Police
15:28
Speaker 1: expound on that because it is riveting to me. Last
15:32
Speaker 1: night when I saw you interview the Capitol police officer
15:35
Speaker 1: who had uh and you in in twelve of Republican
15:39
Speaker 1: members of Congress didn't want to honor them because they
15:41
Speaker 1: didn't see the January sixth event as an insurrection, even
15:46
Speaker 1: though five people died at that little I guess protests
15:49
Speaker 1: that got out of hand. I guess that's what they're
15:51
Speaker 1: calling it. I don't know, but this man, you know,
15:55
Speaker 1: he used the word are racial slur. He didn't want
15:58
Speaker 1: to use the N word, but was mentally bruised in
16:02
Speaker 1: may take years of therapy to recover from that moment.
16:06
Speaker 1: But you was the interviewer. How did you how were
16:08
Speaker 1: you taking all of that and then maintaining emotions. Well,
16:12
Speaker 1: I have to, because um, I am the fassilitator, right
16:15
Speaker 1: and if I lose my composure, then you don't get
16:18
Speaker 1: anything out of the interview. But at the very beginning
16:20
Speaker 1: of the interview, I started talking to him and then
16:23
Speaker 1: he said, I'm sorry I stopped. I didn't expect to
16:25
Speaker 1: be this emotional, and so I said to him, it's okay,
16:30
Speaker 1: go ahead and talk to us. Why are you emotional?
16:32
Speaker 1: And then it gets then he has to explain it. Um.
16:35
Speaker 1: It gives him a place to go rather than going
16:38
Speaker 1: down spiral and spiraling into his emotions. Sometimes you just
16:43
Speaker 1: have to allow it and let people say what they
16:45
Speaker 1: want to say. But I think it was more productive
16:48
Speaker 1: um that he explained his feelings and why he become
16:52
Speaker 1: so emotional. And he said, because I hadn't really had
16:55
Speaker 1: a chance before this interview. The way I set it up.
16:58
Speaker 1: The interview, he said, gave him a fuller perspective or
17:01
Speaker 1: more fulsome perspective about um what had transpired and what
17:06
Speaker 1: people thought about it. And also he had done one
17:09
Speaker 1: earlier interview, and in that earlier interview, he had not
17:13
Speaker 1: spoken to his fellow officers, and after speaking to his
17:16
Speaker 1: fellow officers, he got more of their experiences. And that
17:21
Speaker 1: cut even deeper because one of one of the fellow
17:25
Speaker 1: officers said to him, Um, the protesters were not only calling,
17:29
Speaker 1: you know, me the N word, but they said, hey,
17:30
Speaker 1: N word, you have that rifle in your hand. You're
17:32
Speaker 1: so big and bad. Why don't you put that rifle
17:35
Speaker 1: down and we'll show you how big of an inn
17:36
Speaker 1: word you are. And this is a police officer who
17:40
Speaker 1: is who puts his life on the line every day,
17:42
Speaker 1: and these people are out there supposed to be supporters
17:44
Speaker 1: of the police officers, and you know so called blue
17:47
Speaker 1: Lives matter, but they're beating them with blue Lives Matter,
17:50
Speaker 1: blackpoles and signs. So um, that's that's why he was
17:56
Speaker 1: emotional because he had had time to as orbit. He
17:58
Speaker 1: hadn't had time to asorber it before. I think he
18:00
Speaker 1: was somewhat still in a state of shock. We know
18:04
Speaker 1: just in reading this book. You know, great picture on
18:06
Speaker 1: the back by the way, I love that picture. Where
18:07
Speaker 1: where was it taking? What was taking that? That was
18:11
Speaker 1: taken in the backyard of my house? In front of
18:13
Speaker 1: I have a shed in the backyard, right, What is
18:16
Speaker 1: it a shed in the backyard, and that's the door
18:18
Speaker 1: to the shed. And I'm actually um standing right next
18:22
Speaker 1: to there's. Uh, I had drained the bushes that I'm
18:25
Speaker 1: trying not to crush because I said, you know, as
18:27
Speaker 1: a book, you write about a black man with white heritage,
18:30
Speaker 1: you embody both the struggle and the hope of reconciliation,
18:33
Speaker 1: you know. And I look at this very simple picture
18:36
Speaker 1: and it's and it works for you, you you know. You know,
18:39
Speaker 1: I don't see the tide. I don't see the look
18:41
Speaker 1: I see o t V. And you have an amazing smile.
18:43
Speaker 1: That's why it's always with me and you when I
18:45
Speaker 1: interview you. I really want to see the smile. But
18:48
Speaker 1: I have to balance that because you're such a you know,
18:51
Speaker 1: your your business is serious. You're a guy. You a
18:54
Speaker 1: guy who has to who present the whole process of
18:57
Speaker 1: being serious and also informative to us before we exit
19:01
Speaker 1: on this brilliant book. This is the Fire What I
19:03
Speaker 1: Say to my friends about Racism by Don Lemon. It
19:05
Speaker 1: was a wrap up my friends, so we can sell
19:07
Speaker 1: some more books. Tell me what do you want to know?
19:09
Speaker 1: What do you want to know? From? Where do we go?
19:11
Speaker 1: You know? Without revealing the process of your book. But
19:14
Speaker 1: where do you we go? How do we what? What
19:15
Speaker 1: do I have to do? You know, I feel I'm
19:17
Speaker 1: doing a good job. We go with honesty, We go
19:21
Speaker 1: with a sense of openness. We go with a vulnerability,
19:24
Speaker 1: the same vulnerability. Are in the same mindset that we
19:28
Speaker 1: had during the summer when we were locked in our homes,
19:33
Speaker 1: when um, when our hearts and our minds are open,
19:38
Speaker 1: and then we saw someone die in front of our eyes.
19:41
Speaker 1: We go with that vulnerability, and we have to to
19:44
Speaker 1: um to a large degree trust that our countrymen will
19:48
Speaker 1: do the right thing. But trust yet verified. But I
19:53
Speaker 1: would I would say, but here's what I think again,
19:56
Speaker 1: And I hate to keep harping on this, and I
19:58
Speaker 1: know people think it's you know, it may sound traite.
20:01
Speaker 1: We have to establish relationships, especially with people who do
20:05
Speaker 1: not look like us, the people who do not live
20:09
Speaker 1: particularly maybe in our same neighborhood or travel in our
20:12
Speaker 1: same circles. That is the only way it's going to happen.
20:15
Speaker 1: We have to begin to respect and learn and love
20:19
Speaker 1: each other and see each other's humanity. And that's and
20:23
Speaker 1: and and then beyond that, we have to begin to
20:25
Speaker 1: do the work that's that we've got to do the work.
20:28
Speaker 1: And and doing the work requires an open mind in
20:30
Speaker 1: an open part. Well, you've done the work. You've written
20:32
Speaker 1: a brilliant book, an informative book, an emotional book. That
20:35
Speaker 1: this is the fire. What I say to my friends
20:37
Speaker 1: about racism, Well do you say to me every night?
20:40
Speaker 1: Makes me feel good and informs me and gives me hope? Done, lemon,
20:43
Speaker 1: don't you stop? And you are the prime time black
20:46
Speaker 1: man for America. Now Okay, Rashwan, thank you so much
20:52
Speaker 1: with that. I really appreciate all your support. Uh and
20:54
Speaker 1: thank you for your kind word. And I'll be talking
20:57
Speaker 1: to you tonight on my show and hopefully I'll be
20:59
Speaker 1: back here on your show. Okay, big commer, they say,
21:01
Speaker 1: you know, we win big. Okay. I love this banking.
21:05
Speaker 1: Thank you. If we hear more Money Making Conversation interviews,
21:07
Speaker 1: please go to Money Making Conversation dot com. I'm with
21:09
Speaker 1: Sean mcgonald, I'm the host. Thank you, Donald. In this
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