Latest / The Steve Harvey Morning Show / Full Episode: Debra Martin Chase - Executive Producer of "The Equalizer,"; Harvey Mason Jr. - GRAMMY Awards interim President/CEO; Sister Souljah – Author of "The Coldest Winter Ever"; & Jason George –Actor in ABC's "Station 19"

Transcript

Full Episode: Debra Martin Chase - Executive Producer of "The Equalizer,"; Harvey Mason Jr. - GRAMMY Awards interim President/CEO; Sister Souljah – Author of "The Coldest Winter Ever"; & Jason George –Actor in ABC's "Station 19" · The Steve Harvey Morning Show

0:04
Speaker 1: Welcome to Money Making Conversations. It's the show that she
0:07
Speaker 1: has the secrets of success experience firsthand by marketing and
0:10
Speaker 1: Brandon expert Rashan McDonald. I will know he's giving me
0:13
Speaker 1: advice to many occasions. In occasion didn't notice, I'm not broke.
0:17
Speaker 1: You know. He'll be interviewing celebrity CEOs, entrepreneurs and industry
0:20
Speaker 1: decision makers. It's what he likes to do. It's what
0:23
Speaker 1: he likes to share. Now it's time to hear from
0:25
Speaker 1: my man, Rashan McDonald. Money Making Conversation's here we come.
0:30
Speaker 1: Welcome to Money Making Conversation. I am your host, U
0:32
Speaker 1: Sean McDonald. It's time to stop reading other people's success
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Speaker 1: stories and really start writing your own. I want to
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Speaker 1: be lead with your gifts and don't let your age, friends, family,
0:41
Speaker 1: or co workers stop you from planning or living your dreams.
0:44
Speaker 1: Those are the guests that I bring on my show
0:46
Speaker 1: for you as a consumer and business owner. I'm giving
0:48
Speaker 1: you access to celebrity CEOs, entrepreneurs, and people I like
0:52
Speaker 1: to call interesting decision makers. My next guest is she's
0:56
Speaker 1: a celebrity, she's a CEO, she's an entrepreneur, and she
0:59
Speaker 1: truly is an industry decision maker. Her name is Debor
1:02
Speaker 1: Martin Chase. She's the President CEO of Martin Chase Productions.
1:06
Speaker 1: She's currently the executive producer of one of my favorite shows,
1:09
Speaker 1: The Equalizer, the TV series for CBS and Universal Students
1:12
Speaker 1: starting My Girl que Latifa. The premiered on Super Bowl Sunday.
1:16
Speaker 1: The Equalizer currently airs every Sunday. You can check it
1:19
Speaker 1: a pm, seven Central again on CBS. Now, let's talk
1:23
Speaker 1: about Debor Martin Chase entertain the industry icon trailblazer as
1:27
Speaker 1: the first African American female producer to have a deal
1:30
Speaker 1: at any major studio. Ever. I was there. I was
1:32
Speaker 1: watching white known sitcom. I was going, who is she?
1:36
Speaker 1: Were like? Ever meet Hi. She's also the first African
1:39
Speaker 1: American woman to produce a film that grossed over one
1:41
Speaker 1: hundred million dollars. That was Denzel's Washington Courage under Fire.
1:45
Speaker 1: To date, her films have grossed over a half billion
1:48
Speaker 1: dollars at the box office. Only got two movies, you know,
1:51
Speaker 1: Think like a Man, Think like a Man too. I
1:52
Speaker 1: think I did a hundred and fifty millions, So I
1:54
Speaker 1: ain't close to her. About six years ago, nobody's interested
1:58
Speaker 1: in making movies about women all people of color. My
2:01
Speaker 1: how the landscape has changed for black people and creatives
2:05
Speaker 1: in Hollywood. Please welcome to when to make it a
2:08
Speaker 1: conversation to talk about it, my friend, and you stone
2:11
Speaker 1: it Devor Martin Chase, So thank you so much, such
2:17
Speaker 1: kind words. Thank you well first of all the three like,
2:21
Speaker 1: I'm Ray Sean McDonald now dever Martin Chase. How did
2:24
Speaker 1: it become three names? Cha? Well, that's the Houston part.
2:32
Speaker 1: I was married when I got out of law school
2:35
Speaker 1: and moved to Houston, Texas and uh, and since it
2:39
Speaker 1: was the beginning of my career, I kept the Chase.
2:42
Speaker 1: And then, as I told you, I still have great
2:44
Speaker 1: friends in Houston and the great love of the city.
2:47
Speaker 1: And it's all part of who I am, what part
2:50
Speaker 1: of who you are has been a person that uh,
2:52
Speaker 1: Like I said, my first shitcom job was with Steve
2:55
Speaker 1: Harvey on UH, I think it was ninety three on
2:57
Speaker 1: ABC Me and the Boys, And then I did Parents
3:00
Speaker 1: Who with Robert Towns. And in the meantime, you were
3:04
Speaker 1: already breaking grounds for a very successful career. And let's
3:09
Speaker 1: talk about because you started out the law I started
3:12
Speaker 1: out at IBM. I was an IBM degree is in mathematics,
3:15
Speaker 1: so I can kind of relate to an extreme change
3:18
Speaker 1: because mine was math. These shows was a law and
3:20
Speaker 1: it kind of correlates with the you know, contracts and
3:23
Speaker 1: the business side that goes along with being an executive
3:26
Speaker 1: producer and a person who runs things behind the scenes.
3:30
Speaker 1: Talk about that transition first, about the law experience and
3:33
Speaker 1: then transmition into Hollywood. Sure, well, I, um, you know,
3:38
Speaker 1: my beloved late dad was the biggest film and television
3:43
Speaker 1: buff that I ever knew, And so I grew up
3:46
Speaker 1: in a household where we watched films and we watched
3:49
Speaker 1: TV together, and I was that kid that went to
3:51
Speaker 1: the movie theater every Saturday and stayed until you know,
3:57
Speaker 1: my mother came to get me. But I didn't know
4:00
Speaker 1: anybody in the business. I didn't know anybody, certainly anybody
4:03
Speaker 1: who looked like me that was behind the scenes in Hollywood.
4:07
Speaker 1: And so I went to law school because you know,
4:09
Speaker 1: I needed to prepare myself for the world. And you know,
4:12
Speaker 1: I went to Harvard Law School and and I started
4:14
Speaker 1: practicing law at big firms and big corporations. And I
4:18
Speaker 1: was a really good lawyer, but I didn't love it,
4:21
Speaker 1: and I just figured, you know, if I'm gonna work
4:24
Speaker 1: this hard, I should go after my dream, which was
4:28
Speaker 1: to make film and television. So, uh, you know, and
4:33
Speaker 1: when and when I left remember because I was in
4:35
Speaker 1: New York at the time and I was working at
4:37
Speaker 1: Avon Products, and my friends were like, oh, you'll be back,
4:40
Speaker 1: You'll be back. When I was like, I'm gonna give
4:43
Speaker 1: this my best shot. Here I am now he was
4:47
Speaker 1: interesting because I'm gonna skip around a little bit because
4:49
Speaker 1: I want to definitely get back to the equalizer and
4:51
Speaker 1: didn't talk about your career. Roughly. I was reading this
4:53
Speaker 1: article I think it was in uh, Hollywood Reporter, and
4:56
Speaker 1: it was talking about roughly six years ago. You know,
5:00
Speaker 1: the landscape was kind of frustrating for you, and you
5:03
Speaker 1: were considering other options other than entertainment. Am I correcting
5:06
Speaker 1: what I was reading? Yeah? Absolutely, And so at that
5:09
Speaker 1: point law was looking like an option again, and then
5:13
Speaker 1: I certainly considered it. You know, I got in this
5:16
Speaker 1: business because when I was growing up, I did not
5:20
Speaker 1: see people on screen who looked or felt like me,
5:24
Speaker 1: and so I wanted to break down stereotypes. I wanted
5:28
Speaker 1: to to create images that would empower us and would
5:33
Speaker 1: help people to understand that, you know, they had the
5:35
Speaker 1: power to do whatever they wanted to do in life
5:38
Speaker 1: and to and to make their own dreams come true.
5:41
Speaker 1: And there was a period in Hollywood and you know
5:45
Speaker 1: where you know, people weren't interested in making movies about women,
5:50
Speaker 1: about people of color. It was all about the big
5:53
Speaker 1: temp pole movies and and and action movies. And I
5:57
Speaker 1: would walk into offices and people's eyes with glaze over
6:02
Speaker 1: when I told them, you know what I was thinking
6:04
Speaker 1: about and I and so then you just start throwing
6:06
Speaker 1: stuff up against the wall that has no meaning. And
6:11
Speaker 1: that's not how I work, that's not to me, that's
6:13
Speaker 1: that that is not the road to success. And so
6:17
Speaker 1: I was kind of I got to the point where
6:18
Speaker 1: I said, well, you know, maybe the universe is telling
6:20
Speaker 1: me that, you know, you've had a good run, but
6:23
Speaker 1: maybe it's time to think about doing something else. Honestly,
6:28
Speaker 1: this is a good story and it's true. And I
6:31
Speaker 1: spent about a year just talking to people because I
6:36
Speaker 1: had the luxury of being at Disney. Um, you know,
6:39
Speaker 1: I had my company based at Disney for you know,
6:42
Speaker 1: twenty years, and and I was thinking about what I
6:45
Speaker 1: should do and where I should go. And Vernon Jordan's
6:49
Speaker 1: you know who we just lost, had been a friend
6:52
Speaker 1: and an advisor of mind since I was eighteen years old.
6:55
Speaker 1: His his his daughter's one of my best friends. And
6:58
Speaker 1: and I went to go see burn it is I
7:00
Speaker 1: often did, and I told Vernon how I was feeling,
7:03
Speaker 1: and I was thinking about doing other other things, maybe
7:06
Speaker 1: going back to practice law. And Vernon heard me very
7:10
Speaker 1: calmly listen to me pour my heart out, and he
7:12
Speaker 1: looked at me and he said, you know you're too
7:13
Speaker 1: old to do anything else. You need to need to
7:16
Speaker 1: figure out you've invested a lot in the film and television,
7:20
Speaker 1: and figure out how to make that work. And he
7:23
Speaker 1: was right. You know, it's really interesting that because you know,
7:27
Speaker 1: when I left IBM, and you know the whole thought process.
7:30
Speaker 1: You can go back, you know, you you you've mastered
7:33
Speaker 1: the corporate space. That's always an option, but it really
7:36
Speaker 1: is about moving forward. That's all least telling you going
7:39
Speaker 1: back with it? Well, why, well, what's there? A lot
7:41
Speaker 1: more confusion, a lot more unknown when you're great, you're
7:44
Speaker 1: fantastic now. But that was just one conversation. But what
7:47
Speaker 1: happened that really set you forward in a positive direction
7:51
Speaker 1: that yes, I can do this again. Yes this is
7:54
Speaker 1: what I've been born to do, this is what this
7:56
Speaker 1: is my dream. This is combination of realizing that there
8:02
Speaker 1: were stories that I still very much wanted to tell,
8:06
Speaker 1: and frankly that the business as I was going through
8:09
Speaker 1: my kind of soul searching process, the business started changing
8:14
Speaker 1: and Hollywood finally realized what you and I have been
8:18
Speaker 1: telling it for and many others have been telling it
8:20
Speaker 1: for years, that diversity was not just the right thing
8:24
Speaker 1: to do, but that it was good business. And once
8:26
Speaker 1: Hollywood figured out that there was money that was being
8:29
Speaker 1: left on the table by not you know, telling stories
8:33
Speaker 1: about people of color, that you know, people of all ethnicities,
8:38
Speaker 1: you know, white people, black people, Asian people would go
8:41
Speaker 1: see good stories about people of color and about women,
8:46
Speaker 1: it opened up the door. And now it's mean, you know,
8:51
Speaker 1: it's still we still a long way to go, but
8:54
Speaker 1: my god, I mean, look at the number of movies
8:56
Speaker 1: that have been made in the last few years. Look
8:57
Speaker 1: at what's going on in TV. It's really exciting. And
9:02
Speaker 1: so it's funny. And it took me about six years
9:05
Speaker 1: to get Harriet made. And Harriet kind of covered that
9:09
Speaker 1: territory from the beginning where people are like, oh, historical
9:13
Speaker 1: movie about a black woman, I don't know to you know,
9:18
Speaker 1: towards the end it was like, oh, yes, you know,
9:20
Speaker 1: hidden figures that happened and I did a lot of money.
9:23
Speaker 1: It was like they could see the potential of telling
9:25
Speaker 1: an action story about a woman of color. You know.
9:29
Speaker 1: It's really interesting because you know, because you were like me,
9:32
Speaker 1: we were there that I'm a writer, your producer, you're
9:33
Speaker 1: a writer too. And so from that standpoint, we went
9:37
Speaker 1: through that whole reality series, you know, where black people,
9:40
Speaker 1: especially black women, were not featured in a very favorable manner, fighting, cussing,
9:46
Speaker 1: drinking party and and so this hair out. Oh my god.
9:50
Speaker 1: So so with that process, I know, you had to
9:53
Speaker 1: be really sick to your stomach that that period right there.
9:56
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying reality shows have changed that much,
9:59
Speaker 1: but now we have ramas and comedies and docuseris allows
10:02
Speaker 1: us to give us solid balance and tell black stories better.
10:06
Speaker 1: But that period, because I was doing the Neighborhood Awards
10:08
Speaker 1: with Steve Harvey and we would we couldn't even get
10:11
Speaker 1: really presenters because there weren't any black celebrities on TV
10:15
Speaker 1: or in the business. It was really a dark period.
10:17
Speaker 1: And so from a creative standpoint, I know what led
10:20
Speaker 1: you to that thought process because guess what, Hollywood wasn't
10:23
Speaker 1: even trying to put the scripted idea in a black
10:26
Speaker 1: person's hand at all. Like I said, literally, I can't.
10:29
Speaker 1: I'm sitting here as I'm talking. I can remember the
10:31
Speaker 1: meetings where people's eyes they just with glaze over, They
10:33
Speaker 1: just like had no appreciation for for you know what
10:37
Speaker 1: I was talking about, and no interest now you know,
10:41
Speaker 1: and part of and you know, and frankly, one of
10:44
Speaker 1: the things is Los Angeles is a very segregated city.
10:48
Speaker 1: And I think that, you know, while the rest of
10:51
Speaker 1: the country was more integrated and kind of embracing different cultures,
10:59
Speaker 1: l A was slow to come to the table to
11:02
Speaker 1: understand that that many people are interested in the stories
11:06
Speaker 1: of all people. Now let's let's let's get back to
11:09
Speaker 1: you know why you really came on this show. You
11:11
Speaker 1: come on to the show to talk to Rochelle. You
11:13
Speaker 1: got this hit shell on TV called The Equalizes and
11:16
Speaker 1: with Queen Latifa. Uh now, I'll ask you this for
11:20
Speaker 1: My first question is premier after the Super Bowl. Okay, okay,
11:25
Speaker 1: Devil Okay, devil, You've done a lot of great things
11:27
Speaker 1: in your life. Okay, certain phone calls come to you,
11:30
Speaker 1: You're like, you got to be kiddy. When how did
11:33
Speaker 1: that started, that opportunity break for you and how did
11:36
Speaker 1: you react? Where were you at when they told you
11:38
Speaker 1: that your series was gonna premiere, was gonna be out
11:41
Speaker 1: to the super funny we were We were shooting because
11:44
Speaker 1: we we are we are well. We are based at
11:48
Speaker 1: the Eyad Center at the Meadowlands in New Jersey. This
11:51
Speaker 1: is below me or is the arena floor, and our
11:55
Speaker 1: standing sets are there. My office here is a skybox
11:59
Speaker 1: at the ead Center. We do some exteriors in New York,
12:04
Speaker 1: but we shoot a lot in New Jersey. That night,
12:07
Speaker 1: we were in Bayonne, New Jersey, at an oil supply field.
12:13
Speaker 1: That was nasty. It was freezing cold, and I got
12:17
Speaker 1: this text from the head of drama at Universal Television saying,
12:21
Speaker 1: you know, um, we need to have a call immediately
12:24
Speaker 1: with CBS. You know, can you get the other executive
12:28
Speaker 1: producers together in in in fifteen minutes? And we were
12:31
Speaker 1: like okay, and we really didn't know what the call was.
12:34
Speaker 1: We were like, oh my god, you know over budget
12:37
Speaker 1: you know like that, and uh, George Cheeks, who is
12:44
Speaker 1: the head of CBS, was on the call and he said, guys,
12:47
Speaker 1: are good news for you. We believe in this show.
12:49
Speaker 1: We believed in it from the very beginning, and we're
12:52
Speaker 1: putting you after the Super Bowl and we were just like,
12:54
Speaker 1: oh my, you know, it's like, oh my god, Um,
12:57
Speaker 1: it's huge. It was huge. It was huge, you know.
13:01
Speaker 1: And I saw the premier and after following the series
13:04
Speaker 1: every since, and you know, when it was announced, you know,
13:07
Speaker 1: we had Denzel and they had the original series and
13:10
Speaker 1: Queen latif you know, because I know the role has
13:13
Speaker 1: some type of physicality tied to it if you want
13:15
Speaker 1: to have some type of credibility. And so my original
13:18
Speaker 1: thought was, canque the teeth for handing the physicality tied
13:22
Speaker 1: to this role? And I'm telling you from the pilot
13:27
Speaker 1: series on where she walked in that uh whatever room
13:30
Speaker 1: where the where the young lady was taken in and
13:32
Speaker 1: the chief yeah, yeah, and she broke off to the gun,
13:36
Speaker 1: kicked him in the corner, shot him and walked out
13:38
Speaker 1: of that went Okay, this is a hit serious right here.
13:41
Speaker 1: This is a hit serious because you know, everything is
13:43
Speaker 1: tied to credibility, and to me, that was the credibility
13:47
Speaker 1: moment for me in this series and walking through that
13:49
Speaker 1: whole process of bringing Queenlitief on board talking about the
13:53
Speaker 1: physicality and horizon to the occasion. Yeah, so funny. So
14:00
Speaker 1: our show at the you know, the Denzel movie franchise
14:04
Speaker 1: is great and it's been enormously successful. They took the
14:09
Speaker 1: basic idea and and and built from there. Our show
14:14
Speaker 1: is based on the original nineteen eighties show. Those are
14:18
Speaker 1: the rights that we have and um so I but
14:22
Speaker 1: you know, Dana and I go way back. We actually
14:25
Speaker 1: actually shot Just Right, partial portions of Just Right, the
14:28
Speaker 1: movie we did together here at the Eyes Ought Center,
14:30
Speaker 1: which is really you know, great symmetry. And I've been
14:33
Speaker 1: trying to get back in business together and I brought
14:36
Speaker 1: her in to have a meeting with Universal TV, where
14:38
Speaker 1: I have my deal and Perlina the Bokway, who was
14:42
Speaker 1: the head of You TV then is now the head
14:44
Speaker 1: of the Universal Studio group. An amazing you know black
14:47
Speaker 1: woman was there and she said, you know, Cleen On,
14:51
Speaker 1: but we have a few ideas for you, like we
14:55
Speaker 1: want to talk to you about And the first one
14:56
Speaker 1: was was Equalizer and honest they Uh, there was a
15:01
Speaker 1: moment of silence, and then Dana said yes, like like,
15:06
Speaker 1: and I think everybody in the room could see her
15:10
Speaker 1: in the role. It just made sense. And then, you know,
15:14
Speaker 1: we we have amazing showrunners Terry Miller and Andrew Marlowe,
15:19
Speaker 1: and they and our other executive producers, we all got
15:22
Speaker 1: the role was built for her. We spent a lot
15:26
Speaker 1: of time talking about what the show should be, what
15:29
Speaker 1: the role should be. You know. Then Queen Latifa spent
15:33
Speaker 1: time on her own with the creators of the show,
15:36
Speaker 1: so they really got a sense of her and her
15:38
Speaker 1: voice and crafted a character that reflected who she was,
15:43
Speaker 1: her essence, her strength and and and her beauty. But
15:48
Speaker 1: you know, from the very beginning, it was really important
15:51
Speaker 1: to all of us and and really important to Queen
15:54
Speaker 1: Latifa to your point, that the action be credible. She's like,
15:58
Speaker 1: I got you know, I got a I got a brand,
16:01
Speaker 1: I got an image. I cannot go out there half big.
16:05
Speaker 1: So she trained, we have experts that she works with
16:09
Speaker 1: with the for the guns and those fight sequences. She
16:14
Speaker 1: does a lot of it herself. Uh, and she's great.
16:17
Speaker 1: It's great. I think it's great. And obviously she rides
16:20
Speaker 1: motorcycles in real life, so that we put that in
16:23
Speaker 1: there because we knew that was organic to her. Well,
16:26
Speaker 1: you know the thing about it is, first of all,
16:28
Speaker 1: you said beauty, beautiful. You know everybody got h D
16:32
Speaker 1: four K, five K whatever I'm looking at. I look
16:35
Speaker 1: at that show that go she looks fantastic. She is
16:39
Speaker 1: absolutely a beautiful woman. I'm going, by the way, you're
16:44
Speaker 1: very beautiful as well. You look fantastic as well. I
16:47
Speaker 1: figure out what cream y'all doing over that set so
16:50
Speaker 1: I could just roll up in that little Jersey said
16:52
Speaker 1: can you put some over shaw? Because I looked at
16:55
Speaker 1: because I'm going like because that you know that that
16:57
Speaker 1: that captured me in the pilot and every episode is
17:01
Speaker 1: how great she looks. Skin looks fantastic, and that carries
17:06
Speaker 1: carries over, I think into the way she carries herself
17:09
Speaker 1: through the series. You know, she carries herself as a
17:11
Speaker 1: very confident person, that she has the issues with a daughter,
17:14
Speaker 1: which humanizes her. It makes her vulnerable and makes her
17:18
Speaker 1: not feel so perfect. Is that if you know in
17:20
Speaker 1: the streets precisely the point and because what she Robin
17:26
Speaker 1: McCall represents most women who have to balance career and
17:31
Speaker 1: family and personal life. Now obviously in this case it's
17:35
Speaker 1: you know, she's former CI agent who's you know, kicking
17:38
Speaker 1: butt on a regular basis. But it's just, you know,
17:42
Speaker 1: it's it's exaggerated by TV turn but it's a real
17:45
Speaker 1: it's a real balancing act that every woman does it juggling,
17:50
Speaker 1: and I think that is what makes her very relatable
17:53
Speaker 1: to both men and women. Men are juggling too, you know,
17:56
Speaker 1: our our lives are complicated, and so we like to say,
18:01
Speaker 1: you know, she can take down the baddest criminal, but
18:03
Speaker 1: she can't. It's hard for her to stand up to
18:05
Speaker 1: her sixteen year old thoughts. And that's that's the beauty
18:10
Speaker 1: of when you when you're building our characters and then
18:13
Speaker 1: and you've been known for developing characters and making sure
18:17
Speaker 1: the characters are flushed out, and that's what I appreciate
18:20
Speaker 1: that because I hate to not watching the movie and
18:22
Speaker 1: I'm not engaged or the character doesn't get me emotionally
18:25
Speaker 1: attached to their problems. And that's really what really is
18:29
Speaker 1: one of the one of the true successes behind the
18:31
Speaker 1: equal lines are correct. Yes, yeah, because she's a fully
18:36
Speaker 1: fleshed out human human being woman us you'll see. You know,
18:41
Speaker 1: we've got romance coming and everything else. But yes, I mean,
18:44
Speaker 1: I believe character comes first because if you can relate
18:48
Speaker 1: to the people, then you're then you will take any
18:51
Speaker 1: journey with them. And and honestly, that's something may have
18:54
Speaker 1: always been a storyteller and I you know, it was
18:56
Speaker 1: a voracious reader growing up. But also you know, I
18:59
Speaker 1: ran until Washington's company early on in my career, and
19:03
Speaker 1: that was one of the things I learned from him,
19:06
Speaker 1: was how to approach things from the character perspective. And
19:10
Speaker 1: uh and and I you know, it is how I live. Now.
19:14
Speaker 1: You get this big opportunity every coming into twenty twenty one,
19:16
Speaker 1: I'm gonna have a conversation about COVID nighteen and the
19:19
Speaker 1: production and how you wrapping up because you know, medical safety,
19:23
Speaker 1: safety or the cast and safety of the production team
19:26
Speaker 1: is is what what in the beginning and what moments
19:29
Speaker 1: that have allowed you to have more freedom now in
19:33
Speaker 1: the production of the show. Their equalizer. Well, listen, it's
19:37
Speaker 1: been a challenge. It's a challenge for for everybody who's
19:40
Speaker 1: in production right now. It's enormously expensive. I test every day,
19:46
Speaker 1: as does a significant portion of our crew and certainly
19:50
Speaker 1: anybody who comes in contact with the actors, because the
19:53
Speaker 1: actors are you know, there's no show without the actors.
19:57
Speaker 1: But they're the most vulnerable because they have to work
20:00
Speaker 1: with no masks on. So we've got um, you know,
20:07
Speaker 1: and and and and everything is slower, you know, location
20:11
Speaker 1: scouting is slower. You know the fact that everybody has
20:15
Speaker 1: to test takes time out of your day. Um you've
20:18
Speaker 1: got you know, we've got masks and shields on all
20:22
Speaker 1: day long. So funny we always laugh and say, at
20:24
Speaker 1: some point, you know, we're gonna be able to take
20:27
Speaker 1: these off and we won't recognize each other because seeing
20:31
Speaker 1: most of my crew without a mask on. So it's ok.
20:36
Speaker 1: And and also, you know, particularly in the beginning, because
20:39
Speaker 1: we started shooting November nine, when it was a different time,
20:42
Speaker 1: there was no vaccine. Yet people are scared and so
20:47
Speaker 1: that you know, they're nervous and and they're nervous about
20:50
Speaker 1: being I mean, most of us have gone from being
20:53
Speaker 1: in our homes relatively isolated with a little bubble too.
20:57
Speaker 1: I work with two hundred people every day in an arena,
21:01
Speaker 1: which is a luxury in these times. But you know,
21:05
Speaker 1: in the beginning, people were scared and nervous and like,
21:07
Speaker 1: oh my god, am I gonna you know, it's just
21:09
Speaker 1: am I gonna get sick? So um Universal, NBC. Universal
21:14
Speaker 1: has been incredibly responsible and CBS and safety has really
21:19
Speaker 1: come first. But it's tough. You know, the thing about
21:22
Speaker 1: it is that when I look at you know, we
21:24
Speaker 1: talked about our frustrations and seeing you know, scripted and
21:28
Speaker 1: black storytelling cast aside for reality. And then but I
21:33
Speaker 1: think that it was really help us is the streaming industry,
21:36
Speaker 1: streaming television there they're the need for content. And then
21:40
Speaker 1: when the content was presented, we delivered talk about the
21:44
Speaker 1: the change in the shifting industry and how it has
21:47
Speaker 1: impacted in a very good way black programming absolutely and
21:54
Speaker 1: kind of the fundamental differences. The movie studios have moved
21:58
Speaker 1: to making tent pole movies that appeal to the widest
22:03
Speaker 1: possible audience globally, and that's that's how they justify their
22:09
Speaker 1: you know, their cost structure and how they make money.
22:12
Speaker 1: The network television similarly, is making shows that appeal to
22:17
Speaker 1: the widest possible audience and that appeal globally, so you're
22:23
Speaker 1: not you know, to find distinctive voices to support those
22:28
Speaker 1: in those environments is really hard, whereas streaming, on the
22:31
Speaker 1: other hand, is more about niche marketing. And so you
22:36
Speaker 1: can have uh, you know, Insecure, which was on HBO,
22:41
Speaker 1: but still you know, cable cable and streaming which because
22:47
Speaker 1: it doesn't you know, doesn't have eight million viewers every week,
22:50
Speaker 1: but has a very loyal following and is a hint
22:54
Speaker 1: in that sense because it's all they just you know,
22:57
Speaker 1: the streamers and and premium cable are about subscribers. So
23:01
Speaker 1: if they can if a show appeals to a certain
23:05
Speaker 1: you know, subscriber piece of the of the base and
23:08
Speaker 1: they are loyal followers, that's that's what their businesses to
23:12
Speaker 1: build up those different audiences into one great audience. So
23:16
Speaker 1: it's hugely beneficial to diverse storytellers. It really is personal,
23:21
Speaker 1: like you were saying, HBO and Insecure and not in
23:23
Speaker 1: the HBO Max, which is their streaming affiliated. Really they're
23:26
Speaker 1: building that out more than they're building out HBO because
23:29
Speaker 1: of the content can be found on HBO Max. And
23:31
Speaker 1: the beauty of what I like about there were about
23:34
Speaker 1: the whole world of streaming is that you know, from
23:37
Speaker 1: a movie movie movie selling, if you're a black lead,
23:41
Speaker 1: it was going to be domestic. They wouldn't even walk
23:43
Speaker 1: internationally with you, and so in a self fulfilling prophecy,
23:48
Speaker 1: right right, and so, but you like, I'm just using
23:51
Speaker 1: Netflix as an example, or hundred in any countries. So
23:54
Speaker 1: when they premiere a black project on Netflix, it premieres
23:58
Speaker 1: and a hundred and ninty count tree. So there's no
24:01
Speaker 1: discrimination about the content and everybody gets an equal chance
24:05
Speaker 1: to enjoy the product. And I really feel that that's
24:08
Speaker 1: where we're going with it. And that's when I say,
24:11
Speaker 1: my have times change and my have chimes change is
24:14
Speaker 1: really tame. It's really tied to the content avenues that
24:17
Speaker 1: we get to tell our stories. And it's great people
24:19
Speaker 1: like you, Devil Martin Chase that are telling it. They've
24:25
Speaker 1: changed signs chased tremendously, and I can't. I think it's
24:29
Speaker 1: it's it is. It is the streaming and cable and
24:32
Speaker 1: and and a different appetite and the demand for content. Mean,
24:36
Speaker 1: you know, content is needed across the board, and it's
24:42
Speaker 1: realization that people will you know that white people will
24:46
Speaker 1: watch shows with the Black League. I mean Shonda, you know,
24:50
Speaker 1: her shows are really important in in the dynamic of
24:54
Speaker 1: all this because raising Anatomy came on with the fabulously
24:58
Speaker 1: diverse Castle was a hit and people say, Okay, you know,
25:03
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be just one one that one
25:05
Speaker 1: black person. It can be black people in major roles.
25:09
Speaker 1: Then Scandal, Scandal was huge because you know, it was
25:15
Speaker 1: like the second show on network TV that had a
25:20
Speaker 1: pale black lead, and in ABC was nervous at first,
25:25
Speaker 1: but to the credit, now you had Shonda, you had
25:27
Speaker 1: Channing Dungee was there that was had a drama, and
25:30
Speaker 1: you have the fact that that Olivia Pope was loosely
25:33
Speaker 1: based upon Judy Smith, the very successful black crisis publicist,
25:38
Speaker 1: so it was hard not to cast a black woman
25:40
Speaker 1: and that was a huge success. And then it kind
25:42
Speaker 1: of went from there. So it's look, I'm just I'm
25:46
Speaker 1: happy that I'm still in the in the business right
25:49
Speaker 1: now to take advantage of where we are right now. Well,
25:52
Speaker 1: first of all, you are fantastic. I want to thank
25:55
Speaker 1: you for coming on the series Money Making Conversation to
25:57
Speaker 1: talk the Equalizer starting Queen the Tea for every Sunday,
26:01
Speaker 1: you gotta hit you on your hand every Sunday, eight
26:04
Speaker 1: o'clock after sixty minutes CBS again US we are you know,
26:11
Speaker 1: please keep coming. Thank you so much for everybody for
26:14
Speaker 1: your support. We appreciate it. We're working hard to continue
26:17
Speaker 1: to make a great show. And and thank you well,
26:20
Speaker 1: you know, out out of them on my clothes. And
26:22
Speaker 1: you know, we got the Queen B Beyonce out of Houston.
26:26
Speaker 1: Now we got the Queen C. That's uh devnmont Chase
26:29
Speaker 1: out of Houston. Third War Texas, y'all. Third Queen C. Right,
26:35
Speaker 1: I own on the with Queen C. Yeah, Devernmartin Chase,
26:38
Speaker 1: Third War Texas, y'all. I came from fear for it.
26:41
Speaker 1: So three and five that makes eight. We're good. Thank
26:43
Speaker 1: you for coming on the show. Devernmartin Chase. Thank you
26:46
Speaker 1: so much. This has been such fun talking to you.
26:49
Speaker 1: You're great. Yeah, I love it. And until Queen the Thief,
26:51
Speaker 1: we've been trying to get on Steve Harmy, I mean
26:53
Speaker 1: Steve and stephen A's World because we would because we
26:56
Speaker 1: want to help promote the show. So we're gonna reach
26:58
Speaker 1: out again. It was definitely we're gonna reach out again.
27:01
Speaker 1: And because she had it was a conflict in the schedule,
27:03
Speaker 1: but we definitely want to promote your brand because Steven,
27:06
Speaker 1: Stephen Stephen A is a big fan of your devil,
27:09
Speaker 1: a tremendous fan of Quinnity for in any way I
27:11
Speaker 1: can promote positive Black projects, and this is an amazingly
27:15
Speaker 1: great black project hewned by an amazing Black iconic figure
27:20
Speaker 1: and entertainment industry named Devon Martin Chase. Thank you, thank
27:24
Speaker 1: you so much, thank you. It's finally here, the season
27:28
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Speaker 1: E R dot Ai. We will be right back with
29:25
Speaker 1: more money Making Conversations with your host, Rashan McDonald. Him
29:29
Speaker 1: Rushan McDonald, the host of Money Making Conversation. The Cafe
29:32
Speaker 1: Moca Swag Award is a celebration of black men who
29:34
Speaker 1: are making a difference in our community by empowering others
29:38
Speaker 1: to reach their life goals, from civic leaders, businessmen, activists,
29:41
Speaker 1: celebrities and everyday dads. The Cafe Moca Swag Award winner
29:45
Speaker 1: this week is Dendre with Field. He is an Emmy
29:49
Speaker 1: nominated veteran TV and film actor. His new book, Mail
29:52
Speaker 1: Versus Man is a game changer. Dandre's goal is to
29:55
Speaker 1: help readers understand how the definition of manhood has changed
29:58
Speaker 1: and to transform else so they can obtain man status.
30:02
Speaker 1: Our manhood is directly tied to our dedication to being
30:10
Speaker 1: a servant leader, serving the women and children in our lives.
30:14
Speaker 1: I talked about in the book how every man has
30:17
Speaker 1: to be the walking tree of his house and community.
30:21
Speaker 1: So a treat sees us, a treat gives us shelter.
30:23
Speaker 1: The tree allows us to breathe better. That's the job
30:26
Speaker 1: of every man for every woman. And child in his life.
30:30
Speaker 1: The Cafaine Morpas Swag Award represents men who have strength,
30:33
Speaker 1: whose wisdom is assertive, and who is genuine in their spirit.
30:37
Speaker 1: Welcome back to money making conversations with your host Rashan McDonald.
30:42
Speaker 1: My next guest is truly an industry decision maker. His
30:45
Speaker 1: name is Harvey Mason Jr. He probably serves as the
30:48
Speaker 1: Chairman of the Board of the Recording Academy also known
30:51
Speaker 1: as the Grammys, and he has also stepped in the
30:53
Speaker 1: role of interim President CEO for the Recording of Academy.
30:56
Speaker 1: Let's give a little background Mr Harvard here. He is
30:59
Speaker 1: not only paying it produced songs for industry legends like
31:01
Speaker 1: Aretha Franklin, Michael Jackson, When the Houston, Mariah Carey, but
31:05
Speaker 1: He's all In, Elton John, but also for today's superstars
31:08
Speaker 1: including Justin Beaver, Beyonce John, Legend Are the Grand Day,
31:12
Speaker 1: Justin timber Lake, and Chris Brown. In addition, he's compiled
31:15
Speaker 1: in the present list of film and TV credits, including
31:18
Speaker 1: writing and producing the music for Jesus Christ Superstar Lives.
31:21
Speaker 1: It's just a few of them. I'm not gonna name
31:23
Speaker 1: at all. Jingle Jangle, Christmas Story, Christmas Journey, Joey's Extraordinary Playlist,
31:28
Speaker 1: Shrek Straight out of Compton, All three Pitch Perfect Movies,
31:32
Speaker 1: The Grammy Awards of Music's Biggest Night, and the six
31:35
Speaker 1: or three Grammy Awards are Aaron on Sunday, March fourteenth,
31:38
Speaker 1: at a PM Easter Standard time on CBS. What can
31:41
Speaker 1: we expect? That's why I have them on the show
31:43
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about his life. How the extraordinary
31:45
Speaker 1: guy like him can be sitting in the background looking
31:48
Speaker 1: so good. Please wipe in the money making conversation. My man,
31:51
Speaker 1: Harry Mason Jr. How are you doing, sir? Doing well?
31:55
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me. Excited to be
31:57
Speaker 1: here chairing the board Chairman of the board of the
32:00
Speaker 1: Recording Academy. What does that? What does that mean? Well,
32:04
Speaker 1: it means that some people that were the trustees of
32:07
Speaker 1: the Academy thought that I would be good to push
32:10
Speaker 1: the Academy forward into the next generation of what this
32:14
Speaker 1: academy looks like, and they voted for me, So we
32:16
Speaker 1: have forty four trustees. I ran as chair on a
32:20
Speaker 1: platform of change and improvement to the Academy, which I
32:23
Speaker 1: felt we needed a lot of, uh, you know, I've
32:25
Speaker 1: been a member of the Recording Academy for probably, I
32:28
Speaker 1: don't know, fifteen sixteen years, so I've seen a lot
32:31
Speaker 1: of the great things that it does, all the amazing
32:32
Speaker 1: programs and work that it does around philanthropy and giving
32:36
Speaker 1: back to the music community, but also advocacy and fighting
32:39
Speaker 1: for the rights of creators and music people, and then education,
32:42
Speaker 1: making sure that we're getting instruments and hands of kids
32:45
Speaker 1: in the next generation of music makers, and continuing to
32:48
Speaker 1: expose people to music. So those are things I loved
32:50
Speaker 1: about the Academy. There are a few things that I
32:52
Speaker 1: thought we could do better, and so I ran for
32:53
Speaker 1: chair and they voted for the congradulations. Uh. You know,
32:57
Speaker 1: I have a little music background. In middle school, I
32:59
Speaker 1: was the first clearing that second share of tennis saxophone
33:04
Speaker 1: and uh. And I got to high school, you know,
33:06
Speaker 1: you know, I got too cool for music, got too
33:09
Speaker 1: cool for the band, and I left the band. Never
33:11
Speaker 1: too cool for the band. I thought I was hard
33:14
Speaker 1: after I thought but you know the thing about it
33:16
Speaker 1: is that I would tell everybody music really focused me
33:21
Speaker 1: and really helped with my memorization. And so when you
33:24
Speaker 1: start talking about going into the community and and and
33:27
Speaker 1: having the children to understand the value of music, playing music,
33:31
Speaker 1: singing and understand it. Really I always tell there's a
33:34
Speaker 1: big asset. Can you tell everybody the contributions that not
33:37
Speaker 1: only just from being able to play the music, but
33:39
Speaker 1: from my life and from an educational standpoint, how music
33:43
Speaker 1: can really evolve a child's life. I guess that's a
33:48
Speaker 1: I mean, it's a good question. It's probably one that
33:50
Speaker 1: a scientist or or or psychiatrists could probably answer even
33:54
Speaker 1: better than I can. But I know personally what music
33:57
Speaker 1: does for me is similar to as you said, it
33:59
Speaker 1: helped to find balance, find a center. Absolutely creates a
34:06
Speaker 1: sense of emotional connection or relatability to people. Like if
34:11
Speaker 1: you're writing a song, where you're listening to a song
34:13
Speaker 1: that's been composed, you see that other people have felt
34:16
Speaker 1: what you felt you you see that other people have
34:18
Speaker 1: gone through things that you've gone through. So there's something
34:21
Speaker 1: there that's reassuring, that's something that's identifiable and relevant to
34:24
Speaker 1: a lot of different people's lives. So music can be
34:26
Speaker 1: served as uh, something that can can heal and can help.
34:30
Speaker 1: And that's a little bit of what I love about
34:32
Speaker 1: being involved in the Academy is I try and use
34:35
Speaker 1: music in our platform with the Grammys to make sure
34:37
Speaker 1: we're doing good and we're doing good work, we're bringing
34:39
Speaker 1: people together, especially with our show this March. You know,
34:42
Speaker 1: this is gonna be the first time in a long
34:44
Speaker 1: time that maybe a lot of people have come together
34:46
Speaker 1: around music. So my hope is this it can be
34:48
Speaker 1: some medicine. It can be something that uh starts to heal.
34:51
Speaker 1: And the last year has been a tough year for everyone,
34:54
Speaker 1: as you know, especially people in the music industry. So
34:57
Speaker 1: my hope is that music, as you said earlier, can
34:59
Speaker 1: be something of a positive and be something that's not
35:02
Speaker 1: just entertaining but also healing and and improves the lives
35:05
Speaker 1: of people who who are fans of it and who
35:08
Speaker 1: love it. I have nothing but positive things about what
35:11
Speaker 1: happened in my life. How did you drag a tennis
35:14
Speaker 1: saxophone a mile to my junior high school, middle school
35:17
Speaker 1: and drag it back? And I would tell everybody that
35:21
Speaker 1: anybody who plays the trumpet is amazing to me, and
35:24
Speaker 1: anybody who plays the flute is amazing to me, because
35:27
Speaker 1: it's always all about the lips, all about the curvature.
35:30
Speaker 1: And I put that read on that clarinet put that
35:32
Speaker 1: read on it. I was good. I was good. Squeeze
35:34
Speaker 1: real Hall knew that the fingers working, I was. I
35:37
Speaker 1: was your man. But I respected the flute is and
35:40
Speaker 1: and and and the trumpet player that was That's a skill.
35:42
Speaker 1: What's your what's your skill level? From a from a
35:44
Speaker 1: technical standpoint, instrument standpoint, Well, I played piano and when
35:49
Speaker 1: I played drums and percussion, a little little bit of
35:52
Speaker 1: bass and a few other things, but my main instruments
35:54
Speaker 1: that I write and produce on his piano. Now, it's
35:58
Speaker 1: the interesting thing about it because I ran off a
36:00
Speaker 1: lot of talent. You know Pop, you know Justin Bigger
36:03
Speaker 1: got him in my car. You know just In Timber
36:05
Speaker 1: that got him in my car. I got you know, Beyonce.
36:08
Speaker 1: I'm from Houston. I by my background with Beyonce, uh
36:11
Speaker 1: nineteen two, I introduced in my comedy club, one of
36:14
Speaker 1: the first people to recognize destinity talent as a group.
36:17
Speaker 1: So we go way back personally, all those different talent
36:21
Speaker 1: levels that you how do you walk in the room
36:23
Speaker 1: and how do you create that relationship? You know, not
36:26
Speaker 1: to mention the legends of Michael Jackson and Arita Franklin
36:29
Speaker 1: and Elton John but all these people on my playlists,
36:34
Speaker 1: so it means that you have a sense from the
36:35
Speaker 1: type of music here that I have. So but each
36:39
Speaker 1: one of these people have a certain style that they
36:41
Speaker 1: want to bring to the table. They don't want to
36:42
Speaker 1: be a copycat, So how do you how do you
36:45
Speaker 1: introduce yourself to that to their talents? Each person is
36:50
Speaker 1: slightly different, but in general I try and enter with
36:53
Speaker 1: a sense of humility but also confidence because number one,
36:57
Speaker 1: I'm I'm highly respectful of people who create art. I
37:00
Speaker 1: think people who I've gotten a chance to work with
37:02
Speaker 1: their absolutely amazing and incredible talents and are very special
37:05
Speaker 1: for their talents. But I also know that, uh, they
37:10
Speaker 1: need collaboration and they look for people that can bring
37:14
Speaker 1: the best out of them. And as a producer and
37:16
Speaker 1: a songwriter, that's really been my goal throughout my career
37:18
Speaker 1: is to try and regardless of who I'm working working
37:21
Speaker 1: with and try and elevate or to try and make
37:24
Speaker 1: their performance be the best performance they've ever given, whether
37:27
Speaker 1: that's you know, Aretha Franklin or a new artist like
37:29
Speaker 1: Chris Brown that we started with when he was fourteen
37:32
Speaker 1: years old. Fifteen years old. So my goal is always
37:34
Speaker 1: to be humble, be respectful, appreciative of the opportunity to
37:39
Speaker 1: work with with new artists as well as legacy artists,
37:41
Speaker 1: but then also come with the confidence and a spirit
37:44
Speaker 1: of collaboration so that we can work together because what
37:46
Speaker 1: I do, I feel is also special and what I
37:48
Speaker 1: can bring to the table hopefully can be helpful to
37:52
Speaker 1: them and their performance. So that's generally how I do it.
37:55
Speaker 1: Sometimes it's easier than others. You know, you're dealing with
37:57
Speaker 1: artists that are the legacy, the legend artists. They they've
38:01
Speaker 1: been doing it for a long time, sometimes thirty forty years,
38:04
Speaker 1: and uh, they look at you as the new young
38:07
Speaker 1: kid who thinks he's hot stuff. And sometimes those are challenging,
38:11
Speaker 1: But it's really about breaking down, uh, those types of
38:14
Speaker 1: barriers and preconceptions and letting the people know that my
38:18
Speaker 1: interest is only having them shine. My interest is not
38:22
Speaker 1: about me shining. And that's the job of producer. You've
38:24
Speaker 1: got to make sure that they trust you and feel
38:26
Speaker 1: that your interests are aligned. And I guess that's why
38:29
Speaker 1: I've had a fairly long career. I've been able to
38:32
Speaker 1: gain the trust of artists and make sure artists feel
38:35
Speaker 1: like there's no agenda. It's not about Harvey trying to
38:38
Speaker 1: look good. It's about Michael or about Whitney or whoever
38:41
Speaker 1: I'm working with, making sure they give their best performance
38:44
Speaker 1: and their fans are saying, oh my gosh, where did
38:46
Speaker 1: this song come from? This artist that I love so much? Really,
38:49
Speaker 1: it's really interesting because you you mentioned earlier talents piano,
38:53
Speaker 1: so was it Is it easy to work with a
38:56
Speaker 1: talent like and Elvin John or John Legend who strength
38:59
Speaker 1: is at the I don't know. It doesn't matter. Working
39:03
Speaker 1: with any really talented person is pretty easy because it
39:06
Speaker 1: flows and they're contributing so much. I try and contribute
39:10
Speaker 1: what I can. And whether it's piano that's their main talent,
39:13
Speaker 1: or it's just a vocalist or a guitar player, it's
39:16
Speaker 1: as I said, it's collaboration, and great talent is generally
39:20
Speaker 1: in favor of strong collaboration. And I found in my
39:23
Speaker 1: experience that the Legends are all very open if you
39:27
Speaker 1: come with good ideas, and again you don't come with
39:29
Speaker 1: a personal agenda, and if your goal is to make
39:32
Speaker 1: them shine, whether that's John Legend, Elton John, whoever it is,
39:36
Speaker 1: they're going to be excited about the collaboration. I really
39:39
Speaker 1: want to if I can't get your head because I'm
39:41
Speaker 1: a visual person, Harvey. And so when I when I
39:44
Speaker 1: see when I see how Michael Jackson, I just see movement.
39:47
Speaker 1: I see justin Timber, I see a movement, I see
39:50
Speaker 1: Rita Frank and I just see right there commanding the stage.
39:53
Speaker 1: Same thing with what you Houston, right there commanding the
39:56
Speaker 1: state from a Do you look at music from a
39:58
Speaker 1: visual standpoint or is oh audio? It's a unique question. Uh,
40:05
Speaker 1: I don't really tend to study. I'm not as cerebral
40:09
Speaker 1: as maybe you're thinking about it. I try and go
40:12
Speaker 1: off of emotion and feeling, and I also try and
40:15
Speaker 1: pay attention and really close attention to the person I'm
40:17
Speaker 1: working with or working for. As you said a couple
40:20
Speaker 1: of names. If I'm doing a you know, a Beyonce song,
40:24
Speaker 1: it's gonna be very different from a song that I
40:25
Speaker 1: might do for Aretha. So you have to be cognizant
40:28
Speaker 1: of who their audience is and what that artist has
40:31
Speaker 1: done in the past. So for me, it's not visual,
40:34
Speaker 1: it's not thinking about concerts um and it's not just
40:38
Speaker 1: or you're not just hearing it it's really a combination
40:41
Speaker 1: of everything put together. And I'm thinking of it more
40:43
Speaker 1: from the standpoint of who is the artist, who is
40:46
Speaker 1: their audience, what is their history, what have they talked
40:49
Speaker 1: about in the past, what are they going through in
40:50
Speaker 1: their life now? And trying to weave all that into
40:53
Speaker 1: a song. And that's a lot. And when I when
40:55
Speaker 1: I look at the Grammys, which has always been like,
40:58
Speaker 1: because I mentioned earlier Recording Academy and do you have
41:01
Speaker 1: the Grammys? How did the two names become associated with
41:05
Speaker 1: each other. Well, they are one and the same. The
41:07
Speaker 1: Recording Academy UH is sometimes referred to as the Grammys.
41:12
Speaker 1: The Recording Academy is the overall not for profit organization
41:15
Speaker 1: five oh one C three corporation that is built to
41:20
Speaker 1: host the Grammys and then hosting the Grammys that is
41:23
Speaker 1: a television show on CBS. We receive income from the
41:26
Speaker 1: television show and that money goes directly back into the
41:29
Speaker 1: music community. That's why we're not for profits. So our
41:32
Speaker 1: objective in our mission is to serve our members. We
41:34
Speaker 1: have over twenty thou members who are professional music creators
41:37
Speaker 1: from you know everything, producers, engineers, songwriters, managers, some lawyers,
41:42
Speaker 1: so those are our members we put on the Grammy Show.
41:46
Speaker 1: Through the Academy, we receive income and then that goes
41:49
Speaker 1: back out. I talked a little bit about Music Cares.
41:51
Speaker 1: You know, during COVID this year, we had so many
41:54
Speaker 1: music people lose their income, lose their ability to even
41:56
Speaker 1: make an income. So Music Care is because of some
41:59
Speaker 1: of the money that we out in over the years
42:00
Speaker 1: from our TV show along with fundraising efforts, we've been
42:04
Speaker 1: able to give out over twenty two million dollars to
42:07
Speaker 1: people who needed help during COVID, and that effort continues
42:10
Speaker 1: and that's just one of the things we do through
42:12
Speaker 1: the Academy and through our not not for profit organization.
42:14
Speaker 1: The other we talked about was advocacy, So having the
42:18
Speaker 1: ability and the resources to be in Washington, d c.
42:21
Speaker 1: Actually on the ground they're talking to lawmakers. Making sure
42:24
Speaker 1: that music people are taking into consideration for legislation is
42:27
Speaker 1: something that we do and we're very very passionate about
42:30
Speaker 1: and we spend a lot of time and energy making
42:32
Speaker 1: sure that we're doing that. So this year that the
42:34
Speaker 1: Cares Act, the Hits Act, these are all acts that
42:36
Speaker 1: give some relief to our country. But now thanks to
42:39
Speaker 1: the Recording Academy and other people musicians and people who
42:43
Speaker 1: make and create music are included in these relief packages.
42:46
Speaker 1: So something that we do during these times and all
42:48
Speaker 1: fall under the Recording Academy umbrella. That's that's really amazing.
42:53
Speaker 1: That's really a blessing as well, because during the COVID
42:56
Speaker 1: and A live events basically shut down. It was shut down.
42:59
Speaker 1: They still haven't recovered in and and maybe this summer
43:02
Speaker 1: or maybe in the far we can started getting back there.
43:04
Speaker 1: But you're a writer, you're a producer, you're so there's
43:07
Speaker 1: a term out there called mailbox money, which means that
43:10
Speaker 1: you're making money while you sleep. That had to be
43:12
Speaker 1: a blessing concertainty that the catastrophe that it was going
43:17
Speaker 1: on in the in the live events side, to be
43:20
Speaker 1: a writer still receiving some formal income. Am I correcting
43:23
Speaker 1: saying that you're partially correct. Actually we love mailbox money.
43:28
Speaker 1: But the thing is, and what's happened as of the
43:30
Speaker 1: last few years, a mailbox money has continued to decrease
43:33
Speaker 1: and it's almost deteriorating because of the way legislation plays
43:37
Speaker 1: out and allowing streaming companies to continue to use our
43:40
Speaker 1: intellectual property in our art at such a low pay rate,
43:43
Speaker 1: so we are barely monetizing songs at this point as
43:46
Speaker 1: far as the songwriter has concerned. If you're an artist
43:50
Speaker 1: or your record company, there's some good royalties that can
43:52
Speaker 1: still be generating, and you're still getting that mailbox money
43:55
Speaker 1: you're talking about. But as a producer and a songwriter,
43:58
Speaker 1: those numbers are you know, they're a little bit in flux.
44:00
Speaker 1: And that's one of the things the Academy has been
44:02
Speaker 1: doing is making sure that we're advocating in DC, making
44:05
Speaker 1: sure we're jumping up and down talking about creators and
44:08
Speaker 1: the creator's rights and what should they be paid and
44:11
Speaker 1: how can they monetize what they you know, sweat and
44:15
Speaker 1: bleed for, which is our music. In our craft, we
44:17
Speaker 1: make these songs. They don't just come out of thin air.
44:20
Speaker 1: Actually they do come out of thin air, but they
44:21
Speaker 1: don't just magically appear. We work, and we we studied
44:26
Speaker 1: the practice. We perfect our craft sometimes for twenty thirty
44:29
Speaker 1: years in order to make music and make songs, and
44:32
Speaker 1: then sometimes it goes onto different platforms and there's not
44:35
Speaker 1: a compensation for that. So the mailbox money is getting scary,
44:39
Speaker 1: it's getting more and more scarce um. And it's not
44:42
Speaker 1: the fault of the streaming companies. We believe the streaming
44:45
Speaker 1: companies are great partners. They're exposing so much amazing music
44:49
Speaker 1: to the general population and to consumers, and it's giving
44:52
Speaker 1: the consumers a chance to choose and be exposed to
44:54
Speaker 1: so many different types of music they might never hurt,
44:56
Speaker 1: might not have ever heard before. But we have to
44:59
Speaker 1: figure out some equitable way to make sure that people
45:02
Speaker 1: who create this art and spend the time making the
45:05
Speaker 1: music that we all love and enjoy, continue to be
45:08
Speaker 1: able to make the mailbox money. Otherwise people are gonna
45:11
Speaker 1: have to get other jobs and other sources of income,
45:13
Speaker 1: and and it will decrease the number of people that
45:15
Speaker 1: are really making the great art that we all appreciate. Wow,
45:18
Speaker 1: the Grammy Awards is the money maker is music. The
45:21
Speaker 1: biggest night is the six or thirty Grammy Awards. Is
45:23
Speaker 1: Aaron on Sunday, March fourteen, a p m. Or CBS.
45:27
Speaker 1: What can we expect? You can expect an amazing show
45:31
Speaker 1: and you can expect great performances, nothing like you've seen
45:36
Speaker 1: during COVID. You know, we're doing things very differently. This
45:38
Speaker 1: is not a virtual show. Okay, this is not people
45:40
Speaker 1: sending in videos of them performing either at their house
45:43
Speaker 1: or at some different location. These are people that are
45:46
Speaker 1: performing on the Grammy stage in Los Angeles. Uh. You'll
45:50
Speaker 1: see live awards. You won't see a large audience, unfortunately.
45:54
Speaker 1: But I'm really excited. You're gonna see a beautiful set,
45:57
Speaker 1: beautiful staging and set decoration. Uh. And I think it's
46:01
Speaker 1: gonna be, as I said earlier, a bit of an
46:03
Speaker 1: opportunity to come together and celebrate music as much as
46:06
Speaker 1: celebrating fields. Maybe slightly awkward right now because there's so
46:09
Speaker 1: much hardship and so many things happening that put us
46:13
Speaker 1: at at unrest and and in a in a state
46:15
Speaker 1: of uncertainty. But I think this will be a time
46:18
Speaker 1: for some rebirth. And that's a little bit of the
46:20
Speaker 1: theme of some of our our elements of this show
46:23
Speaker 1: and are coming together and feeling good around music. We
46:26
Speaker 1: know the thing about it. I want to say celebrations.
46:29
Speaker 1: I want to stick with that, Harvey, because you know
46:31
Speaker 1: we've been locked down. Uh. You know, my wife, she's
46:33
Speaker 1: still not comfortable going out to a restaurant. She we
46:36
Speaker 1: have not been out the restaurant since COVID lockdown, and
46:39
Speaker 1: and and and and so you know, she goes out
46:42
Speaker 1: to the store. We're wearing masks. There's a there's a
46:44
Speaker 1: there's a life of not being comfortable, life not being
46:47
Speaker 1: normal to see an amazing show like the Grammys, somewhere
46:52
Speaker 1: returning to his live performance format, because all we've seen
46:55
Speaker 1: is these zoom type set ups, so you know, virtual somewhere,
46:59
Speaker 1: the train stay astion, but Nora AND's not nowhere in
47:01
Speaker 1: the facility. As a unified show, I think it's really important.
47:05
Speaker 1: How did you guys get to that point of production
47:07
Speaker 1: to say this is the type of show we're going
47:09
Speaker 1: to do. We're not going to do the traditional remote performances,
47:13
Speaker 1: and they just packaged together. Well, it's something we always
47:17
Speaker 1: hoped for, you know. Originally when this started, we said, well,
47:19
Speaker 1: we'll just keep our fingers crossed and hopefully we can
47:22
Speaker 1: have our show as normal. But as we got closer
47:24
Speaker 1: and closer to January, we knew we weren't going to
47:26
Speaker 1: be able to do the big Staples Center with seventeen
47:29
Speaker 1: thousand people. So we changed and pivoted and made an
47:32
Speaker 1: adjustment to what we thought was the expected best thing,
47:35
Speaker 1: which was bringing the artists together and have being a
47:38
Speaker 1: show that they actually came to l A and performed. Uh.
47:41
Speaker 1: And we've got a great new director this year, executive
47:44
Speaker 1: producer of the show. Ben Winston's executive producer, and he's
47:48
Speaker 1: had an incredible vision for this show. You know, we
47:51
Speaker 1: had our our last executive director or rather executive producer,
47:56
Speaker 1: Kennerlick for the last I think board the shows that
48:00
Speaker 1: did amazing work for us over the years. But having
48:02
Speaker 1: a different um producer has really brought a different look
48:06
Speaker 1: to the show and a different kind of energy and
48:08
Speaker 1: a different approach to it. So I have to say
48:10
Speaker 1: that a lot of what's happening on March fourteenth is
48:13
Speaker 1: because of Ben Winston and his vision and his plan
48:16
Speaker 1: for doing something original and different. Well, you know, the
48:19
Speaker 1: Grammy serves several purposes for me when I get to
48:22
Speaker 1: see Live Entertained, but also artists who win, you can
48:25
Speaker 1: see their record sales or digits. Say, oh, digital sales
48:29
Speaker 1: or whatever term they're using that that you know, you
48:31
Speaker 1: just do use the word album. They don't make albums
48:34
Speaker 1: technically anymore. Yeah, they're streaming numbers. They're streaming numbers can
48:38
Speaker 1: go off. So being a nominee and being a winner
48:42
Speaker 1: and being a live performer, are really also a presenter
48:45
Speaker 1: can all the major blessings as far as being a
48:47
Speaker 1: part of the Grammy Awards. Correct, Yes, it's a great
48:50
Speaker 1: platform for the creators and for artists songwriters, and as
48:55
Speaker 1: you said, being exposed on the show can have huge
48:57
Speaker 1: benefits for record labels or for the companies that put
49:00
Speaker 1: out this music, and for the artists themselves. But for us,
49:03
Speaker 1: it's an opportunity to showcase a lot of different great music.
49:06
Speaker 1: It's an opportunity to celebrate excellence and shine a light
49:10
Speaker 1: on the people that our voters felt had outstanding projects
49:13
Speaker 1: this year. And it's also a chance for us, and
49:16
Speaker 1: I hate to be cross about it, but it's a
49:17
Speaker 1: chance for the Academy to generate some income so that
49:20
Speaker 1: we can do the programs that we're so passionate about,
49:23
Speaker 1: and we can't give back to the music community the
49:25
Speaker 1: infrastructure set up at the Academy, And it's one thing
49:28
Speaker 1: that happens. You know, a lot of people are critical
49:30
Speaker 1: about the awards, so who gets nominations, who gets to win,
49:33
Speaker 1: Why didn't this person get nominated? And I respect and
49:35
Speaker 1: totally understand that I've been snuggled myself at the time
49:38
Speaker 1: when I thought I should have gotten nominated and didn't.
49:40
Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, I tend to
49:43
Speaker 1: look at it from a perspective of this show is incredible,
49:45
Speaker 1: it's amazing, it's so important, but it's also a vehicle
49:48
Speaker 1: that allows us as an academy to generate income so
49:52
Speaker 1: that we can do the really, really important work that
49:54
Speaker 1: we do in the industry, to be helpful and to
49:56
Speaker 1: to stand up programs that change and effect the future
49:59
Speaker 1: of our business and hopefully the future and generation of
50:02
Speaker 1: music makers that are coming into into this community. It's
50:06
Speaker 1: amazing my conversation having with you because I'm exposing you.
50:09
Speaker 1: I'm talking to Harvey Mason Junior. He's the Chairman of
50:11
Speaker 1: the Board of the Recording of the Academy and the
50:13
Speaker 1: interim President CEO, also known as the Grammys, which will
50:17
Speaker 1: be are airing on Watched four teen on CBS and
50:19
Speaker 1: a p M eased to standard time. I want to
50:21
Speaker 1: get back to you because you're a special catman. I
50:23
Speaker 1: mentioned the songs that you pinned, but the television and
50:27
Speaker 1: film side, I gotta let people know who you are. Man,
50:31
Speaker 1: I'm saying, I want them to google. You have realized
50:33
Speaker 1: that you are truly a gifted guy because a lot
50:35
Speaker 1: of people can be good at one thing. Because to me,
50:37
Speaker 1: what you're doing is like watching the Lebron James play
50:40
Speaker 1: football and basketball. Because you know, I'm you. You got
50:45
Speaker 1: to and please do use chairman of the board. Come
50:48
Speaker 1: on now, you big your big boss and so and
50:51
Speaker 1: I just see that because you know, I want to
50:52
Speaker 1: see straight out of Compty all three pitch perfect moves,
50:55
Speaker 1: which I loved, you know, Jingo Jango one of my
50:58
Speaker 1: favorite the problem that the first film since The Wiz
51:01
Speaker 1: from a Black Christmas Uh Musical, which was amazing. Good
51:06
Speaker 1: friend of mine, David Tabo and his wife I interviewed
51:09
Speaker 1: on on the show, and I and and and it
51:11
Speaker 1: trended a lot on Netflix. When you start looking at it,
51:15
Speaker 1: looking at these types of productions, because you know, straight
51:17
Speaker 1: out the company was wrapped. Jingo Jango was a was
51:20
Speaker 1: a Christmas Yeah, Zoe's extraordinary. That's a that's a dramatic
51:23
Speaker 1: when they just sing on television. How do you That's
51:27
Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. How did you start balancing all that?
51:29
Speaker 1: Those are different genure, just like it is with the artists.
51:33
Speaker 1: But this is even more because it's different songs that
51:36
Speaker 1: play off on a different moments that in and our
51:38
Speaker 1: ques talked to us about first television then film. Well,
51:44
Speaker 1: the television side, you know, your timelines are very tight.
51:46
Speaker 1: Things are done quickly. It's week to week and so
51:49
Speaker 1: every day you're doing something different, it's by the end
51:51
Speaker 1: of the week, it's approved and the end of the show.
51:54
Speaker 1: So it's being nimble, it's being creative, it's problem solving
51:57
Speaker 1: really quickly. Uh. And I think it's a lot of
52:00
Speaker 1: different genres of music. As you mentioned, you know, we've
52:02
Speaker 1: done it's always extraordinary playlist for two years. I think
52:05
Speaker 1: last season we did seventy or eighties songs for that,
52:09
Speaker 1: and we're doing another show for Apple TV where we're
52:11
Speaker 1: doing twenty or thirty songs. Uh. And doing those series.
52:15
Speaker 1: It's a lot of work and it's quick paced. As
52:17
Speaker 1: far as the film side, you know, we're doing a
52:20
Speaker 1: movie right now called Respect. It's the biopic about Arita
52:23
Speaker 1: Franklin starring Jennifer Hudson. I'm very excited about. And the
52:27
Speaker 1: difference with film the TV is you have more time
52:29
Speaker 1: you're I've been working on that film for two years,
52:32
Speaker 1: so it's really about fine tuning, perfecting everything that you're doing,
52:37
Speaker 1: Every piece of music, every note is looked at and
52:40
Speaker 1: relooked at by the producer, of the director of the studio,
52:44
Speaker 1: the music team. So it's a lot of inspection of
52:46
Speaker 1: almost everything that you're doing. That is a major difference.
52:49
Speaker 1: But the similarities are you're trying to use music to
52:53
Speaker 1: tell a story. You're trying to use music as a
52:56
Speaker 1: character in the show or the film, and you're trying
52:59
Speaker 1: to evolve the story the plot generally with the song
53:01
Speaker 1: or with lyrics. So I've been very fortunate to be
53:04
Speaker 1: able to work across different genres and different types of
53:07
Speaker 1: artists throughout my career and record making, but as well
53:09
Speaker 1: in film and TV. Because it's all music, you know,
53:12
Speaker 1: stuff that I loved. I love classic, I love rock,
53:15
Speaker 1: I love rap, R and B pop, country. We do
53:18
Speaker 1: it all because for me, it's all just different expressions
53:21
Speaker 1: of different emotions through different genres. So I've been very
53:24
Speaker 1: fortunate to get a chance to work with a really
53:27
Speaker 1: wide variety of people in genres. Cool. Now, before we go,
53:31
Speaker 1: I want to ask you about this. Always with the Grammy,
53:33
Speaker 1: I know how powerful with the gramm muse is because
53:35
Speaker 1: people use nominations as part of their credit. So they've
53:38
Speaker 1: been nominated by a Grammy for a Grammy, they're gonna
53:41
Speaker 1: mention it is part of their credits. How does one
53:43
Speaker 1: get in that nomination process? This is Is it a
53:46
Speaker 1: board somewhere? Is it a set of music experts? How
53:51
Speaker 1: does one get nominated for a Grammy Award? Sure? The
53:55
Speaker 1: good thing is our our Grammy rules and voting is
53:58
Speaker 1: published online. Everything is very public and you can you
54:01
Speaker 1: can google it and find these rules out much better
54:03
Speaker 1: than I'll describe it too. But again, we have a
54:07
Speaker 1: voting membership. We have membership for the Academy's twenty thousand
54:10
Speaker 1: or so members, and then we have twelve thousand of
54:12
Speaker 1: those members are what we call voting members, and the
54:14
Speaker 1: voting members. In order to get that distinction, you have
54:17
Speaker 1: to be a creator. You have to be a songwriter,
54:19
Speaker 1: a producer, engineer, artist, somebody who's actually involved in the
54:23
Speaker 1: creation of the music. If you are deemed that by
54:26
Speaker 1: the Academy, you are called a voting member. Those twelve
54:29
Speaker 1: thousand voting members take all the submissions. Anybody who makes
54:33
Speaker 1: music and submit through the label or through a member,
54:36
Speaker 1: or or submit a song or a record or project
54:39
Speaker 1: all those come in. This year we had twenty two
54:41
Speaker 1: thousand submissions. It's the most submissions we've ever had. The
54:44
Speaker 1: twelve thousand voters look through all the submissions and vote
54:47
Speaker 1: on their favorites. The favorites are narrowed down. Then we
54:50
Speaker 1: have a group of nominations Committee Review that goes and
54:54
Speaker 1: they take they take every song, and they listen to
54:57
Speaker 1: the top twenty or so songs. And generally the Nomination
55:00
Speaker 1: Review Committee is made up of experts in each genre.
55:03
Speaker 1: So each different genre has a specific committee that reviews
55:07
Speaker 1: the voters choices. So if you're talking about folk music,
55:11
Speaker 1: you have fifteen or twenty folk music experts listening to
55:15
Speaker 1: the finalist voted on by the voting membership. At that point,
55:19
Speaker 1: the committee will establish who the five or eight nominations
55:23
Speaker 1: go to, because in some categories there's five. In the
55:25
Speaker 1: general field there's eight. Once those nominations are determined, then
55:29
Speaker 1: those names go back out to the voting body, and
55:32
Speaker 1: the voting body besides who the winner is. So it's
55:36
Speaker 1: a combination, to answer your question even more simply, of
55:38
Speaker 1: the general voting body of twelve tho voters, the nomination
55:42
Speaker 1: Review Committee, and then Finally, again, the voting body determines
55:45
Speaker 1: who the winners are. Awesome. Um, speaking to Harvey Mason Jr.
55:49
Speaker 1: I know I said that comparison with Lebron James because
55:52
Speaker 1: he did not play football, I would give you even
55:54
Speaker 1: better with my good friend Dion Sanders because he was
55:57
Speaker 1: talented and a Hall of Fame and football and he
56:00
Speaker 1: played in the World Series in baseball. And that's what
56:02
Speaker 1: you're doing. You're not only a talented writer, but the producer.
56:06
Speaker 1: You're doing television, doing film, You're doing individual orders, crossing
56:09
Speaker 1: all genres. You truly are a superstar behind the mic
56:13
Speaker 1: and as well as sitting down at the piano. Harvey,
56:15
Speaker 1: thank you for allowing me to ask my questions about
56:18
Speaker 1: the Grammys. Let my audience here from a from a
56:20
Speaker 1: very strong success story and hopefully start googling you and
56:23
Speaker 1: uh and start following on social media because you truly
56:26
Speaker 1: are Start Thank you for coming on money making conversations.
56:29
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, great to be here. Appreciate you
56:31
Speaker 1: having man all right there, don't forget the Grammys is Sunday,
56:35
Speaker 1: March fourteen, on CBS A p M. Did you know
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Speaker 1: you by the Act Council. Welcome out in the shoes.
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Speaker 1: Hi everyone, i'l roker here as a guy with his
57:40
Speaker 1: own catchphrase. I appreciate that Smokey's only said only you
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Speaker 1: can prevent wildfires, but I'm filling it because there's a
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Speaker 1: to you by the U. S. Forest Service, your state Forrester,
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Speaker 1: and the AD Council. My next guest is a combination
58:10
Speaker 1: celebrity and the industry decision maker. He's a Jason George.
58:14
Speaker 1: He started in the midseason return of Station nineteen that
58:16
Speaker 1: airs on Thursday, martching leven a PM Eastern Standard Town
58:20
Speaker 1: on ABC. George is also known for his work as
58:22
Speaker 1: a regular Mistress's Eve Off Center and Eli Stone, as
58:26
Speaker 1: well as films which is of East East, East End,
58:29
Speaker 1: Excuse Me, The Climb, and Barbershop. After several years on
58:32
Speaker 1: Grads and Natomy as Dr Ben Warren, George turned in
58:35
Speaker 1: this gross for Firefighter Gear when his character helped start
58:38
Speaker 1: to spin off hit action drama series Station nineteen about
58:41
Speaker 1: heroic firefighters. Now, George moved seamlessly between both series. When
58:46
Speaker 1: we talked about his career from comedy the soap operas
58:48
Speaker 1: to Drawma to actions, venture and acting in production during
58:52
Speaker 1: COVID ninteen, Please love. Welcome to a man I've seen
58:54
Speaker 1: many many years, always from Afar. Always wanted to cast
58:57
Speaker 1: him on my shows, but he was always working. Jason George,
59:04
Speaker 1: Oh good, good good when I say that, man, you know,
59:06
Speaker 1: because we all I know, I started writing back at
59:09
Speaker 1: eighty two on my first sitcom on ABC with Steve Harvey,
59:13
Speaker 1: and then I went to uh the Robert Townsend and
59:16
Speaker 1: then I did all seen it was ABC sc Grades
59:18
Speaker 1: the Great absolutely and but all the time I saw
59:21
Speaker 1: you working. He was always busy. And I like to
59:24
Speaker 1: believe that you you've had a working man's career, which
59:27
Speaker 1: is a blessing because of the fact it's a testament
59:30
Speaker 1: to your talent. But this is not what you wanted
59:32
Speaker 1: to do. Was supposed to do. Law was supposed to
59:35
Speaker 1: be your your destiny. Correct, Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's exactly it. Um.
59:40
Speaker 1: I had gotten with the Vice Prince on my high
59:42
Speaker 1: school was but you know, I was like, I was
59:45
Speaker 1: a good student, but I was also a cut up.
59:47
Speaker 1: So I'd be like getting good grades, but in detention
59:49
Speaker 1: all the time the Vice Prince will be like, why
59:52
Speaker 1: you want to be you know, he was one of
59:53
Speaker 1: the two black men I saw an education at the time.
59:55
Speaker 1: My mother was a teacher where I grew up and uh,
59:57
Speaker 1: and Mr has Settled put me aside and be like,
1:00:00
Speaker 1: why are you make me want to give you attention?
1:00:01
Speaker 1: Why are you trying to get attention all the time?
1:00:03
Speaker 1: And then he would like actually sit there and talk
1:00:04
Speaker 1: to me like I was an intelligent human being and
1:00:07
Speaker 1: then say, you got detention, but you got potential as well.
1:00:10
Speaker 1: And uh, and his son was he passed away my
1:00:13
Speaker 1: senior year. Mr Heisel my vice principle and his son
1:00:17
Speaker 1: was only the second black Supreme Court Justice of Virginia.
1:00:21
Speaker 1: Uh he was, and he was the youngest Supreme Court
1:00:23
Speaker 1: Justice of Virginia had ever had. And his son and
1:00:25
Speaker 1: I got to be good friends, and he became my mentor.
1:00:28
Speaker 1: And basically the plan was, you go to college, you
1:00:30
Speaker 1: get the grades, I'll write the recommendation, get you into
1:00:32
Speaker 1: the best law school we can get you into. You
1:00:34
Speaker 1: come back to clerk for me, and then you're a
1:00:36
Speaker 1: made man as a lawyer in the state of Virginia,
1:00:38
Speaker 1: and your done career ahead of you. And then I
1:00:41
Speaker 1: went to college and took an acting class and it
1:00:43
Speaker 1: all went to help. I had I called an audible
1:00:47
Speaker 1: change of the plan. And I never told my father
1:00:50
Speaker 1: that I was gonna go to UH graduate school to
1:00:52
Speaker 1: study acting because my father was checked out for a bit.
1:00:55
Speaker 1: My mom and I had a really beautiful conversation about it,
1:00:57
Speaker 1: and then I had to talk to the judge. Uh
1:01:00
Speaker 1: you was still one of the big male role moods
1:01:02
Speaker 1: of my life. And I had to tell the judge
1:01:04
Speaker 1: and it was a stone cold silence on the phone
1:01:06
Speaker 1: for a minute. He was he was not feeling it. Um.
1:01:09
Speaker 1: Unfortunately it worked out. Years later, signed some autographs for
1:01:12
Speaker 1: some people in this office and we were cool. But
1:01:15
Speaker 1: you know, so, Jason, It's really interesting because when I
1:01:17
Speaker 1: when I talked about individuals like you who sometimes people
1:01:21
Speaker 1: see a different direction and sometimes people get trapped in
1:01:23
Speaker 1: that direction that people want you to go. And I
1:01:26
Speaker 1: know that I was at IBM DI theree in mathematics,
1:01:30
Speaker 1: and so everybody was happy. They thought that was the
1:01:32
Speaker 1: career path. And I decided one day I want to
1:01:35
Speaker 1: be I want to pursue my career as a stand
1:01:37
Speaker 1: up comedian. So a lot of people looked at me strange,
1:01:39
Speaker 1: how are you gonna walk away from IBM? You have
1:01:41
Speaker 1: a math degree that has nothing to do with telling Joe,
1:01:43
Speaker 1: how will you made that? So I can understand when
1:01:45
Speaker 1: you said there was silence on the phone because that
1:01:48
Speaker 1: wasn't the vision that person had for you. And and
1:01:52
Speaker 1: you encountered that a lot because you do a lot
1:01:53
Speaker 1: of community to work, You work with young people, you
1:01:55
Speaker 1: work with, you try to shape people's lives. Does your
1:01:59
Speaker 1: life come to play when you're giving people advice all
1:02:03
Speaker 1: the time? All the time? I try and tell him say, look, um,
1:02:06
Speaker 1: you gotta you know like you we were talking just
1:02:08
Speaker 1: before the show started. You were saying, you're all good
1:02:09
Speaker 1: actors are good listeners. And I tell folks, part of
1:02:12
Speaker 1: your job as an actor or just as a person
1:02:14
Speaker 1: in life, par don't be the way to finding success
1:02:16
Speaker 1: is you gotta listen for guy's whispering in your ear.
1:02:20
Speaker 1: Uh that all the time that whispers there. What you
1:02:21
Speaker 1: gotta be Uh, You've gotta be quiet enough of times
1:02:24
Speaker 1: that you can hear it, and then you've gotta be
1:02:26
Speaker 1: loud enough of times to make yourself heard. Um. And
1:02:29
Speaker 1: so it's that thing when you realize that this really,
1:02:32
Speaker 1: this thing that everybody else wants for you is not
1:02:34
Speaker 1: what is meant Um, you gotta be then you gotta
1:02:37
Speaker 1: make yourself loud, but you've gotta be quietus be able
1:02:39
Speaker 1: to hear that every once in a while. And the
1:02:41
Speaker 1: reality is, you know, there's a difference between surviving and thriving.
1:02:45
Speaker 1: You know, you don't want to just get by, you
1:02:47
Speaker 1: want to live. And you realize, you know, I remember
1:02:50
Speaker 1: it was years I went to my my cousin's wedding
1:02:52
Speaker 1: back in Louisiana, and uh one of his friends like
1:02:55
Speaker 1: my uh my cousin. He is kind of like his
1:02:58
Speaker 1: little brother him, like his adopted little brother. And this
1:03:02
Speaker 1: dude was, you know, grown men now, and he said,
1:03:04
Speaker 1: what's it like? And I assumed he meant like actor
1:03:07
Speaker 1: and he said and I said, I said, what being
1:03:08
Speaker 1: an actor? He goes now like really enjoying what you
1:03:10
Speaker 1: do because he was he was an accountant, and I was.
1:03:15
Speaker 1: I was knocked out by it. I was like, how
1:03:17
Speaker 1: can you not enjoy like my accountant. The reason why
1:03:21
Speaker 1: my account is my accountant is because this dude's geeked
1:03:23
Speaker 1: out by being able to do his calculator one handed,
1:03:26
Speaker 1: like he loves seeing the numbers backshot, like he enjoys that.
1:03:30
Speaker 1: You don't have to enjoy every aspect of your job.
1:03:32
Speaker 1: Actually nobody does, even actors don't. But you gotta enjoy
1:03:35
Speaker 1: You gotta find something in it that that gets you excited,
1:03:39
Speaker 1: that gets it makes you excited about going to work
1:03:41
Speaker 1: every once in a while, if not every day. And
1:03:43
Speaker 1: then the way he said it, I felt like, if
1:03:45
Speaker 1: there's nothing there, that's that's a problem. Dude. You need
1:03:48
Speaker 1: to reevaluate your life, really because I know that. Like
1:03:51
Speaker 1: when I tell people are have a degree in mathematics,
1:03:53
Speaker 1: you know, I also tell people I don't do my
1:03:55
Speaker 1: taxes because you know that is not what I do.
1:03:57
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying just because I don't know,
1:03:59
Speaker 1: but don't make out no taxes, and I can agree
1:04:01
Speaker 1: with you. What you're saying is that, you know, when
1:04:04
Speaker 1: I look at a life, you know, longevity is really
1:04:06
Speaker 1: interesting when you start looking at decisions that you make,
1:04:09
Speaker 1: and you know, and I don't question any decision I've made, George,
1:04:12
Speaker 1: I I just live it because of the fact that
1:04:15
Speaker 1: it was the next step of opportunity. And if you
1:04:17
Speaker 1: live on regret, then you really you have an interesting
1:04:19
Speaker 1: life that you should sit down and think about it.
1:04:21
Speaker 1: Like your friend, like that person you talked aout who's
1:04:23
Speaker 1: in the account. He's living a life of regret, which
1:04:26
Speaker 1: is also going to spill over into other things, your relationship,
1:04:29
Speaker 1: how you raise your kids and you have to be happy.
1:04:32
Speaker 1: What drives you to keep that sustained that you know,
1:04:35
Speaker 1: you're in shape, you know you you you you you
1:04:37
Speaker 1: you're are working actor? How what? What? What? What sustains you? George?
1:04:42
Speaker 1: You know what's funny is for me, it's there's internal
1:04:46
Speaker 1: motivations in the external motivations. Like external motivations are like
1:04:50
Speaker 1: people telling you to do something, deadlines you gotta do
1:04:52
Speaker 1: and you need some of that. I mean, some of
1:04:53
Speaker 1: that's what keeps you, you know going, you know, uh,
1:04:56
Speaker 1: you know, like so many bolts of that patched on
1:04:58
Speaker 1: the bellies. You're getting a little big down there as
1:05:00
Speaker 1: an external motivation, I mean, you know what we're looking
1:05:03
Speaker 1: for that, But um, the truth is, I enjoy how
1:05:07
Speaker 1: I feel when I exercise. You, I grew up an athlete,
1:05:09
Speaker 1: I was captain on my track team. I grew up
1:05:11
Speaker 1: with you know, friends, you know, you know, and so
1:05:13
Speaker 1: you know, playing football in the backyard on the regular,
1:05:16
Speaker 1: and so that's I just like how I feel when
1:05:19
Speaker 1: I do that. That's the internal motivation is like knowing
1:05:21
Speaker 1: that I can still you know, I'm not twenty five anymore,
1:05:24
Speaker 1: but I like knowing that I can still out run
1:05:27
Speaker 1: some twenty five year olds. I like keeping that side.
1:05:29
Speaker 1: I think that's a good look. I like that look, um.
1:05:32
Speaker 1: And the same thing as like, you know, when I
1:05:33
Speaker 1: discovered acting, it was I discovered things in myself that
1:05:37
Speaker 1: we're interesting to me. And when I play new characters,
1:05:41
Speaker 1: I discovered new things about myself. And so there's an
1:05:44
Speaker 1: internal motivation of what can I find out about me?
1:05:47
Speaker 1: Let's see if I can pull this song. Let me
1:05:48
Speaker 1: see if I can pull that off. And that's the challenge,
1:05:51
Speaker 1: you know, the challenges are that internal motivation, and so
1:05:54
Speaker 1: for me, it's about finding some of those like I know,
1:05:57
Speaker 1: like you know, you want me to get something, you know,
1:05:59
Speaker 1: a script written or paper written or something like that.
1:06:01
Speaker 1: I need a deadline, I mean. But when it comes
1:06:04
Speaker 1: to working out or acting challenges, that's the and I
1:06:07
Speaker 1: guess that's part of the thing as well, when you
1:06:08
Speaker 1: find out, you know, when you're trying to figure out
1:06:10
Speaker 1: what is that thing that you're in love with? If
1:06:12
Speaker 1: you don't need anybody else to push you, because you
1:06:14
Speaker 1: push yourself, you're internally motivated. That's probably the thing you're
1:06:18
Speaker 1: meant to be doing, you know what I mean? If
1:06:20
Speaker 1: you just love looking at the challenging and we're running,
1:06:23
Speaker 1: and then that's the thing that for me, Like, you know,
1:06:25
Speaker 1: I knew a dude when I when I ran track.
1:06:26
Speaker 1: Who you know, you're supposed to draft the people in
1:06:29
Speaker 1: front of you when you running a long distance, you know,
1:06:31
Speaker 1: you know, stay with the packs so you save some energy.
1:06:33
Speaker 1: So he hasn't an energy the end to break out,
1:06:35
Speaker 1: Uh he will. He only had one speed full out,
1:06:38
Speaker 1: full out. He said. If I'm not hitting my personal best,
1:06:41
Speaker 1: what's the point? And I understand the wisdom of both sides,
1:06:44
Speaker 1: but I always kind of feel the heat of what
1:06:46
Speaker 1: he's talking about. I gotta be pushing me at the
1:06:49
Speaker 1: end of the day, so you know, I'm balancing too.
1:06:51
Speaker 1: It's like I may run with the pack for a
1:06:53
Speaker 1: little bit, but then when I break out, it's about
1:06:55
Speaker 1: getting my personal best. So you always gotta be measuring
1:06:58
Speaker 1: yourself and it's gotta be internally it And that's what
1:07:00
Speaker 1: I said in the beginning when I set up the show.
1:07:02
Speaker 1: It's about you know, we read the other people's story,
1:07:04
Speaker 1: but what passion and what drive keeps you going, what's
1:07:07
Speaker 1: your planning, what's your committed effort, And that's what you
1:07:09
Speaker 1: talk about, committed effort. Now, when I look at you,
1:07:12
Speaker 1: let's go over real, Jess, you're a handsome guy. On
1:07:15
Speaker 1: your show, We're gonna get to a good story. It's
1:07:17
Speaker 1: gonna be a good It's not gonna be a you
1:07:22
Speaker 1: can take it and keep it because you've been living
1:07:24
Speaker 1: with it all your life and that's a good thing.
1:07:26
Speaker 1: Now on now on you know Station ninteen, you got
1:07:29
Speaker 1: my board boards culture who I know really well. I've
1:07:31
Speaker 1: been doing boards through all these income. Good looking guy
1:07:34
Speaker 1: and I think he's doing some of his best acting
1:07:36
Speaker 1: on this on this on Station nintel I mean his
1:07:39
Speaker 1: his nuances, his uh, you know, frustration, uh, being a
1:07:44
Speaker 1: guy who has a drug issue, and really showing a
1:07:47
Speaker 1: wrong character. And the reason I say that because a
1:07:51
Speaker 1: lot of casting goes in into how you look, and
1:07:54
Speaker 1: then people will sometimes I give you credit because of
1:07:57
Speaker 1: how you look or use cash for this particular reason.
1:08:00
Speaker 1: And I'm so proud when I see what Boris is
1:08:03
Speaker 1: doing on the Station and the eight team this season
1:08:05
Speaker 1: because of the fact that you know, many years I
1:08:08
Speaker 1: know I would cast him because he was a good
1:08:09
Speaker 1: looking guy. On sitcoms, you know, we need a good
1:08:11
Speaker 1: looking guy in the scene. Okay, let's Boris and he
1:08:14
Speaker 1: could act as well, and he can deal with comedy gliss.
1:08:16
Speaker 1: What point in your brain and your career because I
1:08:18
Speaker 1: remember your Eve he was a good looking guy. He
1:08:20
Speaker 1: was just stuck you know, on Eve, you know, and
1:08:23
Speaker 1: so but that was a good thing because you were
1:08:25
Speaker 1: getting the check and you was accomplished in your task.
1:08:27
Speaker 1: But in the process, you just want a job. So
1:08:30
Speaker 1: with all that being said, what's the ultimate goal? Getting
1:08:33
Speaker 1: the job or being respected for your acting? No, you
1:08:36
Speaker 1: want to be respected for your acting because I always
1:08:38
Speaker 1: looking at like, you know, it's you know, it's like, uh,
1:08:40
Speaker 1: like I tell my kids, you know, like my kids
1:08:42
Speaker 1: are perfectly speaking, good looking kids, and there's some beautiful children,
1:08:45
Speaker 1: and tell him that's your mom and me. That ain't
1:08:47
Speaker 1: got But if you're in shape, that's that you can say.
1:08:49
Speaker 1: That's on you. What you do in school, what you do,
1:08:52
Speaker 1: what you accomplish, what you create, You did that, right,
1:08:55
Speaker 1: I mean, so you know it's like, so for me,
1:08:58
Speaker 1: getting being respected as an is that thing. And so
1:09:01
Speaker 1: when I get things that challenge me that have nothing
1:09:03
Speaker 1: to do with a look or likability. And the fun
1:09:05
Speaker 1: thing is that also wear the spot in in film
1:09:07
Speaker 1: and television where especially in television, where um likability is
1:09:12
Speaker 1: not necessary point. We want interesting, We want interesting like
1:09:16
Speaker 1: they threw boards the whole you know, drug addiction situation.
1:09:19
Speaker 1: And that's when he got a chance to show up
1:09:21
Speaker 1: what he's capable of, because you know, you gotta be
1:09:23
Speaker 1: you gotta get ugly for a second. You gotta go
1:09:25
Speaker 1: to an ugly place, and you gotta do ugly things.
1:09:27
Speaker 1: And I love when I get opporunities to do that.
1:09:29
Speaker 1: I mean, I played uh, you know, you know, war
1:09:32
Speaker 1: veterans who lose limbs, and that's the thing I played,
1:09:36
Speaker 1: you know, I mean everybody forgets that, you know, in barbershop,
1:09:38
Speaker 1: I was you know even I played boyfriend and girlfriend
1:09:41
Speaker 1: in barbershop before we were on the sitcom Eve. You
1:09:44
Speaker 1: know he I was a pretty good guy in barbershop.
1:09:46
Speaker 1: I was a dog, you dog, I was a dog,
1:09:48
Speaker 1: and it was you know, yeah, and playing and playing
1:09:51
Speaker 1: the playing people who break the rules is a lot
1:09:55
Speaker 1: more fun because I don't do that, uh, in your life.
1:10:00
Speaker 1: I don't break rules that I believe in in real life. Um,
1:10:03
Speaker 1: if I don't believe in your rules ever, just keep
1:10:04
Speaker 1: it moving. And you know that's everybody who knows me.
1:10:07
Speaker 1: You know, it's like, uh, you know, it's better. My
1:10:10
Speaker 1: favorite phrase my wife gets frustrated with it is it's
1:10:12
Speaker 1: better to ask for giving us informission. Um. So I'm
1:10:15
Speaker 1: gonna do what I need to do and then I'll
1:10:17
Speaker 1: find out if there's a rule saying I shouldn't do
1:10:19
Speaker 1: it later on. Um. But you know, so if you
1:10:21
Speaker 1: do that in the character, that's that's much more interesting.
1:10:24
Speaker 1: So I'm much more interested in the challenges of acting
1:10:28
Speaker 1: than I am and how I look and that sort
1:10:30
Speaker 1: of thing. And you know, it's like, you know, I
1:10:31
Speaker 1: love working out, I love work, I enjoy exercising, but
1:10:34
Speaker 1: when it feels like it's an expectation, I want to
1:10:37
Speaker 1: go eat a pizza just to like, you know, tell
1:10:39
Speaker 1: people to step back. You know, I'm I'm a little
1:10:42
Speaker 1: contraryan in that way, but I'm not stupid. Enjoyed the
1:10:48
Speaker 1: compliments spite my face. You know, Greg is that great
1:10:50
Speaker 1: anatomy you know you're regular Dr Ben Warren. Then you
1:10:54
Speaker 1: get the call we wanted to, uh, you know, spin
1:10:58
Speaker 1: off in a new seal, you know, guarantees on a
1:11:01
Speaker 1: new series, you know, and uh, how does that? You
1:11:04
Speaker 1: know when they tell you they want you to do this?
1:11:06
Speaker 1: You know, Sean right Rhymes is asking you to do this.
1:11:10
Speaker 1: I'm assuming to make this move. So what were the
1:11:13
Speaker 1: thoughts running through your mind when this process was being
1:11:15
Speaker 1: port Because you have the ability to go between both
1:11:17
Speaker 1: a doctor and a firefighter in this series. Talk about that. Yeah, yeah,
1:11:21
Speaker 1: I mean, look when it first came up for you know,
1:11:23
Speaker 1: when you first get the call that you know, Shanna
1:11:26
Speaker 1: Rhymes ONCES wants to talk to you at five o'tock today,
1:11:28
Speaker 1: you think you think, am I getting fired? Am I
1:11:31
Speaker 1: getting fired? Is this that call? This is that call?
1:11:33
Speaker 1: And then uh, and then we we got on the
1:11:36
Speaker 1: phone and Sean and I have been working together for
1:11:38
Speaker 1: a few years at that point, and in her producing
1:11:41
Speaker 1: part of Betsy Bears is also a good friend and
1:11:44
Speaker 1: and they were like, listen, you know, we're talking about
1:11:46
Speaker 1: doing the spinoff series, and we want Ben to go
1:11:49
Speaker 1: from being a doctor to being a firefighter and the
1:11:52
Speaker 1: Sasan McKee, who created Station nineteen, had written one of
1:11:56
Speaker 1: the last episodes of Raising Anatomy the previous season, and
1:12:00
Speaker 1: in that episode, there was a massive fire at the
1:12:01
Speaker 1: hospital and Ben at the time you find out, was
1:12:04
Speaker 1: definitely afraid of five that you know, dude had a
1:12:07
Speaker 1: phobia of five. It's not not his thing. It was
1:12:09
Speaker 1: not feeling the fire. But he runs back in, grabs
1:12:12
Speaker 1: the firefighters. Bill runs back in to try and save
1:12:14
Speaker 1: a friend, and then when he doesn't die, that a
1:12:16
Speaker 1: drilling junkie thing that they had already established, and Ben
1:12:19
Speaker 1: that he he gets he that he loves the adrenalism
1:12:23
Speaker 1: uh kicks in and he goes after the challenge and
1:12:25
Speaker 1: that's part of what leads to him becoming a firefighter.
1:12:28
Speaker 1: And I didn't realize they were going that road route,
1:12:30
Speaker 1: but it turns out they kind of set it up
1:12:32
Speaker 1: a little bit, you know, I think, you know, for
1:12:34
Speaker 1: me to move in that direction. So I wasn't getting fired.
1:12:37
Speaker 1: I wasn't, in fact, getting a new job and got
1:12:40
Speaker 1: to be on the ground floor of building a new, new,
1:12:43
Speaker 1: new part of the Grazing Anatomy world, a new part
1:12:45
Speaker 1: of Shawna Land, which that's that's the dreams you want
1:12:48
Speaker 1: to be part of, you know, Grazing Anatomy is grazing natomy.
1:12:51
Speaker 1: Long before I came on it was going to be
1:12:53
Speaker 1: grazing natomy long after I left, but I got to
1:12:56
Speaker 1: be part of helping create what Station nineteen was from
1:12:58
Speaker 1: the ground, and so that challenge I was excited about.
1:13:02
Speaker 1: That's it, you know, believe. I was like, but listen,
1:13:03
Speaker 1: you know, I'm still a doctor, so the show to
1:13:07
Speaker 1: come back to be a doctor, right right, you can
1:13:11
Speaker 1: come back and need me, But you know, like it's
1:13:13
Speaker 1: gonna be good though, and it's been great, you know.
1:13:15
Speaker 1: But the interesting thing about that's what we talked about acting,
1:13:18
Speaker 1: and you know, because there's a credibility in each role.
1:13:21
Speaker 1: You know, there's the physicality of being a firefighter in
1:13:23
Speaker 1: Station eighteen, but there's the intellect and the kring and
1:13:26
Speaker 1: the passion and the bedside manner that comes with being
1:13:29
Speaker 1: a doctor. And Gray's anatomy, the dynamics and preparing for
1:13:33
Speaker 1: each role tell us about first grades anatomy and they're
1:13:36
Speaker 1: transitioning over to the physicality of Station n Was it
1:13:39
Speaker 1: a easy transition with the more difficulties on grades anatomy
1:13:42
Speaker 1: as a doctor. I don't know if easy is the
1:13:45
Speaker 1: word I would use. I mean, listen, you know Gray's
1:13:47
Speaker 1: anatomy is you know, you've got language that you're using,
1:13:50
Speaker 1: all the crazy amounts of Latin words and all that
1:13:53
Speaker 1: sort of stuff, which I took that in a little
1:13:54
Speaker 1: bit of high school because when I thought I was
1:13:56
Speaker 1: gonna be a lawyer, I was like, so you know,
1:13:58
Speaker 1: coming them, you know, you say word, you know, like
1:14:00
Speaker 1: you know, I don't remember what any of the words mean,
1:14:01
Speaker 1: but I could say him. I can say him, and
1:14:04
Speaker 1: I know I know how the sounds should come out,
1:14:05
Speaker 1: so I can sound like a doctor real easy. That
1:14:08
Speaker 1: that part came easily to me. And plus the doctors
1:14:10
Speaker 1: are wearing basically pajamas all day. You're in your scrubs,
1:14:13
Speaker 1: your chilling, um day, my my, my. My play cousin
1:14:18
Speaker 1: is a. I lived with him when I first came
1:14:19
Speaker 1: out here. He's an anessey into l A. He's an anesthesiologist.
1:14:23
Speaker 1: I think I saw him outside of scrubs twice in
1:14:26
Speaker 1: three years. Um, you know. And so we do a
1:14:29
Speaker 1: lot of I acting. When you're in surgery, you're standing
1:14:31
Speaker 1: in one spot and a lot of it is your
1:14:33
Speaker 1: your face is covered and you're looking intensely with your
1:14:36
Speaker 1: eyes during the surgery and that sort of thing. So
1:14:38
Speaker 1: it's about getting focuses about turning into a laser beam. Right,
1:14:42
Speaker 1: all the energy that you have is in acting and
1:14:44
Speaker 1: that's all interesting and fun. And but then when you
1:14:47
Speaker 1: go to a station nineteam, just the the outfit you're wearing,
1:14:51
Speaker 1: the turnouts, the fireproof deear that the fire fright is wearing,
1:14:54
Speaker 1: that plays forty five pounds plus another fifteen twenty pounds
1:14:57
Speaker 1: of the oxygen tank that we rock on our back.
1:15:00
Speaker 1: So you got sixty pounds of gear that you're wearing,
1:15:04
Speaker 1: and you've got to get dressed in this gear head
1:15:06
Speaker 1: to toe, zipped up so it's fireproof inside of a minute.
1:15:11
Speaker 1: And the truth is real fire fighters to tell you
1:15:13
Speaker 1: if you take longer than thirty seconds, they're gonna talk
1:15:15
Speaker 1: bad about you. Um So while you technically have a minute,
1:15:18
Speaker 1: if you if you if you're forty seconds, forty five seconds,
1:15:21
Speaker 1: they're like, dude, you don't get to go to the
1:15:23
Speaker 1: fire with me. You got to go to the b
1:15:25
Speaker 1: ships A ship A should get it done in thirty seconds.
1:15:28
Speaker 1: So getting dressed is hard. You know, you understand that
1:15:31
Speaker 1: there's a whole other level of physicality, uh, and that
1:15:34
Speaker 1: I was ready for that. I was ready to bust
1:15:35
Speaker 1: out physically. And so running upstairs and you know I
1:15:37
Speaker 1: told him first out. I was saying, look, I have
1:15:40
Speaker 1: no fear of heights. I love jumping off the stuff
1:15:43
Speaker 1: and dangling from side. I said, so you pretty much
1:15:46
Speaker 1: put me through it. Do it. And so they would
1:15:48
Speaker 1: get mad at me for the first couple of seasons
1:15:49
Speaker 1: because they have a forty ft ladder going up to
1:15:51
Speaker 1: the fourth story of the building and don't tell me
1:15:54
Speaker 1: to climb it if you only want me to climb
1:15:56
Speaker 1: like six steps, and y'all cut because I'll get up.
1:15:59
Speaker 1: You know, I'll be to the second third point. They're like,
1:16:01
Speaker 1: they're yelling, They're like insturments, won't let you do that.
1:16:05
Speaker 1: And I was like, yo, y'all give me a ladder.
1:16:06
Speaker 1: So I'm that's how I was writing on me and
1:16:09
Speaker 1: that's how I get down. So uh, it's definitely a
1:16:12
Speaker 1: different thing. And then trying to find a way to
1:16:13
Speaker 1: bring that intensity into the acting and into the performances
1:16:17
Speaker 1: while still bring it in the fact that these these
1:16:20
Speaker 1: firefighters care so much about the people. That's the fun
1:16:22
Speaker 1: thing is that when you're sending still and talking to
1:16:26
Speaker 1: people over their bed in the hospital, it's easier to
1:16:30
Speaker 1: let that care and come through that emotion that empathy
1:16:32
Speaker 1: come through. But when you're trying to drag somebody out
1:16:35
Speaker 1: of the fire, where you're trying to drag somebody out
1:16:37
Speaker 1: of the situation and carry them over your shoulder, and
1:16:39
Speaker 1: that's where the things you're finding a way to let
1:16:41
Speaker 1: that empathy be seen. Because the reality is if you've
1:16:43
Speaker 1: ever met a firefighter, if you met any of these
1:16:45
Speaker 1: first respondents, they have the biggest hearts. I mean, they
1:16:48
Speaker 1: have gallows humor like doctors do, in the same kind.
1:16:51
Speaker 1: They'll make jokes just like soldiers do. And you know,
1:16:53
Speaker 1: like they'll make jokes that are inappropriate in so many
1:16:56
Speaker 1: ways because they see the worst things in the world.
1:16:59
Speaker 1: But you wanted to see a firefighter and tears in
1:17:02
Speaker 1: their eyes. Let him see when the kid gets hurt,
1:17:04
Speaker 1: um catching when the kid gets hurt. And then you
1:17:07
Speaker 1: realize how big their hearts are. And so that for
1:17:10
Speaker 1: me was or how much they care about each other,
1:17:11
Speaker 1: like uh, the U We had this one one of
1:17:14
Speaker 1: our fire tech consultants showed me this documentary they made
1:17:18
Speaker 1: back when he was in Detroit and he called him
1:17:20
Speaker 1: his fired that he would point to this one gentleman,
1:17:22
Speaker 1: and this is a this is a young white guy
1:17:25
Speaker 1: but his fired dad was his old brother, and this
1:17:27
Speaker 1: old black gentleman h back there and as soon as
1:17:30
Speaker 1: he started talking about him, his eyes get tearing because
1:17:33
Speaker 1: he loves that man so much. He said, he taught
1:17:35
Speaker 1: me about being a firefighter, taught me about being a man,
1:17:38
Speaker 1: taught me about how you know how to survive emotionally
1:17:42
Speaker 1: when you lose people, and that lets the that's the
1:17:46
Speaker 1: thing that emotionally has been the most fun as an actor.
1:17:49
Speaker 1: The physicality is all great and fun, but you need
1:17:52
Speaker 1: to find a way to get that level and depth
1:17:54
Speaker 1: of emotion that these men and women have to come
1:17:57
Speaker 1: out in the middle of all that action. And that's
1:17:59
Speaker 1: been the child that'sk me the most. Some parties, I
1:18:01
Speaker 1: think the writer set us up and I feel like
1:18:03
Speaker 1: the entire task, that's a beautiful job. Well, the thing
1:18:05
Speaker 1: about the show I called Station NAM talking to interview
1:18:09
Speaker 1: and Jason George when the stars of Station ninteen on Thursday,
1:18:12
Speaker 1: watching Love with the returns a PM Eastern Standard time
1:18:15
Speaker 1: on ABC. I tell the series is a telling like
1:18:18
Speaker 1: it is series. You know, you have strong black, dynamic
1:18:21
Speaker 1: character storylines, great gay and lesbian, transgender storylines, and it
1:18:28
Speaker 1: plays itself out in a real world environment. You have
1:18:31
Speaker 1: under you know, commitment and commitment. That's a lot of dynamics.
1:18:35
Speaker 1: You have a family in fact in the season, then
1:18:37
Speaker 1: you have to deal with the death in your family,
1:18:38
Speaker 1: revealing that information out to your children. Talk about that.
1:18:42
Speaker 1: Those those different when you have the table read or
1:18:44
Speaker 1: you're going through all these characters and your character plays
1:18:47
Speaker 1: a major role, and and and and seamlessly has to
1:18:50
Speaker 1: associate itself with all these different lifestyles, these different emotions.
1:18:55
Speaker 1: But but keeping it real though, that's what I really
1:18:57
Speaker 1: enjoy about the series Station ninteen. Yeah, I mean, it's
1:19:01
Speaker 1: it's it's it's a beautiful situation because it's what's happening
1:19:04
Speaker 1: more and more on television and film in general. But
1:19:07
Speaker 1: Shonda Land was kind of right at the crest that
1:19:09
Speaker 1: way that we're gonna tell a diverse group of stories
1:19:12
Speaker 1: and make everybody realize that your story is not that
1:19:15
Speaker 1: different from my story. I mean, uh. And so the
1:19:20
Speaker 1: diversity that we have on screen is largely supported by
1:19:24
Speaker 1: the fact that they have diversity in the writer's room
1:19:26
Speaker 1: and diversity, you know. I mean, I've never worked with
1:19:28
Speaker 1: more female directors, more directors of color, black directors, um
1:19:33
Speaker 1: then I have since I've been in Shonda Land. And
1:19:35
Speaker 1: so when you have that behind the scenes, that lets real,
1:19:38
Speaker 1: authentic stories get told on screen. And so when we
1:19:41
Speaker 1: get into that, it makes it, you know, it makes
1:19:44
Speaker 1: it really interesting and and uh fun as an actor
1:19:48
Speaker 1: to play. It's presents these challenges, and so we're able
1:19:51
Speaker 1: to tell all these different aspects that haven't always gotten
1:19:54
Speaker 1: much play on you know, on television. I mean, the
1:19:57
Speaker 1: reality is you know, there's a term and uh in
1:20:00
Speaker 1: uh in Black Hollywood. Uh. You know, I started my
1:20:04
Speaker 1: career as the BBS, oftentimes the black best friend. You know,
1:20:07
Speaker 1: My job was to show up and uh and ask
1:20:09
Speaker 1: the white male league, you know, hey man, how's your day?
1:20:12
Speaker 1: So we can talk about his love problems and things
1:20:14
Speaker 1: going on in his life. And I go, well, that's tough.
1:20:16
Speaker 1: And then that's that's my job, you know, not collect
1:20:18
Speaker 1: my check and go home. But now everybody, everybody has
1:20:24
Speaker 1: a real full life. And the fact that, you know,
1:20:27
Speaker 1: Shana Rymes is why they create these ensemble shows to
1:20:29
Speaker 1: make sure that everybody and and it also works great
1:20:31
Speaker 1: for an actor because you know, I've got an episode
1:20:34
Speaker 1: that we're about to shoot starting this week where I'm
1:20:37
Speaker 1: in almost every scene, and I'm I'm working every day,
1:20:41
Speaker 1: and then we'll have an episode two episodes from now
1:20:44
Speaker 1: where I'll show up for two days. And because they rotate,
1:20:48
Speaker 1: it means I get, as an actor, get to have
1:20:50
Speaker 1: a life outside of the show. Um, I get to
1:20:53
Speaker 1: be with my family, my kids. And then I'm like,
1:20:54
Speaker 1: by the way, kids, you're not gonna see me this week.
1:20:56
Speaker 1: Dad's gonna go to work at six o'clock in the morning,
1:20:58
Speaker 1: come home at eight and nine o'clock, and you're not
1:21:01
Speaker 1: gonna see me much because I'm in deep this one.
1:21:03
Speaker 1: But then a couple of weeks after that, you know,
1:21:05
Speaker 1: they get to see me and I get to be
1:21:07
Speaker 1: around so they that diversity creates a big atmosphere, big ensemble,
1:21:12
Speaker 1: and they get to tell a lot of different kinds
1:21:14
Speaker 1: of stories, which is what I think American needs right now,
1:21:17
Speaker 1: is they need to hear some of the stories that
1:21:18
Speaker 1: haven't been told, all those underrepresented communities that have been
1:21:21
Speaker 1: dying to see themselves and hear their own stories told. Uh.
1:21:25
Speaker 1: Now we're starting to get told more and more on television,
1:21:27
Speaker 1: especially on shows like Station nineteen, well the Station eight
1:21:30
Speaker 1: Team when it comes back, Like I said, earlier. You
1:21:33
Speaker 1: know that in the season for Noale. You know it's
1:21:36
Speaker 1: a dramatic one. You know, Uh, I guess it was
1:21:38
Speaker 1: a sexual trafficking situation that was broken up in day
1:21:41
Speaker 1: and uh the police showed up. I didn't really want
1:21:44
Speaker 1: to show up, and you know, my man Miller, he
1:21:47
Speaker 1: got arrested, and then uh, Celan he hit I think
1:21:50
Speaker 1: he hit a cop. He got arrested, and then were
1:21:52
Speaker 1: at that world that we're in today, that kind of
1:21:55
Speaker 1: like the George Floyd world that we're in where don't
1:21:58
Speaker 1: have an understanding of people of color, of people. Was
1:22:00
Speaker 1: that was that important to see that play out on
1:22:02
Speaker 1: your show? Because, like I always tell everybody Station eighteen,
1:22:05
Speaker 1: you want to see a real slice of life and
1:22:07
Speaker 1: just plays out and character relationships and though it was
1:22:11
Speaker 1: we all can get along if we understand each other values.
1:22:14
Speaker 1: That's that that finale was powerful to be. How is
1:22:16
Speaker 1: that leading to the premier episode March your level, We're
1:22:20
Speaker 1: gonna pick up with that storyline. I mean, that storyline
1:22:22
Speaker 1: is gonna travel through for a little bit of the
1:22:24
Speaker 1: difficulties with that. I mean we did we did a
1:22:26
Speaker 1: story last season where we were all the firefighters. We're
1:22:29
Speaker 1: meeting with a therapist, psychiatrists, and we're talking about our
1:22:33
Speaker 1: problems and you find out that recently been had a
1:22:36
Speaker 1: scenario where a police officer pulled him out of the
1:22:38
Speaker 1: car and made him lay face down to the ground,
1:22:41
Speaker 1: uh until he got his wald out, and that sort
1:22:43
Speaker 1: of thing to be based on nothing, based on nothing
1:22:44
Speaker 1: that's been done, uh, scenario that you know most black
1:22:48
Speaker 1: people certainly you know that eyes of black men have
1:22:51
Speaker 1: lived a couple of different times. Um, you know, driving
1:22:53
Speaker 1: all black. And it was powerful episode because the whole
1:22:58
Speaker 1: idea of the reason why that was powerful for me
1:22:59
Speaker 1: to do and why I really want to make sure
1:23:01
Speaker 1: that it happened, was that people want to say, well,
1:23:05
Speaker 1: George Floyd was doing he was he right to bad? Check?
1:23:07
Speaker 1: Was he well he was in the middle from me
1:23:09
Speaker 1: in the crime. Well if he hadn't been someplace doing
1:23:11
Speaker 1: something with the wrong people. And I'm like, no, here's
1:23:14
Speaker 1: what you're not here. It doesn't matter who you were with.
1:23:16
Speaker 1: What you were doing. Driving about black can happen to anybody,
1:23:19
Speaker 1: including a firefighters, surgeon, uh, and the casiologist you know,
1:23:24
Speaker 1: one of the good ones, because they don't know who
1:23:27
Speaker 1: you are until they until they get to know you
1:23:29
Speaker 1: and right now you're just a black man in the car.
1:23:31
Speaker 1: So that that kind of that level of judgment was
1:23:34
Speaker 1: important to show that who you are and what you
1:23:37
Speaker 1: are about and all your accomplishments. They can't see that
1:23:39
Speaker 1: front um and so they can't see the firefighter outfit.
1:23:43
Speaker 1: But then but then credit to uh another one who
1:23:48
Speaker 1: plays Dean Miller. Everybody calls him who plays Dean Miller.
1:23:52
Speaker 1: He really helped push and say we that story. I
1:23:54
Speaker 1: can't just be a one off. And so that's one
1:23:56
Speaker 1: of the reasons why God bless Christop vern Off, our showrunner.
1:23:59
Speaker 1: She's about making great entertainment, but also trying to make
1:24:04
Speaker 1: people think, you know, to educate a little bit, maybe
1:24:07
Speaker 1: you're gonna have to deal with these issues. So they
1:24:09
Speaker 1: brought it back and that's where you have, you know,
1:24:11
Speaker 1: these firefighters who are out of uniform getting treated some
1:24:14
Speaker 1: kind of way by police officers, you know, and and
1:24:17
Speaker 1: it's anything they do a beautiful job and making a
1:24:19
Speaker 1: balance because there's the one top who is not having
1:24:22
Speaker 1: any of it, you know, you know, and puts the
1:24:24
Speaker 1: you know, the slams them on the hood of the car.
1:24:27
Speaker 1: And then there's another cop who you know, has a
1:24:30
Speaker 1: problem with it, but he's not the supery officer, so
1:24:32
Speaker 1: he just kind of goes along, you know. And when
1:24:37
Speaker 1: they slammed the young girl's mother on the hood of
1:24:39
Speaker 1: the car, that's what That's what just got it all triggered.
1:24:42
Speaker 1: Treating a woman like that, you know, like that, that's
1:24:47
Speaker 1: what's treating a woman like that and treating it like
1:24:49
Speaker 1: that because you don't necessarily believe the situation that you
1:24:52
Speaker 1: don't give the credibility to them when she says, my
1:24:54
Speaker 1: child is suck in there, you know. And uh. And
1:24:56
Speaker 1: the show has done a lot of different things. I mean, like,
1:24:58
Speaker 1: you know, there's an episode where Seandrew Wilson, who plays Bailey,
1:25:02
Speaker 1: my character's wife on the show, us beloved character, phenomenal actress.
1:25:06
Speaker 1: They didn't have a few episodes where she had a
1:25:08
Speaker 1: heart attack and the doctors and are trying to tell
1:25:10
Speaker 1: her you're not you're not having a heart attack, and
1:25:12
Speaker 1: she's like, I am a chief of surgery at Graceful Memorial.
1:25:17
Speaker 1: I know what's going because black women present heart attacks,
1:25:19
Speaker 1: heart problems different than white men. Uh, different than white folks.
1:25:24
Speaker 1: And she and it's like, your assumptions of me are
1:25:27
Speaker 1: different because and they just did an episode on Grades
1:25:29
Speaker 1: where they did the same thing with an Asian American
1:25:31
Speaker 1: character because they're their health problems that present differently in
1:25:35
Speaker 1: the Asian American community, you know, and it's just hit
1:25:37
Speaker 1: they hit those issues that there's you know, a million
1:25:40
Speaker 1: different you know, sexual aids for men, but that many
1:25:43
Speaker 1: for women that you know, who's in charge makes the rules.
1:25:46
Speaker 1: So they're just trying to point up all those different things.
1:25:48
Speaker 1: So but they thought to bring that storyline back about
1:25:51
Speaker 1: the social justice in this show and use sex trafficking
1:25:54
Speaker 1: because you know, and I've been pushing for that storyline
1:25:56
Speaker 1: on the show for a while. And it's and they
1:25:58
Speaker 1: want to write everything they want, but everything the show,
1:26:00
Speaker 1: so it can't necessarily fit in right away. But you know,
1:26:02
Speaker 1: I remember I was having a meeting with Karen Bass,
1:26:05
Speaker 1: Congresswoman Karen Bass, and she said, listen, you all need
1:26:08
Speaker 1: to put this on the show. This is a few
1:26:09
Speaker 1: years ago, and she said, you know that the number
1:26:11
Speaker 1: one traffic human being in America is a fortune old
1:26:15
Speaker 1: black girl. And I don't know if those stats have
1:26:19
Speaker 1: changed since we first talked. I pray that they have,
1:26:22
Speaker 1: but believe that young black girls are still the among
1:26:25
Speaker 1: the if not the most traffic human beings the planet,
1:26:28
Speaker 1: and so the writers wrote that into the show, and
1:26:31
Speaker 1: for me, that's that's why I'm so proud of the show,
1:26:35
Speaker 1: is that they're gonna have those conversations and make folks
1:26:38
Speaker 1: at home get their entertainment. You're gonna get your entertainment,
1:26:40
Speaker 1: you're gonna get your sex. So you're gonna have your
1:26:41
Speaker 1: feels and let your pearls, but you're also gonna have
1:26:44
Speaker 1: a conversation about does that really happen? And it is, Yes, Yes,
1:26:48
Speaker 1: it's happening, and it's happen in the the neighborhoods you would
1:26:50
Speaker 1: not expect, in places you would not assume. Uh. And typically,
1:26:54
Speaker 1: you know, America doesn't care as much when they're you know,
1:26:57
Speaker 1: darker skinned young girls. When they're here in Blue Eye,
1:27:00
Speaker 1: they stay on the news. Um, But when they're you know,
1:27:04
Speaker 1: young black women, took me not as much. And then
1:27:07
Speaker 1: that's reflected in the fact that the cop doesn't believe
1:27:09
Speaker 1: them when they tell them that there's young girls being trapped.
1:27:11
Speaker 1: And so it's all these assumption and biases that people
1:27:14
Speaker 1: have and it's not about saying anybody's a horrible, evil
1:27:18
Speaker 1: human being out the box inherently. But it's about saying
1:27:21
Speaker 1: you have bites and you've got to recognize that, because
1:27:23
Speaker 1: if you can't recognize your bias, then you're you're not
1:27:26
Speaker 1: helping me. You in fact, can be part of my problem.
1:27:29
Speaker 1: He plays the character Dr Ben Warren. Now he's playing
1:27:32
Speaker 1: firefighter Ben Warren on Station nineteen Thursday, wanting let them
1:27:36
Speaker 1: to coming back on ABC. Uh, Jason George, I wanna
1:27:39
Speaker 1: call you Ben, but Jason George, I got, I got.
1:27:46
Speaker 1: I'm one of three boys, Johnny, Jason Jarvis and so
1:27:49
Speaker 1: I anything. You know what I'm talking to you And
1:27:52
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, you say, man, I got you heyn Man.
1:27:56
Speaker 1: I appreciate you coming on the short tell your story
1:27:58
Speaker 1: because you know, I don't know out of HBC, you
1:28:00
Speaker 1: school affiliates, and Uh, it's just just a growing market
1:28:04
Speaker 1: of being able to live black people, see real black
1:28:07
Speaker 1: people tell their stories and their rise and being consistently
1:28:10
Speaker 1: part of the process. And you're part of the process.
1:28:12
Speaker 1: Because I want to bring you back on because you're
1:28:13
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff you do with unions in the community,
1:28:15
Speaker 1: but more important than they got you in there to
1:28:17
Speaker 1: talk about the premier and I wanted to make sure
1:28:19
Speaker 1: I did that correctly about Station eighteen this Thursday, March.
1:28:22
Speaker 1: You level make sure you guys don't miss it, because
1:28:24
Speaker 1: you want miss this guy. He's on TV all the time.
1:28:26
Speaker 1: He'd be dancing between Grays Anatomy, he'd be doing Station
1:28:29
Speaker 1: and eighteen. He's a great actor, He's a great friend.
1:28:32
Speaker 1: Jason George, thanks for coming on money making conversation. Appreciate it.
1:28:35
Speaker 1: I appreciate you. Thank you for having as a blast.
1:28:37
Speaker 1: I come back any time. Adoption of teams from foster
1:28:40
Speaker 1: care is a topic not enough people know about, and
1:28:43
Speaker 1: we're here to change that. I'm April Dinuity, host of
1:28:45
Speaker 1: the new podcast Navigating Adoption, presented by adopt Us Kids.
1:28:49
Speaker 1: Each episode brings you compelling, real life adoption stories told
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Speaker 1: by the families that lived them, with commentary from experts.
1:28:56
Speaker 1: Visit adopt us Kids dot org, slash podcast, or some
1:29:00
Speaker 1: scribe to Navigating Adoption presented by adopt Us Kids, brought
1:29:03
Speaker 1: to you by the U. S Department of Health and
1:29:05
Speaker 1: Human Services, Administration for Children and Families, and the Council.
1:29:09
Speaker 1: What grows in the forest trees, sure, no. What else
1:29:13
Speaker 1: grows in the forest, our imagination, our sense of wonder
1:29:17
Speaker 1: and our family bonds grow too, because when we disconnect
1:29:20
Speaker 1: from this and connect with this, we reconnect with each other.
1:29:28
Speaker 1: The forest is closer than you think. Find a forest
1:29:31
Speaker 1: near you and start exploring. I Discover the Forest dot org.
1:29:35
Speaker 1: Brought to you by the United States Forest Service and
1:29:37
Speaker 1: the AD Council. What grows in the forest trees? Sure? No.
1:29:43
Speaker 1: What else grows in the forest Our imagination, our sense
1:29:46
Speaker 1: of wonder, and our family bonds grow too, because when
1:29:50
Speaker 1: we disconnect from this and connect with this, we reconnect
1:29:57
Speaker 1: with each other. The forest is closer than you think.
1:30:00
Speaker 1: Find a forest near you and start exploring. I Discover
1:30:04
Speaker 1: the Forest dot org. Brought to you by the United
1:30:06
Speaker 1: States Forest Service and the AD Council. We will be
1:30:10
Speaker 1: right back with more money Making Conversations with your host,
1:30:13
Speaker 1: Rashan McDonald Him Rushan McDonald, the host of Money Making Conversation.
1:30:17
Speaker 1: The Cafe Mocha Swag Award is a celebration of black
1:30:20
Speaker 1: men who are making a difference in our community by
1:30:23
Speaker 1: empowering others to reach their life goals. From civic leaders, businessmen, activists,
1:30:27
Speaker 1: celebrities and everyday dads. The Cafe Moca Swag Award winner
1:30:31
Speaker 1: this week is Dr Shaun Woodley, a graduate of Hampton University.
1:30:36
Speaker 1: Dr Shaun Woodley has dedicated his professional career to education.
1:30:39
Speaker 1: He is the architect behind the educated movement Teach, Hustle, Inspire.
1:30:44
Speaker 1: He has written the bestselling book mc means Moved the
1:30:47
Speaker 1: Class How to spark engagement and motivation to urban and
1:30:50
Speaker 1: culturally diverged classrooms. I firmly believe that education it's a
1:30:55
Speaker 1: key that can unlock so many doors in so many
1:30:59
Speaker 1: different ructions. We need to be sure that the bright
1:31:03
Speaker 1: young scholars in the four walls of these classrooms across
1:31:06
Speaker 1: this country are being exposed so that they have something
1:31:10
Speaker 1: to shoot for. An education can't do that. The Cafaine
1:31:13
Speaker 1: marka Swag Award represents men who have strength, whose wisdom
1:31:16
Speaker 1: is assertive, and who is genuine in their spirit. Welcome
1:31:20
Speaker 1: back to money making Conversations with your host, Rashan McDonald.
1:31:24
Speaker 1: My next guest is Sister Soldier. She is a New
1:31:27
Speaker 1: York Times bestselling author. Her debate book, The Cold Is
1:31:30
Speaker 1: Win to Ever Soul over a million copies and introduced
1:31:32
Speaker 1: the world to the quick, witted, bold, fashionable, erotic, soulful
1:31:36
Speaker 1: and undeniable, complicated character of Winter, Santiago. The sequel to
1:31:41
Speaker 1: the Cold is when the Ever Life After Death is
1:31:44
Speaker 1: out now you can buy right now. Previously, as you
1:31:47
Speaker 1: know the background on Sister Soldier recording artists with the
1:31:49
Speaker 1: hip hop group Public Enemy. She is best known as
1:31:52
Speaker 1: a political activist, educative urban youth from underserved communities. A
1:31:56
Speaker 1: graduate of Rutgers University, her first book, So Like I
1:32:00
Speaker 1: Said earlier over a million copies. It was recognized in
1:32:03
Speaker 1: Essence Emerged magazine as when He was a bestseller in eighteen.
1:32:07
Speaker 1: It was including a PBS Great American reprogram and currently
1:32:11
Speaker 1: it has over a million copies. In prey please Work
1:32:14
Speaker 1: with the money Making conversation discussed her new book, Coldest
1:32:17
Speaker 1: Winter Ever, Life After Death Sister Soldier. He thank you
1:32:24
Speaker 1: for welcoming me. I'm glad to be here. Well, I'm
1:32:27
Speaker 1: happy you know this is We're coming into a new
1:32:29
Speaker 1: year with a fantastic book. Uh. Twenty was a it
1:32:33
Speaker 1: was a people year for a lot of people. How
1:32:35
Speaker 1: did it affect you and did you write the book
1:32:37
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty or you started it prior to that?
1:32:43
Speaker 1: Definitely in that year and twenty was a very difficult year.
1:32:49
Speaker 1: I think all around the world I don't think that
1:32:52
Speaker 1: anybody will forget uh, every on every level personally won't
1:32:59
Speaker 1: forget it, politically, will never forget it, financially, won't forget it,
1:33:05
Speaker 1: you know, culturally, won't forget it. So it was a
1:33:08
Speaker 1: very uh difficult year for everybody. With that being said,
1:33:15
Speaker 1: when you work in the show, a book is complicated
1:33:17
Speaker 1: to this because there are a lot of complex care
1:33:19
Speaker 1: but a lot of familiar characters, and a lot of
1:33:21
Speaker 1: people have been waiting on this book, the sequel to
1:33:23
Speaker 1: this book, because Ward's character, you know, in the previous book.
1:33:27
Speaker 1: They want to know what happened to the character. Tell
1:33:29
Speaker 1: us about that journey of writing the book. You say,
1:33:32
Speaker 1: we wrote it to twenty but I thought that was
1:33:34
Speaker 1: a thought process prior to twenty Land. The chapters Land,
1:33:37
Speaker 1: the storylines talk about that walk with those steps. Okay, well, actually,
1:33:44
Speaker 1: when the Cocus Want to Ever first published, in, which
1:33:49
Speaker 1: I really think it's but in is the number that
1:33:54
Speaker 1: everybody wants to go with, So that's fine. When it
1:33:57
Speaker 1: first published, I wanted to write a sequel, you know,
1:34:01
Speaker 1: immediately I began thinking about a sequel immediately. But then
1:34:05
Speaker 1: I thought about the fact that the cold this went
1:34:07
Speaker 1: to Ever is a cautionary tale. It was something not
1:34:11
Speaker 1: to glorify the drug lifestyle, but to expose it and
1:34:16
Speaker 1: show how it how drugs destroys the whole family ultimately,
1:34:23
Speaker 1: So because the cold this went to ever ended with,
1:34:27
Speaker 1: went to Santiago being convicted and sentenced to a mandatory
1:34:31
Speaker 1: minimum of fifteen years, I wanted that to resonate in
1:34:38
Speaker 1: our community, for people to really feel, you know, the
1:34:42
Speaker 1: absence of her presence or the absence of the presence
1:34:46
Speaker 1: of someone that you really love or you really missed,
1:34:49
Speaker 1: because that's what happens in the real world when our
1:34:53
Speaker 1: loved ones gett incarcerated, and it's serious. So for everybody
1:34:58
Speaker 1: that was out there quality a drug game, you know,
1:35:01
Speaker 1: glorifying and glamorizing it, I wanted to make it clear
1:35:06
Speaker 1: that it's not a game, it's a death style, not
1:35:09
Speaker 1: a lifestyle, and that the whole family can get destroyed
1:35:14
Speaker 1: once you get involved in it. Well that's important because
1:35:17
Speaker 1: we do have a family here, you know, you have us. So,
1:35:20
Speaker 1: like I said, I haven't I didn't read the first book.
1:35:22
Speaker 1: I read the second book outstanding, read from cover to cover,
1:35:26
Speaker 1: all right, Julie, I would tell you how I read
1:35:28
Speaker 1: books I get up in the morning. But from interviewed
1:35:31
Speaker 1: on a writer about the book, I read it the
1:35:33
Speaker 1: day of and I got up at two o'clock in
1:35:35
Speaker 1: the morning and I read it and it was like, uh,
1:35:39
Speaker 1: it was it was very colorful, it was very Uh.
1:35:42
Speaker 1: The characters I always like to say, uh, what were you?
1:35:46
Speaker 1: Were relatable? I thought, And I thought because of the
1:35:50
Speaker 1: fact that you know, they were emotionally driven, they were passioned,
1:35:53
Speaker 1: they were tied to a belief, and they were honest people.
1:35:56
Speaker 1: And I think for shines the most in your in
1:35:59
Speaker 1: your book as in all your previous writing. This book
1:36:01
Speaker 1: is called Life After Death. The honesty of the characters
1:36:04
Speaker 1: talking walkers through the steps and the honesty of the characters.
1:36:07
Speaker 1: And are you reaching from certain people that you know?
1:36:10
Speaker 1: Are these just your imagination? These characters are definitely characters
1:36:15
Speaker 1: from my imagination. And I think the key to writing
1:36:19
Speaker 1: these kinds of characters, for any author or aspiring author,
1:36:23
Speaker 1: is that you have to be able to uh completely
1:36:28
Speaker 1: distance yourself from the characters that you create. You can't
1:36:33
Speaker 1: look at it as you want to control the character,
1:36:36
Speaker 1: or you want to control the character's voice, the character's desires,
1:36:40
Speaker 1: whatever the case. So for example, Winter Santiago is very
1:36:45
Speaker 1: different from Sister Soldier. How Winter would answer a question
1:36:51
Speaker 1: is completely different from how I, the author would answer
1:36:55
Speaker 1: the question. So I can't start trying to slip my
1:36:59
Speaker 1: per sonality into her personality without corrupting the character. If
1:37:05
Speaker 1: I want the character to be genuine, I have to
1:37:08
Speaker 1: have let the character have a life of its own,
1:37:12
Speaker 1: if you will. So for each and every character in
1:37:16
Speaker 1: the in the books that I write, I don't let
1:37:20
Speaker 1: sister Soldier interfere in the character, no matter what well
1:37:24
Speaker 1: it's it's important to hear, but let me whenever when
1:37:27
Speaker 1: they sit over the information or reading about the background,
1:37:30
Speaker 1: it was saying, all those soldier, you know this is
1:37:33
Speaker 1: a nonfiction. In Winter within the San Diego's fiction, both said,
1:37:37
Speaker 1: she and I are real. That's what just the state
1:37:40
Speaker 1: in that bio and in fact fictitious. Winter is realer
1:37:43
Speaker 1: than you talk about that when you say that, when
1:37:47
Speaker 1: you said, even though you said these are made of characters,
1:37:50
Speaker 1: the statement is that she's realer. When you say realer,
1:37:53
Speaker 1: what do you mean when you say that? What I
1:37:55
Speaker 1: mean is that she uh is She's a representation of
1:38:01
Speaker 1: probably you know, a million of the young ladies in
1:38:06
Speaker 1: the hood and in the suburbs and the rural areas
1:38:10
Speaker 1: across the whole United States of America. And and it
1:38:15
Speaker 1: becomes obvious that she's a representation because of how great
1:38:19
Speaker 1: the love for her is, because of how high the
1:38:24
Speaker 1: sales of her story is. All of that is uh
1:38:30
Speaker 1: is obvious when I first wrote the book, the amount
1:38:34
Speaker 1: of hundreds and then thousands of letters I got about
1:38:38
Speaker 1: went to Santiago made it clear to me that she
1:38:42
Speaker 1: is real and real as personified uh In in the
1:38:47
Speaker 1: lives of real people in our neighborhoods. Who feels she's
1:38:54
Speaker 1: real because she represents their sentiments or their emotions, or
1:38:59
Speaker 1: their challenges, or their lifestyle or you know, or their fantasies,
1:39:04
Speaker 1: fantasies of who they would like to be. No interesting
1:39:08
Speaker 1: thing when because you're a performing artist and uh and
1:39:12
Speaker 1: I was blessed in my life, you know, a stand
1:39:15
Speaker 1: up comedian, and I got to experience Heights of Death,
1:39:18
Speaker 1: comedy jam performing in Madison Square Garden and that lab
1:39:21
Speaker 1: that live performance is really filled with a drill on.
1:39:25
Speaker 1: You know, from a standpoint as a writer, and I
1:39:28
Speaker 1: have a sitcom writer, I've written dramas, I've written reality
1:39:31
Speaker 1: shows and things like that. So that's a different level
1:39:34
Speaker 1: and from when I was a performing artist as a
1:39:37
Speaker 1: stand up comedian and and because it wasn't as raw
1:39:40
Speaker 1: and as a as a performing artist and you're out
1:39:43
Speaker 1: there rapping, that's a raw form of entertainment. When you
1:39:46
Speaker 1: out there writing, what compels you and drives your passion
1:39:49
Speaker 1: as a writer, Sister Soldier, I think that uh, myself
1:39:56
Speaker 1: as a writer is is the top is the top.
1:40:01
Speaker 1: In other words, as a music, performing artists or anything else,
1:40:07
Speaker 1: really a writer clearly tops all of that because I
1:40:14
Speaker 1: have a very vast imagination. I have thousands of stories
1:40:19
Speaker 1: in my head. I love the whole process of researching, reading, studying, uh,
1:40:27
Speaker 1: traveling new world, learning new cultures, new languages, experiencing new
1:40:32
Speaker 1: things and being able to draw from all of those
1:40:36
Speaker 1: things at once. And it's a real challenge. And when
1:40:40
Speaker 1: you're creating a character, it gives you a greater respect
1:40:46
Speaker 1: for for God then you may have ever had, because
1:40:51
Speaker 1: you say, wow, it takes all of this energy and
1:40:54
Speaker 1: all of this imagination and all of this effort and
1:40:58
Speaker 1: all of this passionate, all of this soul to create
1:41:02
Speaker 1: this one inanamant character. And here the higher Power, the
1:41:09
Speaker 1: maker of all souls, has created each and every one
1:41:13
Speaker 1: of us, and each and every one of us has
1:41:16
Speaker 1: something unique about us, and each of us has a backstory.
1:41:21
Speaker 1: It just makes you say, well, a hundle law, how
1:41:25
Speaker 1: great God is? You know, it's really it's really great
1:41:29
Speaker 1: talking to you. I want to thank you for taking
1:41:31
Speaker 1: the time to discuss your book that out now, Life
1:41:33
Speaker 1: After Death, the sequel to the Code that is When
1:41:36
Speaker 1: the Winter Ever and Winter being a the lead character
1:41:39
Speaker 1: in your in your novel series. You know you said
1:41:42
Speaker 1: something earlier, were talking about drugs, and you was talking
1:41:45
Speaker 1: about that lifestyle and your your goal was not to
1:41:48
Speaker 1: glorify it. That's why she went to jail fifteen years
1:41:51
Speaker 1: and and inserved every year of that in prison. And
1:41:55
Speaker 1: that's very important in your storytelling dynamics. And so when
1:41:59
Speaker 1: I when I look at the reality of what life
1:42:01
Speaker 1: is your education, you know, your degree graduate of Ruge University,
1:42:06
Speaker 1: tell us how important it is and how its important
1:42:08
Speaker 1: is that's part of your legacy. When you're talking to
1:42:11
Speaker 1: young people about your career and you're talking about your
1:42:14
Speaker 1: career as a writer. Now, well, I think the university
1:42:18
Speaker 1: level is important, Uh not for the same reasons that
1:42:23
Speaker 1: maybe other people think it's important. I think it's important
1:42:26
Speaker 1: because like for somebody like me who came from the
1:42:30
Speaker 1: Bronx and then came from the poor suburbs, you know,
1:42:35
Speaker 1: after the Bronx. Uh, going to a university and seeing
1:42:40
Speaker 1: the facility itself is a very amazing experience. Going out
1:42:46
Speaker 1: on the yard and seeing all of the organizations that
1:42:50
Speaker 1: the university offers and realizing that anything you ever imagine
1:42:55
Speaker 1: in your life you can learn and master in a
1:42:58
Speaker 1: university is a very uh wonderful feeling. So if you're
1:43:04
Speaker 1: standing there, you just arrived, it's your first week on campus.
1:43:08
Speaker 1: You can join an organization to row a boat if
1:43:12
Speaker 1: that's your thing. You want to rote a boat, you
1:43:15
Speaker 1: want to play the piano, you want to be in
1:43:17
Speaker 1: the science club, you want to do experiments. You wanna
1:43:21
Speaker 1: jump out of airplanes, you want to shoot rifles or
1:43:24
Speaker 1: whatever you wanna do. And on a university level, Uh,
1:43:29
Speaker 1: in a major university, it's an opportunity that's there and
1:43:33
Speaker 1: all of the resources are there. I spent my whole
1:43:37
Speaker 1: young life wishing that I owned a piano. And when
1:43:41
Speaker 1: I got to the university and I went to the
1:43:44
Speaker 1: music the campus for music. I went into a building
1:43:48
Speaker 1: in every single room had a piano. And because I
1:43:51
Speaker 1: was a student and I had a student, I d
1:43:54
Speaker 1: I could access that piano. I could master that piano
1:43:57
Speaker 1: if I studied it. So I just stink universities are
1:44:01
Speaker 1: amazing and that young people should stry to take it
1:44:04
Speaker 1: to the university level, not for the sake of prestige
1:44:08
Speaker 1: or arrogance, or even for just social activity, but because
1:44:13
Speaker 1: the sky is the limit with expanding your mind, mastering
1:44:18
Speaker 1: some skills and talents, and being able to own and
1:44:21
Speaker 1: control your own business. And that's important. And I wanted
1:44:26
Speaker 1: to make sure I talked about your your college education
1:44:29
Speaker 1: because you know it changed my life. You know, my
1:44:32
Speaker 1: degrees in mathematics and my minor and sociology and and
1:44:35
Speaker 1: I like you when I went to college and it
1:44:38
Speaker 1: changed me, and it changed me in so many ways
1:44:40
Speaker 1: because it showed me there's so many avenues of what
1:44:42
Speaker 1: I could be and promote the value of that. It's incredible.
1:44:47
Speaker 1: But I know we have a few minutes left. And
1:44:49
Speaker 1: the amazing thing about the novel is that you don't
1:44:51
Speaker 1: really want to tell the story because you want people
1:44:54
Speaker 1: to read the story. Can you can you tell us
1:44:57
Speaker 1: about some of the characters that have carried over into
1:44:59
Speaker 1: the sequel that you are building upon in the sequel
1:45:02
Speaker 1: Life After Death. Yes, in Life after Death, you will see,
1:45:07
Speaker 1: of course, went to Santiago. She's the main she's on
1:45:11
Speaker 1: the main stage in the spotlight. And then you'll see Midnight,
1:45:14
Speaker 1: of course, because whenever you see Winter, you have to
1:45:18
Speaker 1: see Midnight. You will see Winter sister Porsche Santiago, and
1:45:23
Speaker 1: she has a book of her own and she is
1:45:27
Speaker 1: quite dynamic, if I should say so myself. And uh,
1:45:31
Speaker 1: you'll see the man that Porsche ended up being married to. Um,
1:45:37
Speaker 1: you will see Ricky Santiago. Oh that's a big one
1:45:40
Speaker 1: because you know everybody loves him. And you'll see even
1:45:44
Speaker 1: Lana glimpses of Lana Santiago. Uh so, yeah, it's all
1:45:50
Speaker 1: of the characters that you met in Nicodest Winterever. And
1:45:55
Speaker 1: for some of the characters like went to his friends
1:45:58
Speaker 1: in Life after Death, you'll see more insight until went
1:46:02
Speaker 1: into Winter friendships, and the characters the same characters from
1:46:07
Speaker 1: the Coldest Whenever. But after fifteen years of serving uh
1:46:12
Speaker 1: prison set, Like you said, you're gonna look different, walk different,
1:46:15
Speaker 1: talk different. And because the life they live now is different.
1:46:18
Speaker 1: An incredible read. I'm just gonna let you know I
1:46:20
Speaker 1: read it, h uh and I would recommend it to
1:46:23
Speaker 1: my friends and putting in my newsletter, putting on my
1:46:25
Speaker 1: social media, A great novel. You're you know, you're the
1:46:28
Speaker 1: blessing of this conversation I'm having with your sister soldiers
1:46:31
Speaker 1: that you know, you're transcending person. You know, like you said,
1:46:35
Speaker 1: you come from the Bronx. You know, you're you're You're
1:46:38
Speaker 1: happily married, you have a child. You know you live
1:46:40
Speaker 1: in a life of uh that you want to live.
1:46:42
Speaker 1: And I feel as a writer, as a successful author,
1:46:45
Speaker 1: just tell me this, uh, you know, we we do
1:46:47
Speaker 1: these things creative. I was fortunately be with Steve Harvey
1:46:50
Speaker 1: and we did uh, act like the lady, think like
1:46:52
Speaker 1: a man, and nobody told us we would sell books
1:46:55
Speaker 1: and we sold three million copies. How did it feel
1:46:57
Speaker 1: to realize you had a best seller in your hands? Well,
1:47:02
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you. I like the reaction of the
1:47:05
Speaker 1: people in the neighborhoods that I grew up in, So
1:47:10
Speaker 1: I Likeve like, Uh, if I walk down the street
1:47:13
Speaker 1: in Hallan, you know, I'll hear people whispering, Oh, oh,
1:47:17
Speaker 1: there should go. It's the girl. What girl, even though
1:47:21
Speaker 1: I'm grown with you a woman, right girl, God, I
1:47:25
Speaker 1: wrote the book. But the book, the book, she wrote
1:47:29
Speaker 1: the book. So I love that kind of feeling because
1:47:33
Speaker 1: it's a neighborhood that's familiar to me, it's people that's
1:47:36
Speaker 1: familiar to me. And it's even better than any award
1:47:42
Speaker 1: or any you know, official kind of congratulations that you
1:47:47
Speaker 1: can get when you've seen your own people totally engaged
1:47:51
Speaker 1: in the words that you've written on the page. It's
1:47:54
Speaker 1: fantastic words. And thank you for allowing me to speak
1:47:56
Speaker 1: to you and have an honest conversation. A boy a
1:47:58
Speaker 1: brilliant writer of an artists and an amazing talent, and
1:48:02
Speaker 1: keep translating in the world with your colorful style of
1:48:05
Speaker 1: writing in your and your activism. Thank you for coming
1:48:08
Speaker 1: on money making conversations. Thank you for welcoming me, and
1:48:12
Speaker 1: thank you for putting me in your newsletter. Absolutely girlfriend,
1:48:15
Speaker 1: you the thank you as they say you all the
1:48:18
Speaker 1: one cheetah one, cheetah one. Right. Then the book, the book,
1:48:21
Speaker 1: that's right, the neighbor That book is you know, Life
1:48:24
Speaker 1: After Death by Sister Soldier. Again, I want to thank
1:48:26
Speaker 1: everybody who comes to Money Making Conversation. If you want
1:48:29
Speaker 1: to see more interviews or here more interviews, please go
1:48:32
Speaker 1: to money Making Conversation dot com um with Sean McDonald,
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