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Hair & Healing: A Conversation with Lorenzo Lewis · The Steve Harvey Morning Show

0:02
Speaker 1: Have you ever wanted a safe space where you can
0:05
Speaker 1: just exist, where for a moment in time, you can
0:08
Speaker 1: be you, with all the intricacies and parts of you
0:11
Speaker 1: that people don't always understand. Welcome to in the deep
0:15
Speaker 1: stories that shape us. I'm your host, Zach Stafford, and
0:18
Speaker 1: each episode we create a space to be you, all
0:21
Speaker 1: of you and all your messy and complicated glory. Every
0:25
Speaker 1: story shares what it means to be a black and
0:27
Speaker 1: Latin X man living with different hardships, whether it's a
0:29
Speaker 1: struggle of identity, discrimination or health, and how they've managed
0:33
Speaker 1: to push forward despite the circumstance. We hope to get closer,
0:37
Speaker 1: even it's just a little to a road of healing
0:39
Speaker 1: and understanding. Hi there, welcome back today. I want to
0:51
Speaker 1: talk about something that I think we all have, and
0:53
Speaker 1: that's confidence. Those people we reach out to when we're down,
0:57
Speaker 1: the first name in your contacts that you share good
0:59
Speaker 1: news with, the friends and family that are there for
1:01
Speaker 1: the ups and downs. And I think we can all
1:04
Speaker 1: agree that sometimes these people come via communal spaces. The
1:08
Speaker 1: stores or restaurants, be frequent, a favorite sports bar, or
1:11
Speaker 1: even the barbershop. These spaces tend to be the heartbeat
1:15
Speaker 1: of a neighborhood, allowing people to congregate in a place
1:17
Speaker 1: where they can freely be themselves. Our guest today, Lorenzo Lewis,
1:21
Speaker 1: is a man that wears many hats. He's an entrepreneur,
1:25
Speaker 1: mental health advocate, motivational speaker, author. His resume is extensive
1:30
Speaker 1: and impressive. He's best known for taking the idea of
1:33
Speaker 1: safe spaces one step further by turning the quintessential barbershop
1:36
Speaker 1: into a place of healing through the Confessed Project. But
1:40
Speaker 1: before he thought of this creative way of bringing mental
1:43
Speaker 1: health to his community, Lorenzo had to go through some
1:45
Speaker 1: tough times in his early years. Young Lorenzo was someone
1:52
Speaker 1: who was really hurt and someone who was confused, someone
1:56
Speaker 1: without parents, someone that realized that he was born in
1:59
Speaker 1: a prison, someone that knew he had scars and that
2:02
Speaker 1: had a lot of issues, anger and impulsivity and just things.
2:07
Speaker 1: That was honestly very scared than anything, knowing that I
2:11
Speaker 1: was very different from a lot of other youth. My mother,
2:14
Speaker 1: you know, at the time, was involved in a lot
2:17
Speaker 1: of different things. Um I believe prostitution was one part
2:20
Speaker 1: of it. Drug involvement. She was incarcerated and during her stay. Um,
2:25
Speaker 1: I was born right, So during New Jersey, UM is
2:30
Speaker 1: where you know, my life started inside of a prison cell.
2:34
Speaker 1: My father at that time was incarcerated in d C.
2:37
Speaker 1: And so two parents incarcerated a kid coming out. My
2:41
Speaker 1: ununcle stepped in so that I wouldn't get taken up
2:44
Speaker 1: by the system, and so brought to Arkansas, lived a
2:47
Speaker 1: life with external siblings, um, and really was treated like
2:51
Speaker 1: I was their own, had my own siblings, and they
2:54
Speaker 1: were separated as well with other family members. You know,
2:59
Speaker 1: I was confused, was I was angry, you know even
3:01
Speaker 1: and you know I still go tend therapy now, and
3:04
Speaker 1: a part of that was me process and the fact that, um,
3:08
Speaker 1: how they were and why did we end up in
3:10
Speaker 1: a situation that we're in. You know, why did my
3:12
Speaker 1: brother have to live with my grandmother, Why did I
3:14
Speaker 1: sippsters have to stay with my other grandmother? Why did
3:16
Speaker 1: I have to live with my aunt? And why did
3:18
Speaker 1: we all have to have other siblings? In fact, we
3:21
Speaker 1: had ourselves, right, And so those were challenging times. But
3:26
Speaker 1: you know, again very thankful for my and my uncle
3:29
Speaker 1: who took me in that really was able to nurture me,
3:32
Speaker 1: give me a family um allowed me to escape parts
3:35
Speaker 1: of poverty, which is very inevitable for black youth. And
3:39
Speaker 1: so now that I'm a parent, I really realized my
3:42
Speaker 1: parents was really dealing with their own brokenness from maybe
3:47
Speaker 1: their experiences with their mothers and fathers and their upbringing.
3:50
Speaker 1: They grew up in small towns in Arkansas and Alabama,
3:53
Speaker 1: rural Arkansas and Alabama, so I can only imagine some
3:56
Speaker 1: of the herd and some of the poverty that they faced,
3:58
Speaker 1: and some of the and adequate sees as a young
4:00
Speaker 1: person that they went through. And I think they were
4:02
Speaker 1: really trying to find themselves, you know, and they were
4:04
Speaker 1: just on the path and so happily he had children.
4:08
Speaker 1: You know, as a youth, I made bad decisions. So
4:11
Speaker 1: I really gave my graces to my parents, and really
4:14
Speaker 1: it took a long time to get there. I'm at
4:17
Speaker 1: peace knowing that they came and deal what they needed
4:20
Speaker 1: to do, and that a part of my life is
4:21
Speaker 1: now sharing with the world, whether it's parents and families,
4:25
Speaker 1: that hey, we have to give grace to others to
4:29
Speaker 1: all throughout his childhood, Lorenzo battled with the aftermath of
4:33
Speaker 1: this broken us. He didn't know it at the time,
4:35
Speaker 1: but he was battling through major mental health issues like depression.
4:39
Speaker 1: But there was a place where Lorenzo began to find
4:42
Speaker 1: grace and forgiveness that he would carry with him through adulthood.
4:45
Speaker 1: His aunt's beauty salon. Some of the favorite memberies, you know,
4:49
Speaker 1: getting off to school bus. You know, it was about
4:51
Speaker 1: four or five stations there, right, It was about three
4:54
Speaker 1: or four women. There was a one gentleman everybody name
4:57
Speaker 1: of Sylvester. I'm actually contact with him to this day,
4:59
Speaker 1: and he was my first mentor, one of the first
5:01
Speaker 1: male barber's only male barber in the salon, but also
5:05
Speaker 1: one of the first mentors that identified I just remember
5:10
Speaker 1: those conversations that we had every day. Also from just
5:14
Speaker 1: the communications, you know, seeing people, you know, whether they
5:17
Speaker 1: had a home or someone to go to. They would
5:19
Speaker 1: come into the beauty shop. They would ask to use
5:21
Speaker 1: the phone, they would ask for food, you know, my
5:23
Speaker 1: unt and then would help them. They would help people
5:26
Speaker 1: get you know, they need to catch a bus fare.
5:29
Speaker 1: They would give people money out of their pockets. I
5:31
Speaker 1: really saw that anybody there had a village. If they
5:35
Speaker 1: came in there and they really expressed that they needed support.
5:38
Speaker 1: They want to know that they're heard in their scene.
5:41
Speaker 1: So what is it about salons and barbershops that make
5:44
Speaker 1: black people not only want to go there for you know,
5:47
Speaker 1: haircuts all the time, of course, but also to find
5:49
Speaker 1: community as well. Yeah, you know, historically being a barber
5:55
Speaker 1: was one of the professions that they could perform on
5:57
Speaker 1: their on their owners, their masters. In addition, that time progressed,
6:02
Speaker 1: you know, barbershops the brick and mortars of some of
6:05
Speaker 1: the only ownership opportunities, one of the fastest ways to
6:09
Speaker 1: building generational wealth, long term ways to building generational well
6:13
Speaker 1: barbershops as a loon, as I passed down through family manages. Ultimately,
6:17
Speaker 1: in the Civil Rights era, barbershops were used in the
6:20
Speaker 1: black community as voting hubs, then double a c P
6:24
Speaker 1: and the Panthers movement, offering food to the community and
6:28
Speaker 1: ensuring that people were getting information about what was going
6:32
Speaker 1: on the community was coming through the barbershops. And so
6:34
Speaker 1: even during the Civil Rights era, when organizing and black
6:38
Speaker 1: freedom and people being able to have the liberation that
6:41
Speaker 1: they could have started through barbershops, right, And so it's
6:46
Speaker 1: just been a natural place and I think it's been
6:48
Speaker 1: one of the most beautiful opportunities that we can really
6:51
Speaker 1: take a step further and you know, talk about things
6:54
Speaker 1: like mental health and well being and all the other
6:58
Speaker 1: things that were accomplishing me in the bar of the shops.
7:02
Speaker 1: It was at this point that Lorenzo started to put
7:04
Speaker 1: two and two together that barbershops and salons could be
7:08
Speaker 1: places of culture where stories were shared from one generation
7:11
Speaker 1: to the next, but also places of healing. You know,
7:15
Speaker 1: as a kid, I remember, you know, witnessing women, you know,
7:20
Speaker 1: really pour their hearts out to my aunt about their
7:22
Speaker 1: lives and about the things that they were going through
7:25
Speaker 1: about you know, their divorce and and different things that
7:29
Speaker 1: was just going on at work. And I just can remember, like,
7:32
Speaker 1: you know, my aunt like really you know, praying with
7:34
Speaker 1: people and motivating people and saying, hey, you can get
7:37
Speaker 1: through this, and this is you know, and even giving
7:39
Speaker 1: them whether there was some kind of a scripture or
7:41
Speaker 1: giving them some kind of empowerment right there in front
7:44
Speaker 1: of people. It was really powerful. I took it for
7:48
Speaker 1: granted as I was smaller, but now that I really
7:50
Speaker 1: think about it, that was probably the most transformational therapy
7:53
Speaker 1: session that you can have with someone while doing their
7:57
Speaker 1: hair right or cutting their hair, and so even when
8:01
Speaker 1: I was a kid sitting and Sylvester's chair, you know,
8:04
Speaker 1: with my small feet dangling from this chair, right. I
8:06
Speaker 1: would always talk to him about what I want to
8:09
Speaker 1: be when I grow up, and he would empower me
8:11
Speaker 1: and say, oh, you can do that, and man, stay
8:13
Speaker 1: out of trouble, and make sure that you're not doing
8:15
Speaker 1: drugs when you go to school, and make sure that
8:17
Speaker 1: you're hanging with the right people. I mean, that's mentorship
8:20
Speaker 1: at its finest right. And so a lot of young
8:23
Speaker 1: kids across the country went through that same experience like
8:25
Speaker 1: I did. I just don't know if we ever captured
8:28
Speaker 1: it that way. And then now we can really sit
8:31
Speaker 1: back and take time and reflect and say, hey, this
8:34
Speaker 1: is a powerful transition that's happening in this moment. And
8:37
Speaker 1: then I think we should also take it further right
8:40
Speaker 1: and do more through the barber chair. Yeah. You know,
8:43
Speaker 1: when I first heard about your work, it made me
8:45
Speaker 1: think about how my dad used to cut my own
8:47
Speaker 1: hair in the bathroom and that was the time where
8:49
Speaker 1: he'd give me lessons about life and what to do
8:52
Speaker 1: and all that. So what is it about getting your
8:54
Speaker 1: haircut that makes people so at ease to start having
8:57
Speaker 1: these hard conversations, because typically getting your haircut can be
9:00
Speaker 1: stressful if someone doesn't know what they're doing. So why
9:02
Speaker 1: what is it about us as black people that really
9:04
Speaker 1: find ourselves calmed by the process of getting a haircut?
9:08
Speaker 1: You know, the clippers and razors are one of the
9:11
Speaker 1: most intimate close proximity for men, particularly that we ever
9:16
Speaker 1: come in contact with, probably outside of playing sports. I
9:19
Speaker 1: mean someone putting a razor or a shop blade against
9:22
Speaker 1: your head. That intimacy, that connection that's captured, is really
9:28
Speaker 1: a powerful, powerful opportunity for growth, for expansion of that person.
9:34
Speaker 1: And so I think that in itself, that intimacy allows
9:38
Speaker 1: people to really let their guards. Now you know, you
9:41
Speaker 1: know you're going to look good after this grooming session.
9:46
Speaker 1: It really creates, I believe, and a powerful opportunity for
9:52
Speaker 1: the barber and the client to really do more good
9:54
Speaker 1: for themselves and their community. When someone walks out of
9:57
Speaker 1: the barbershop, they feel renewed, they feel rich, juvenated, they
10:01
Speaker 1: feel empowered, they have more confidence simply just by giving
10:05
Speaker 1: them a haircut. This opportunity to not only look better
10:10
Speaker 1: but also feel better gave Lorenzo an idea as he
10:13
Speaker 1: battled through his own turmoils. He would make the barbershop
10:17
Speaker 1: at place he knew, so intimately a valuable resource for
10:20
Speaker 1: his community. I didn't really address my own therapy to
10:24
Speaker 1: my later twenties. I was roughly coming out of college.
10:27
Speaker 1: I had a daughter at that point. I finished two
10:30
Speaker 1: college degrees. But I really felt lost. I felt really broken,
10:33
Speaker 1: I felt deprived, and I didn't feel happy. You know,
10:36
Speaker 1: the work that I was doing, I didn't feel that
10:38
Speaker 1: it was really uplifting me and encouraging. And then I
10:41
Speaker 1: really leaned in into thinking about the time I had
10:44
Speaker 1: spent working in the mental health facilities, my own story,
10:47
Speaker 1: and that's what allowed me to really arrive to this
10:50
Speaker 1: place of talking about my mental health, my own story
10:53
Speaker 1: as a public opportunity UM and they had now turned
10:56
Speaker 1: into an organization that's able to employ barbers and employ
10:59
Speaker 1: people to doing this work. And so I think, I
11:01
Speaker 1: really want to arrive because of my own journey. And
11:05
Speaker 1: I really feel that vulnerability was at the point of
11:07
Speaker 1: all of this. If I was not willing to be vulnerable,
11:11
Speaker 1: I don't believe that we will be where we are.
11:13
Speaker 1: I don't believe that I would have even empowered my
11:15
Speaker 1: staff those around me to do this work, and so
11:19
Speaker 1: I think as leaders we really have to lean in
11:21
Speaker 1: on vulnerability first, because I think it really builds comfort
11:25
Speaker 1: and trust amongst so many other people than what we
11:27
Speaker 1: probably may take for granted sometimes. The Confessed Project is
11:34
Speaker 1: a national grassroots movement that's committed to building a culture
11:39
Speaker 1: of mental health for black men and boys and their families.
11:42
Speaker 1: My vision of the organization is to ensure that every
11:47
Speaker 1: young black boy man between the ages of six and
11:49
Speaker 1: thirty five is seen and heard, and that truthfully, this
11:52
Speaker 1: will become an opportunity to expand nationally and internationally to
11:57
Speaker 1: other men, men of color, and just individuals across our
12:02
Speaker 1: country that can really relate to our work, that it
12:05
Speaker 1: will be seen as a way to you know, alleviate
12:08
Speaker 1: poverty and to increase mobility for themselves and their families.
12:12
Speaker 1: Because we know that when one has a positive mental health,
12:15
Speaker 1: that they have a positive traject their own life, and
12:18
Speaker 1: so we're committed to building that culture of mental health
12:21
Speaker 1: so that we can ensure that life is seen in
12:24
Speaker 1: the most positive and best ways possible. You said two
12:27
Speaker 1: words that really stuck with me. They were seen and heard.
12:30
Speaker 1: Why do you think black men aren't seen in her today,
12:34
Speaker 1: I believe that there's a lot of clutter, you know,
12:37
Speaker 1: when you think about the world, right, black men having
12:39
Speaker 1: to show up to protect, to serve, to be there
12:42
Speaker 1: for each other, to be there for family members, to
12:44
Speaker 1: take care of sick family members, to defend themselves, to
12:48
Speaker 1: watch themselves in media be torn apart killed, you know,
12:52
Speaker 1: just so many negative narratives. And so I believe also
12:57
Speaker 1: black men historically have been raised to really be strong,
13:01
Speaker 1: right in single parent homes, to do more, to show
13:03
Speaker 1: up more, to lead more. You're not able to really
13:07
Speaker 1: be seen and heard when you are giving away so
13:10
Speaker 1: much of your time and your energy. And so I
13:13
Speaker 1: believe that we allow for our work and what we
13:18
Speaker 1: do to take care of yourself. Right, so we increase
13:22
Speaker 1: opportunities around wellness, yoga, therapy, whatever they may be, to
13:27
Speaker 1: saying that in order for you to continue to give
13:29
Speaker 1: much as you give to your clients, you must give
13:32
Speaker 1: to yourself first. Right, that you must be the most
13:35
Speaker 1: precious object in your life, and that's yourself. And so
13:38
Speaker 1: a lot of times, even with Barbera's, you know, they're
13:41
Speaker 1: cutting here at a rapid speed, they're making money, they're
13:44
Speaker 1: going home to take care of family, and they're listening
13:46
Speaker 1: to people problems all day in and out throughout the week,
13:50
Speaker 1: and so we also are teaching them about wellness, about
13:53
Speaker 1: you know, hey, how to get a therapist, you know,
13:55
Speaker 1: how to when you're taking a break, how to shut off.
13:58
Speaker 1: You know, we have people on our games that are
14:00
Speaker 1: able to help them with mindfulness and different things that
14:03
Speaker 1: can help them and their clients. Right, and these just
14:06
Speaker 1: everyday thing. So what does training look like for these barbers?
14:10
Speaker 1: And talk to me more about how there's just no
14:12
Speaker 1: black people present within mental health services at all, Like
14:15
Speaker 1: my therapist isn't black, and this big gap around finding
14:19
Speaker 1: services for people that look like us in the world.
14:22
Speaker 1: It's a really authentic transaction that happens between active listening,
14:27
Speaker 1: you know, really showing barbers and those how to lean
14:30
Speaker 1: in the active listening validation, you know, how to validate
14:33
Speaker 1: ones feelings and emotions and possible communication, you know, how
14:36
Speaker 1: to communicate in a fair way where those really feel
14:40
Speaker 1: that they have their their right of way to being
14:43
Speaker 1: heard and being seen. And mental health stigma. How do
14:46
Speaker 1: you reduce stigma? How do we understand the negative language
14:49
Speaker 1: that ties into saying, oh, you're weak? How do we
14:52
Speaker 1: you know eradicate that language and lift those up and
14:55
Speaker 1: also to not judge and so and also you know,
14:58
Speaker 1: how do we give people to the res sources and
15:00
Speaker 1: help that they need. How do we help to refer
15:02
Speaker 1: someone all of these encompasses in our training that happens
15:05
Speaker 1: a little bit over an hour's time, and we do
15:07
Speaker 1: this virtually and in person. We've done this with a
15:09
Speaker 1: thousand barbers over forty cities across the United States. We
15:13
Speaker 1: recognize that just about two to three percent of African
15:16
Speaker 1: American that identify psychotrists in the United States. And so
15:19
Speaker 1: right now, the work that we're doing, we truthfully know
15:22
Speaker 1: that it's important for not only barber's to be on
15:25
Speaker 1: the front lines, but that in fact, it is very
15:27
Speaker 1: vital for us to as well partner with therapists systems
15:33
Speaker 1: and help to build ecosystems of coalitions of people that
15:38
Speaker 1: can help folks at the most intermediate way like listening,
15:41
Speaker 1: like validating, like giving just resources and helping people to
15:45
Speaker 1: understand that they're seen. And I think that's really important.
15:50
Speaker 1: Most people that go and sit in a barber's share
15:53
Speaker 1: within the Confessed project are no strangers to receiving advice
15:56
Speaker 1: during their hair services, But how do you break past
15:59
Speaker 1: the notions that can make the barbershop harmful, turning homophobia, misogyny,
16:04
Speaker 1: and stigma on its head. We have our core areas
16:08
Speaker 1: that we really focus on, and I think that's really
16:11
Speaker 1: important that we lean in on that. But we also
16:14
Speaker 1: make it very clear they in our trainings around our
16:17
Speaker 1: focus groups that we offered that you know, hey, this
16:21
Speaker 1: is what we need to get out to the masses,
16:24
Speaker 1: and this is what we don't need to get out
16:25
Speaker 1: to the message. And I believe that's where we really
16:27
Speaker 1: stand in you know, a part of this sales barbershops
16:30
Speaker 1: are the most unapologetic place in the black community. I
16:33
Speaker 1: mean that people can really beat themselves, They can say
16:36
Speaker 1: what they want to say, and they should be able
16:38
Speaker 1: to want to do that because you know, there's so
16:40
Speaker 1: many institutions in areas in life where we have to
16:44
Speaker 1: restrict ourselves, we have to feel like we have to
16:46
Speaker 1: role play and playing to a narrative that's not true.
16:49
Speaker 1: And so we in fact really want people to just
16:51
Speaker 1: know that they can have it hanging out, but that
16:53
Speaker 1: when in fact that there's time to really focus on
16:56
Speaker 1: the positive, that that's what we really show up and
16:59
Speaker 1: do this work, and so you know, even times that
17:01
Speaker 1: we're doing our trainings, you know, I recognize that there
17:03
Speaker 1: are people that are have in vogal language and sometimes
17:06
Speaker 1: there are children there, and you know, unfortunately somebody may
17:10
Speaker 1: be a part of that conversation that may not have
17:12
Speaker 1: shout of or maybe somebody don't agree about something. They're
17:15
Speaker 1: going back and forth about a sports argument or something
17:18
Speaker 1: that's going on with the police in the community. I
17:21
Speaker 1: think that those are natural things that need to happen.
17:24
Speaker 1: I think that what we do with mental health is
17:26
Speaker 1: showing people that we can have balance, we do need
17:29
Speaker 1: to have self control, and that also we have resources
17:33
Speaker 1: that are available. This is not a one size for all.
17:36
Speaker 1: Everybody has a unique way of being seen and heard,
17:39
Speaker 1: and I think that some people are just going to
17:42
Speaker 1: show up as themselves. That is brilliant because my biggest
17:46
Speaker 1: issue with a lot of community conversations or community inventions
17:49
Speaker 1: is that it has this expectation for people to be
17:52
Speaker 1: perfect when they show up, but most people are very
17:54
Speaker 1: imperfect or people just don't know better. And the better
17:57
Speaker 1: way to engage with any person, whether you don't agree
18:00
Speaker 1: with him politically or ideologically or anywhere, is to meet
18:03
Speaker 1: them where they're at, and it sounds like that's what
18:05
Speaker 1: you're doing every day without shame or stick mind. You know,
18:08
Speaker 1: we we've had a lot of people even pushed back
18:10
Speaker 1: to mental health. Shouldn't you know, obviously take place or
18:14
Speaker 1: we shouldn't be you know, really engaging. But you know,
18:17
Speaker 1: the truth of the matter is we're talking about a
18:20
Speaker 1: population of people that have poor access to services, that
18:24
Speaker 1: are in poverty, that our highs, you know, massive carceration,
18:27
Speaker 1: and the list goes on and own. You know, we
18:30
Speaker 1: we've had Barber's that's a part of his work that
18:32
Speaker 1: totally did not agree with this when we started. And
18:35
Speaker 1: then they may have reached out and said, you know what, man,
18:38
Speaker 1: I had a family member their own drugs, and you
18:41
Speaker 1: know what, you were right, I need to figure out
18:43
Speaker 1: a way that my family can deal with this now.
18:45
Speaker 1: But what if we never crossed paths with that gentleman
18:48
Speaker 1: like he would have no way of really connecting that
18:50
Speaker 1: and maybe he would have went off and exploded with
18:53
Speaker 1: somebody because he was upset, and so now he had
18:56
Speaker 1: an outlet. And so that's why, you know, it may
18:58
Speaker 1: not be their time, but the fact that this model
19:00
Speaker 1: is in place, it's definitely gonna be evident that it
19:03
Speaker 1: will be helpful to someone. Um, it's incredible, and you know,
19:07
Speaker 1: you all have not only been successful in doing linkage
19:09
Speaker 1: the care work, but you've been so good at what
19:11
Speaker 1: you're doing that you collaborated with Harvard University to study
19:14
Speaker 1: some of us work. Talk to me about that research
19:17
Speaker 1: and what findings did Harvard find from talking to barber's
19:21
Speaker 1: the findings that we got out of it. You know,
19:23
Speaker 1: I think it's about roughly thirty thirty five barbers comprised
19:26
Speaker 1: of so many states that we've been in that we've
19:27
Speaker 1: worked with, and one of the high level things that
19:30
Speaker 1: we recognize is that barbers can be seen as mental
19:33
Speaker 1: health and suicide prevention gatekeepers and also seen as those
19:37
Speaker 1: who can eradicate and a personal community violence. We also
19:42
Speaker 1: recognized in that study that the work that we do
19:45
Speaker 1: can really be ramped up into supporting those who are
19:49
Speaker 1: doing work around domestic violence, those that are doing work
19:53
Speaker 1: around community violence, because those barbers are really on the
19:57
Speaker 1: front lines of bringing peace into our communities. And so
20:00
Speaker 1: even though we're there talking about mental health, in fact,
20:04
Speaker 1: there was also studies there where you know, men talked
20:08
Speaker 1: about how they stopped someone from going to commit a
20:11
Speaker 1: crime they want to commit a homicide or take someone's
20:14
Speaker 1: life because of something that happened, and that Barbara was
20:17
Speaker 1: able to stop that right because of the relationship. You know,
20:20
Speaker 1: we recognize in some of our studies that sometimes it's
20:23
Speaker 1: not just a therapist going into the barbershop, that it
20:26
Speaker 1: may be a community leader that needs to speak the language.
20:29
Speaker 1: So a pastor or a city council person or someone
20:33
Speaker 1: that's really respected could be very received just as much
20:36
Speaker 1: as a therapist. So although therapists are in demand for
20:39
Speaker 1: giving this work and being clinical and during their part,
20:42
Speaker 1: I truthfully think we have to understand that the people
20:46
Speaker 1: in these communities really trust the people that they know,
20:50
Speaker 1: and if they don't know you, it's very hard for
20:52
Speaker 1: them to open up to you. And so I think
20:55
Speaker 1: that's where the challenge really comes in, is that we
20:58
Speaker 1: have to know that everybody he does not look at
21:01
Speaker 1: the systems and institutions that we know as a way
21:05
Speaker 1: to take care of them. Some people look at them
21:06
Speaker 1: it's oh, no, they're here to hurt me. So everybody
21:10
Speaker 1: has to be armed with the information right so that
21:13
Speaker 1: they can help people that may be very hard to reach,
21:16
Speaker 1: and I think that's where we become very powerful because
21:19
Speaker 1: these barbers maybe halfway graduated high school. They may be
21:23
Speaker 1: ex drug dealers or whatever case may be, but they
21:26
Speaker 1: can save a life sometime faster than a guy in
21:28
Speaker 1: a white coat. Why is it that you're so committed
21:32
Speaker 1: and get so much, I guess life out of this
21:35
Speaker 1: work that so many people aren't willing to take on.
21:39
Speaker 1: It's personal to me, you know. I was checking to
21:41
Speaker 1: a mental health hospital at the age of ten years
21:44
Speaker 1: old after my dad passed away, and um, they thought
21:48
Speaker 1: it was just a matter of behavior issues and anger.
21:51
Speaker 1: But I was struggling from depression at an early age,
21:53
Speaker 1: grappling the grief and the issues around his death, not
21:57
Speaker 1: having my mother and father in my life, get involved
21:59
Speaker 1: in games, been incarcerated, being diagnosed with major depression in
22:03
Speaker 1: my twenties. It's personal to me because I never felt
22:06
Speaker 1: that I was truthfully seen and heard and that nobody
22:09
Speaker 1: really I always grew up feeling that no one really
22:12
Speaker 1: understood who I was and how I felt. And I
22:15
Speaker 1: know that a lot of other black men, black women,
22:19
Speaker 1: black trans folks, you know who whomever has maybe a
22:23
Speaker 1: part of our communities feel the same way that I do,
22:27
Speaker 1: and so I want to ensure that not only this
22:30
Speaker 1: story is a way to grow, but it's also it's
22:35
Speaker 1: a way for me to speak to my younger self
22:36
Speaker 1: and say that I'm willing to do more to help
22:39
Speaker 1: more people that then look like me. So that's incredible.
22:43
Speaker 1: And do you feel seen and heard today? Absolutely? Absolutely, UM,
22:47
Speaker 1: And I believe a lot of this work has really
22:49
Speaker 1: helped me to heal tremendously. As being an advocate for
22:52
Speaker 1: mental health, I believe that I've had to really be
22:56
Speaker 1: very critical about my own mental health and also ensuring
22:59
Speaker 1: that UM taking care of myself. And so I think
23:02
Speaker 1: that I've been able to do that, and so I'm
23:05
Speaker 1: really really grateful that doing this work has really helped
23:09
Speaker 1: me to, I think, to really look at healing and
23:12
Speaker 1: look at everything that I do and really approach it
23:15
Speaker 1: with intention and approaching from a benefit analysis of how
23:18
Speaker 1: how's it taking care of me? And how can I
23:20
Speaker 1: give to others? And my final question for you before
23:23
Speaker 1: I let you go back to your life doing a
23:25
Speaker 1: lot of work, important work, is what advice do you
23:27
Speaker 1: have for folks who are feeling anxious about engaging in
23:31
Speaker 1: any type of mental health service? Or talking to someone
23:33
Speaker 1: to get help, especially man be optimistic and taking a
23:37
Speaker 1: day at a time, being open to change and trusting
23:42
Speaker 1: your good And I also know that healing is not linear. No,
23:45
Speaker 1: healing is a lifetime You know that once you've went
23:48
Speaker 1: through a traumatic issue, you go through therapy. You know,
23:50
Speaker 1: you don't just get well. Let me It's a lifetime journey.
23:54
Speaker 1: Is just like working on a marriage, working on you know,
23:57
Speaker 1: a fitness goal, working on whatever that may be. Healing
24:00
Speaker 1: is not linear. It is a lifetime's work. And I
24:03
Speaker 1: think once we commit to that and we know that
24:06
Speaker 1: we're better off. And we always tell our barbers, they're like, hey,
24:08
Speaker 1: you know, it may not be you, it may be
24:10
Speaker 1: a family member, but in fact, someday this will be important.
24:18
Speaker 1: Lorenzo highlights an important point when he says that healing
24:21
Speaker 1: is not linear because like most things in life, it
24:24
Speaker 1: isn't a straight shot. Grief isn't linear, trauma isn't linear,
24:28
Speaker 1: and the solutions to most problems are almost never a
24:30
Speaker 1: one size fits all. But it's how we show up
24:33
Speaker 1: in the world every day for ourselves and for others
24:36
Speaker 1: that makes us more successful on our road to healing.
24:39
Speaker 1: Despite our imperfections. This has been in the deep Stories
24:47
Speaker 1: that shape us. Find this episode and others on the
24:50
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
24:53
Speaker 1: to podcasts. Don't forget to share, rate, and review if
24:56
Speaker 1: you enjoyed this conversation. This show is produced by Von
24:59
Speaker 1: Chien and master by James Foster. Our show researcher is
25:02
Speaker 1: John and Raggio and our writer is Yvette Lopez. A
25:05
Speaker 1: special shout out to our guest Lorenzo Lewis. I'm your host,
25:08
Speaker 1: Zack Stafford