Latest / The Lila Rose Show / How Early Christianity Outlasted a Hostile Roman Empire w/Voice of Reason | Lila Rose Show (BONUS)

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How Early Christianity Outlasted a Hostile Roman Empire w/Voice of Reason | Lila Rose Show (BONUS) · The Lila Rose Show

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  Christian religion is what built the Western civilization.
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  This idea of human dignity, that idea did not exist in the
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  ancient world. A lot of people don't know that
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  it was the Christian community that actually invented the
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  concept of adoption. They were taking care of the
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  sick, the elderly, the dying, widows, orphans, and Saint
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  Lawrence was like here are our treasures their.
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  Faith was so strong that they would withstand that kind of
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  torture. That's what we always need to
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  remember the Saints. We always need to remember the
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  early Christian martyrs. We always need to remember how
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  old the apostles died, were killed and they were murdered
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  and they were persecuted. Welcome back to the Lila Rose
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  Show. We are now doing Part 2 here.
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  With Alejandro Jurado. Christian apologist talking not
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  just about early Christianity and what the early church looked
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  like in its development. We're actually going to be
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  exploring what early Christians were like.
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  What was it like for the first Christians to find faith,
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  Especially in the Roman Empire, which, you know, I know there's
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  that me men are always thinking about the Roman Empire, but the
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  Roman Empire was a pretty crazy and intense space where there
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  was a lot of violence. There was certainly a
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  civilization, but the moral code certainly looked different from
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  a Christian moral code. So we're going to be exploring
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  that and also get into the topic of martyrdom and the fact that a
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  lot of early Christians were martyred.
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  So lots of fascinating stuff to unpack here in this episode with
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  Alex Dorado. And don't forget, we've just
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  launched our own supercast. This is where you're going to
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  see the Rose Report. That's where you get to hang out
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  with me behind the scenes. We're going to do some great
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  upcoming guests and get questions so that I'll ask those
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  whole library of Lila Rose Show content ad free.
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  Go sign up at the link in the bio.
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  All right, Alex Jorado. Alejandro Jorado.
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  Oh, excuse. Me, Alejandro, practice it, OK.
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  Thank you for coming back. I'm excited to do this next
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  episode with you. This is the third time that
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  you've had me back, so I think it's a good sign.
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  Awesome. It means that I haven't bored
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  you or your audience, hopefully. Not at all.
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  Thank you not at all for having me here.
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  I'm excited to do this. Part 2 of the first, the second
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  of the first part, which is church history and the
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  Christians, what they were actually like, what they
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  experienced. Ancient Christianity is
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  fascinating, fascinating. One of my favorite things to
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  talk about. I'm a big history nerd, so.
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  So for people who don't know you yet or getting to know you, give
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  a quick snapshot about your background and how you've gone
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  about your own studies of Christianity, theology, the
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  early church, etcetera. Well, I've been studying for
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  half my life, self-taught. I've read countless, countless,
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  countless hundreds of books about about history, about how
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  Christianity developed from the time of using the apostles all
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  the way to the present day. 2000 years is quite a long time, but
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  Christian, I don't think there's anything that more fascinating
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  than Christian history. So I just want to know how it is
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  that we got to the to where we are now.
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  So yeah, half my life I'm an old man.
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  So half my life now that I've been that I've been studying and
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  the Christian history is very, it's very eye opening and you
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  realize, you know, we always talk about it, but you don't
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  really realize it until you actually go and you look at the
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  history that Christianity, the Christian religion is what built
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  Western civilization and Western civilization is impossible,
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  impossible to even exist without the Christian religion.
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  And looking into that, doing a deep dive into that it, it
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  really go, it makes you it makes you proud to be a Christian
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  because all of these things that that we have, that we are proud
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  of, that we enjoy, that we get to experience, we have because
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  of Jesus Christ and, and what he revealed to mankind.
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  So. I remember having that first
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  realization about Western civilization being built by
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  Christians when I was reading these books by Rodney Stark.
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  So he wrote Victory of Reason and these, you know, series of
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  books. He's actually a sociologist, but
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  he's also, you know, effectively doing history, but kind of
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  tracing, obviously economic developments, but really human
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  rights developments and how people associated with each
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  other, how communities were built and tracing a lot of what
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  we understand today as sort of more liberal human rights, like
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  treatment of women and children. You know, different ways that we
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  value people that are not as fortunate as the wealthy or the
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  powerful, Like, you know, people who are maybe the immigrant or
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  people who are poor. All of those values we're not
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  did not originate with, you know, Roman civilization or some
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  other civilization. They really originated with the
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  radical teachings of Jesus Christ.
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  It's a very cool thing to trace. It really is.
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  And then all goes back to the Incarnation.
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  So, you know, at the time of the day that we're recording this,
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  it is actually the Feast of the Annunciation.
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  So I think there is no more, there is no better day to be
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  talking about this than than today, because everything that
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  we hold fast to that we value comes from the fact that God
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  became man, that he became Incarnate, that he became a
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  baby. Your ministry, what you do, it's
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  all about protecting babies. And of course we want to protect
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  babies because God himself became a baby.
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  God himself was in the womb of a woman And, and God himself
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  started out as a, as a, as an embryo, A zygote and formed in
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  the womb of the, of the Blessed Virgin Mary and was born into
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  the world. And this, this woman, the
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  Blessed Virgin Mary, she had to feed him and care for him and
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  teach him how to walk and teach him how to talk and educate him.
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  And the reason that Christianity is really responsible for for
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  what we're discussing now about the teachings of intrinsic human
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  value is because they saw the full picture of it in the
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  incarnation. Jesus Christ becoming man Jesus
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  Christ God becoming man. He was sanctifying the human
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  species, the human race. He was he was making us divine
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  and if we're all made in the image of God, especially after
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  the incarnation. That's why the Christians, they
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  they knew we have to respect all human life and we have to care
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  is for the most vulnerable because our Lord was once a
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  vulnerable baby that you know, the the the powers that we
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  wanted. It wanted him dead, wanted to
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  kill him and that's why his family had to flee.
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  What was the early church like? We were talking about how they
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  worshipped and Part 1 and we were talking about, you know,
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  the development of liturgy, kind of an authority structure in the
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  early church, how they worshipped together, how they
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  saw breaking of the bread or Eucharist.
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  So we were discussing all that in the first episode.
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  I'd love to look into or explore with you how they saw you just
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  mentioned children and and you know all people is made in the
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  image of God and also Jesus Christ taking on human flesh
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  like that was a foundational understanding of a new way to
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  see their brothers and sisters other human beings.
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  But what what does that look like?
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  So you're at let's say we're in the 1st century post the
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  resurrection of Christ. The early churches starting what
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  what would it mean for the early Christian when they're also may
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  be a Roman, you know, citizen or they're, you know, Jew person of
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  a Jewish background. So they're kind of living under
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  Roman rule and now they have this new way to live, right?
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  It's not just how they worshipped that changed.
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  Obviously they're not worshipping the gods.
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  They're not just, you know, approaching it from a Jewish
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  tradition. They're now Christian and how
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  they worship. But how did it affect their
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  relationships or their day-to-day life otherwise?
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  Well, and this is something that shocks a lot of people.
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  A lot of people don't realize that this idea of human dignity,
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  that idea did not exist in the ancient world, The ancient
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  world, that the ancient people had no concept of intrinsic
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  human value that cannot be violated or should, that should
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  not be violated. Ancient people did not have
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  that. That concept.
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  That concept came straight out of the early Christian
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  community. We talked a little bit about
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  this last time about the dedicated, which is 1 of it was
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  the earliest written Christian document that we have that was
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  written around the same time that the New Testament was being
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  written. And the delicay explicitly says
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  that abortion is is evil abortion.
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  So this you know, the Christian community being pro-life is
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  something that goes all the way back.
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  The Christian community being anti abortion is something that
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  goes all the way back to the time of the apostles.
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  A lot of people don't know that it was the Christian community
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  that actually invented the concept of of adoption and like
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  orphanages. Because in the ancient world,
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  when babies were born, if they had birth defects or if there
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  was something, anything with the baby was born sick, they would
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  actually leave the baby out in the elements to just to just to
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  die because that baby was was worthless.
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  That baby was no good in the ancient world.
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  A mother would not have that concept, that idea of having
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  that connection with her, with her child, that she would be
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  found with her child being taken away to be dumped, you know, in
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  the landfill. And it was the early Christians
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  that went and saved all of those babies and would take those
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  babies into their own communities.
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  And, and that's how, you know, orphanages started adoption.
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  That's how that started. Adoption is something that did
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  not exist in the ancient world. You don't, you know, you can
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  take people to slaves, you can maybe take someone in as a, you
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  know, the way that you were taking, you know, someone that
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  maybe like live with you because they're going to be your, your
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  servant, a Butler, so to speak, whatever it may be.
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  But the Christian community took in all of these babies and
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  raised them as their own, raised them in the faith, raised them
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  as Christians and, and gave them the, the love of the love of
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  Jesus Christ and, and showed them that they had intrinsic
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  value that we all have. And they were the ones that said
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  that that that value cannot be, cannot be violated.
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  And that was ancient, ancient, ancient Christians that we're
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  the code Lila. I think it's for like the modern
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  sensibility. It's hard for us to sometimes
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  understand what it was like. Obviously in the Roman Empire,
• 10:53
  that's not where we live. And you know, I know that's like
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  a meme right now. What is, you know, men are
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  always thinking about the Roman Empire.
• 10:58
  But I remember reading this letter.
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  I just pulled it up and this is from a, my understanding is this
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  is a man who's like a soldier and he's away from his wife and
• 11:07
  his home. He's in the Roman Empire.
• 11:08
  He's like a, you know, hail Caesar kind of guy.
• 11:10
  He's out there. I don't know what war he's
• 11:12
  fighting, but he's writing a letter about his to his pregnant
• 11:17
  wife, basically. And he says Hilarion sends many,
• 11:21
  many greetings to his sister, along with Lady Barrios and
• 11:23
  Apollo Niorian. Listen, we are still in
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  Alexandria. Don't worry about this.
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  If they go home completely, I will still stay in Alexandria.
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  I'm asking you and begging you to take care of the little child
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  and when we are paid, I will send it to you right away if you
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  happen to be pregnant again. If it is a boy, leave it.
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  If it is a girl, throw it out and then it says you have told
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  Afro diciosis, don't forget me. How could I possibly forget you?
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  Please do not be worried. So it's a very kind of warm and
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  loving letter, but it's remarkable because it's actually
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  from a father to presumably his wife or his, you know, I'm
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  assuming it's a wife, but basically saying take care of
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  our child, our son. I will pay, I will send money,
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  I'll be there to help you. He's off at war or whatever.
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  But if it's a, if it is a girl, literally throw out the baby,
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  leave her to be. And this was like a normal, this
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  wasn't like, oh, shocking murder a.
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  Child. What's that?
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  That's a pleasant letter when you just read.
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  That's a, it's meant to be like a pleasant, like loving, like I
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  got you, you know, if it's a boy, take care of it.
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  If it's a girl, just, you know, throw it away.
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  It's not a big deal. And like this was normal.
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  Now I, I can't help but say, like here we are in 21st century
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  America and it's super normal too, to be like, I'm going to
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  abort this baby. You know, that like it's
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  infanticide is normal today. Now like it wasn't the Roman
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  Empire, but to the Christians it was never normal.
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  It's interesting because we talk about the meme, right, that
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  we're always thinking about the Roman Empire and people that,
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  that criticize that they say like, oh, that's who cares about
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  what happens so long ago? We're better than those people.
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  We, we tend to think that we modern people are better or have
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  a, a, a greater grasp of morality than ancient people
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  precisely because, you know, we, we're talking about how, you
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  know, the ancient people that we just throw out babies and we
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  think we're better than them. But then, you know, do they not
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  see what's going on, what's been going on in this country, you
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  know, you know, since the 70s. And what we're doing is way
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  worse than what they were doing back then because.
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  The sheer. The sheer number, you mean?
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  Yeah, yeah. Like a million abortions.
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  A. Year, yes, Yeah. 1,000,000
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  abortions a year just in the United.
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  States, you know, tearing babies, ripping out of the, you
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  know, ripping them out of the womb even.
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  And you know, the Romans at least had the distances.
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  Let the baby child be born first and and not kill them, but just
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  leave them, you know, leave them to die.
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  I mean, that's, I mean, we do that here too, you know, but the
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  more things change, the more things stay the same.
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  And, and it's good to know history like the same goes.
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  You got to learn your history so you don't repeat it, so you
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  don't make the same mistakes because history rhymes.
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  Well, we're not that far removed.
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  We still have a lot of work to do.
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  The other big thing alongside the treatment of children and
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  and babies was sex sexuality, because the way that the Romans
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  viewed sex was very different than the way that the Christians
• 14:02
  viewed sex. What are your thoughts on that?
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  And I actually pulled up the didiki.
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  We can read from this too, if we want.
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  We're actually specifically talks about this, but it's very
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  fascinating to think about how dramatically different Christian
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  teaching on sex was from typically what was understood in
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  the Roman. Empire, right?
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  What we, what the Christians understood was that sex is
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  something that's that's holy and that sex is actually when you,
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  you know, when you and your spouse participate in the
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  marital act, and especially when it results in, in, in the
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  creation of a new life, that you are actually participating in
• 14:34
  the life giving Trinity in the Holy Trinity.
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  Because you know, as Christians, what was revealed to us by Jesus
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  Christ is that the one God is a Trinity, that he's father, Son,
• 14:43
  the Holy Spirit. And the way that it was always
• 14:46
  understood by Christians about how those three persons relate
• 14:49
  to one another is that you have the lover who is the father, you
• 14:52
  have the beloved who is the Son, and you have the love between
• 14:56
  the father and the son that is actually a third person and
• 14:58
  that's the Holy Spirit. So one marriage, one family, one
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  couple, one husband and wife, when they come together and
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  they, they participate in the, in, in, in the life creating
• 15:09
  act, they are imitating the Holy Trinity and they're creating new
• 15:15
  life because the Trinity is life creating.
• 15:18
  And they understood that the early Christians, the ancient
• 15:20
  Christian community had the, they had that, that wisdom to
• 15:23
  understand the, the holiness of sex.
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  A lot of people have it backwards.
• 15:28
  They think that us Christians that were prudish or whatever it
• 15:30
  may be that we don't like sex or that we, we think it's, it's
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  bad. No, it's, it's actually the
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  holiest thing, one of the holiest things that you can do
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  when you do it in the context of marriage and when you do it for,
• 15:41
  for being open to life, for the purpose of creating a life, for,
• 15:44
  for the procreation and education of children.
• 15:47
  They understood it. This, this is, this is what God
• 15:49
  revealed to us. This is the Trinity.
• 15:51
  This is how the Trinity works. We all know about the, the
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  excesses of the, of the pagans. You know, in ancient times, they
• 15:58
  were very, they were a very hyper sexualized culture, very
• 16:01
  hyper sexualized. And it took the Christian
• 16:04
  community to kind of, you know, get the world eventually, once
• 16:07
  Christianity took over the world, to snap out of it and to
• 16:10
  realize that there's a God-given dignity to sex and sexuality.
• 16:14
  It's an interesting question to explore of the kind of
• 16:17
  hypersexuality and lack of sexual morality in the Roman
• 16:21
  Empire and then what Christianity came and presented.
• 16:25
  And then today, because we have hypersexuality today, obviously
• 16:29
  like rampant pornography, hookup culture, shack up culture.
• 16:33
  But it does look different today in some aspects, I would say
• 16:36
  than the Roman Empire. Obviously it's still there's,
• 16:39
  it's not moral, right? But my understanding of the
• 16:41
  Roman Empire is that there was much more of a, you know,
• 16:45
  stratified society where there were people that were more, you
• 16:50
  know, in power than others based on their class and, you know,
• 16:55
  women as an example. You definitely had some like,
• 16:57
  well, very well off women who had more power, say, than like a
• 17:00
  slave girl as an example. But largely speaking, they were
• 17:04
  more seen as property than they were seen as persons who could
• 17:07
  then own property. Not that none of them could own
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  property, but their rights were different, largely speaking,
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  than men's rights, you know, in civil society.
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  And this affected issues of sex because there was this view of
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  children and women that they could be used as objects for
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  sexual lust, basically by someone who is more powerful
• 17:27
  than them. And so this is where you get the
• 17:28
  practice of, you know, men using young boys as sexual, basically
• 17:33
  toys in the Roman Empire. And this was sort of a common
• 17:36
  practice. Not everyone did it, but it was
• 17:38
  a common practice. And today, we have a lot of
• 17:41
  sexual immorality. But there's these rules about
• 17:43
  consent, right? Which kind of try to put a
• 17:45
  veneer on it, although obviously it doesn't make it, you know,
• 17:48
  moral, obviously. And then you also have women
• 17:52
  today who are now also the drivers have sexual immorality,
• 17:56
  I would argue more than in the Roman Empire, because now
• 17:59
  they're like out there selling themselves.
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  In the Roman Empire, it was more that they were being sold,
• 18:04
  right, because they didn't have full ownership.
• 18:05
  And now they have, I guess you could say, full ownership.
• 18:08
  Autonomy Entrepreneurs. There they have a million girls
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  on only fans or whatever the number is.
• 18:13
  It's insane. So it's like the same sexual
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  immorality, but the power dynamics might look different.
• 18:20
  But it's still a mess, still a. Mess.
• 18:22
  And so it's just an interesting, I'm curious your thoughts
• 18:24
  because it's an interesting thought experiment of like, even
• 18:26
  if you change power dynamics, like women and men are equal
• 18:29
  under the law, that doesn't solve the problem of sexual
• 18:34
  immorality. Like you have to add on the
• 18:36
  aspect of basically Christian belief and a moral law.
• 18:39
  And it doesn't even have to be Christian.
• 18:41
  You can you can assent to the moral law even even as a non
• 18:43
  Christian. But I think Jesus Christ
• 18:45
  obviously gives us the why or why we would have sent.
• 18:48
  But yeah, what it what's your kind of take on that?
• 18:49
  The difference of today versus the Roman Empire in terms of
• 18:53
  sexual immorality and then the Christian response to it.
• 18:55
  Yeah, again, the more that things change, the more things
• 18:58
  stay the same. And you would think that we've
• 18:59
  come such a, a long way removed from, from those ancient times.
• 19:04
  And when you compare us to them, you actually see, again, so many
• 19:08
  similarities. It's really not all that
• 19:10
  different except that now we have, you know, women now
• 19:13
  they're empowered. They, they think that it's
• 19:15
  empowering for them to be able to be their own, be their own
• 19:19
  pimps. You know, that's basically what
• 19:21
  it is. Be the, the entrepreneurs that
• 19:22
  they're able to, you know, sell themselves even virtually online
• 19:26
  for, for the, the gratification of, of men and women.
• 19:32
  They think that that makes them feel empowered.
• 19:36
  So we're just, we're actually a lot more liberal now than even
• 19:40
  they were back then because a, a, a woman would not go into
• 19:42
  business for herself, so to speak.
• 19:44
  Back in ancient times, it was always the men that that run the
• 19:47
  show. But it we're we're really still
• 19:50
  in the same situation by and large, especially in this
• 19:52
  country. And it's interesting because
• 19:56
  there's no amount of laws or, or or or, you know, regulation is
• 19:59
  ever going to solve the sin problem, the concupiscence, the
• 20:02
  problem of concupiscence. That's something that no laws
• 20:05
  can never can never fix. Now we need to have good more
• 20:08
  than just laws. And I'm all for, of course, a
• 20:11
  complete ban on abortion, banning pornography.
• 20:15
  You know, banning, you know, yes, yes, it's.
• 20:19
  A no brainer. Yes, we need to get rid of all
• 20:21
  of that and we need to incur because it, you know, the, the
• 20:23
  point of laws is for society to be able to run correctly.
• 20:29
  That's what laws are for. But we've gotten to the point
• 20:31
  where we've lost sight of why, why we have laws to begin with.
• 20:35
  And we've also forgotten that the family is the, the, the, the
• 20:38
  nucleus of society, right? Society isn't built on, on, on
• 20:42
  the individual. That society is built on the
• 20:43
  family. Civilization is built on the
• 20:45
  family. So all of our laws and our ways
• 20:47
  of life and our philosophy needs to be centered around the idea
• 20:51
  that the family is what builds society.
• 20:53
  So we need to incentivize the family, but all of our laws are
• 20:59
  backwards because we allow for certain things that actually
• 21:03
  undermine, you know, that undermine the family.
• 21:06
  We, we, we, our laws encourage, it seems like our laws encourage
• 21:10
  broken homes and, and divorce and promiscuity.
• 21:14
  And it, it makes sense why we're in the mess that we're in today
• 21:18
  because we've lost sight of the fact that the family is number
• 21:20
  1. So again, we need, we need good
• 21:24
  laws, but even then we can have all of the good laws on the
• 21:27
  books and that, but that doesn't change the fact that we all deal
• 21:29
  with with concupiscence. And The thing is that the reason
• 21:35
  that especially sex is something that is so that is a problem for
• 21:41
  everybody. And that's why that's always the
• 21:42
  the sin of any culture or any society is always that is
• 21:46
  because sex is good. It's because it's good, but
• 21:50
  because it's something good and even holy, we don't know.
• 21:54
  We, we abuse things that are good.
• 21:56
  We abuse things that are good. And our, our, our society has
• 22:00
  allowed for the abuse of something that is holy,
• 22:02
  something that is sacred. And when you abuse, you know,
• 22:05
  something that's holy, when you abuse something that's sacred,
• 22:08
  that's called desecration. And when we desecrate sex, when
• 22:11
  we desecrate the family, when we desecrate women, when we even
• 22:14
  desecrate babies, you think God is going to be happy with us?
• 22:19
  Sex belongs to God. He gave it to us for a purpose.
• 22:22
  He was the one that said me food for the multiply.
• 22:24
  He was the one that tells us how.
• 22:25
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  checkout to get up to 25% off your first purchase as well as
• 23:12
  your free gift. We got sex wrong today
• 23:16
  societally and it's a big problem in the Roman Empire,
• 23:19
  though, they got sex wrong and they also had slavery.
• 23:23
  So you have this especially lethal combo of you got sex
• 23:27
  wrong. You don't understand that it's
• 23:28
  for procreation and unity within a marriage, right?
• 23:30
  The Christian teaching is like sex is designed for procreation
• 23:33
  within marriage, which is this loving, sacred bond, you know,
• 23:37
  exclusive, faithful, lifelong self gift to man and a woman.
• 23:41
  You know, until death do us part like this is a very sacred
• 23:43
  institution. It's a sacrament versus OK, sex
• 23:47
  is not for babies. If there's a baby, we can kill
• 23:49
  it, right? Which we do that today.
• 23:50
  But then in addition, you can literally enslave people,
• 23:53
  including children, certainly women, and enslave them and use
• 23:57
  them for sex. And this was a common practice
• 23:59
  in the Roman Empire. Slavery was a common practice,
• 24:01
  of course, but in addition to just, you know, slavery to work
• 24:04
  for you, it's slavery to be your sex slave.
• 24:07
  So that's like another. I mean, I do think as as hard as
• 24:10
  we should be on ourselves in the modern era for our failings.
• 24:14
  When you look at the, you know, this, this lethal convo of like
• 24:18
  sexual immorality and slavery, you open that it's it's even
• 24:21
  darker. I mean, there's lots of darkness
• 24:23
  today. It's hard to say which is
• 24:24
  darker. There's different ways to to
• 24:26
  balance it. But you know, I think about that
• 24:29
  in the Roman Empire. I think about the fact that, you
• 24:32
  know, you have these public gains of violence, you know, the
• 24:34
  gladiator, the games you have, you know, obviously the
• 24:38
  Colosseum where they would watch people die for sport.
• 24:41
  Culture of death. Yeah, culture of death.
• 24:43
  I mean, today at minimum, we don't have like big stadiums
• 24:46
  like in America, our big stadiums, we watch football and
• 24:49
  the Roman Empire, the big stadiums.
• 24:50
  They did watch some sports. It wasn't like they didn't do
• 24:52
  sports, but they also had like kill games.
• 24:54
  It was literally kill games and and the Christians were
• 24:56
  sometimes be those that were killed.
• 24:58
  And the other thing is the public executions, because I
• 25:01
  think the torture of, you know, dissidents, people they
• 25:05
  considered criminals, you know, political enemies, literal like
• 25:10
  public crucifixions, some of the like extremely gory ways they
• 25:14
  killed the early Christians. I think about Nero, right?
• 25:18
  And he, he would literally stick them on torches and set them on
• 25:21
  fire around the whole city. So you think about stuff like
• 25:24
  that and you're like, OK, super dark.
• 25:26
  Like today we have a culture of death.
• 25:28
  Like that's like very extreme darkness culture of death
• 25:32
  happening. But yeah, so for the for the
• 25:35
  Christians who are who are, you know, have this new moral code
• 25:39
  for how to live that Jesus is offering and also is connected
• 25:42
  to Judaism, like the law, you know, so there's not like it was
• 25:45
  completely foreign to people like they they were morality
• 25:47
  from the Jews that they had about sex that was then added on
• 25:50
  by the Christians or, or developed more like, you know,
• 25:53
  fulfilled more. But so there's like new law for
• 25:56
  how to live, right. And then in addition, there's a
• 25:58
  threat. Yeah.
• 26:00
  The surrounding society not only doesn't live like you, but they
• 26:03
  actively want to kill you, right?
• 26:05
  Everything is summed up. Everything is set up in Saint
• 26:08
  Paul's. There are the Galatians where he
• 26:09
  says, he says in his letter to Galatia, he says in Jesus Christ
• 26:13
  there's no longer Jew or Gentile, there's no longer slave
• 26:16
  or free person. There's no longer even a man or
• 26:18
  woman, but we're all the same in Christ.
• 26:20
  It's. Crazy.
• 26:22
  It's a crazy teaching. We read that and we like, yeah,
• 26:24
  yeah, of course not like we. We take that for granted, but
• 26:26
  people don't realize how scandalous, how scandalous that
• 26:30
  would have been 2000 years ago when Paul wrote that, when
• 26:33
  saying Paul wrote that the scandal of such a thing, it, it,
• 26:37
  it, it, it was, it was groundbreaking to say there's no
• 26:40
  longer a man or woman, no longer a slave or free person, even no
• 26:45
  longer Jew nor Greek, but we're all one in Christ.
• 26:48
  That's a radical. That's so radical.
• 26:50
  And then you read another one of Paul's letters, his letter to,
• 26:53
  to Philemon, where he's telling Philemon who was, who was a
• 26:57
  Christian, who had a slave. And we're telling him, Hey, own
• 27:00
  SMS your slave. I'm going to send him back to
• 27:02
  you. And when you receive him, don't
• 27:04
  receive him as a slave anymore. Receiving him as a brother.
• 27:07
  Receive him as a brother. Philemon, you read that.
• 27:11
  It's what it's the shortest writing of Saint Paul.
• 27:13
  And when you read it, you're like you almost you're like, why
• 27:15
  is this in the Bible? This is kind of weird.
• 27:16
  Like what does this have to do with anything?
• 27:18
  And you it's only 1 chapter and you read it.
• 27:21
  And the reason that it's that that it's in there, it's
• 27:23
  groundbreaking that he would say to a fellow Jew and say, hey,
• 27:26
  the slave that I'm sending back to you, he's your equal.
• 27:29
  Receive him the way you would receive me as a brother.
• 27:31
  So the message there is, and also there's a lot of messages
• 27:35
  about the, the correct treatment of, you know, your servants or
• 27:39
  women or children, things like this.
• 27:40
  But the message there is, you know, he's not, he's not your
• 27:43
  slave, he's not your slave. And so as a Christian, you are
• 27:46
  not allowed to have a slave. Because we all belong to Christ.
• 27:49
  Yeah, yeah. We're not allowed to have him.
• 27:51
  There were the church that, you know, they, they'd freed their
• 27:53
  slaves and that that's something that even in the Jewish
• 27:55
  tradition going back to, you know, to, to biblical times, Old
• 28:00
  Testament times that every Jubilee year, we're in a Jubilee
• 28:03
  year now. Every Jubilee year, all of the
• 28:04
  slaves would go free. All the slaves would go free.
• 28:07
  All debts were forgiven. All debts were, were, were were
• 28:10
  good. The books were balanced and all
• 28:12
  slaves would go free. That's something that continued
• 28:15
  into, into the Christian community just perpetually.
• 28:18
  No, no more slaves. We're all one in Christ.
• 28:20
  We're all the same of our brothers and sisters that didn't
• 28:24
  exist before, before Christianity.
• 28:27
  What were some other radical teachings of the early
• 28:30
  Christians or of Jesus obviously to the early Christians and his
• 28:34
  his disciples that we take for granted?
• 28:36
  You think today I kind of want to like pull open, you know, the
• 28:40
  right now the letters to Paul and just start listing them
• 28:41
  because they're, I mean, what you're describing is it's
• 28:44
  fascinating when you think about the lens of Roman society and
• 28:48
  current traditions at the time. The treatment of women, the
• 28:52
  treatment of women. Here's something crazy that a
• 28:55
  lot of people don't realize. When, when scholars do like the
• 28:58
  work of figuring out if an ancient document is reliable or
• 29:03
  not, they have this criteria called the criterion of like of
• 29:06
  of embarrassment. Meaning if it's something that
• 29:10
  would actually hurt their credibility, like socially, but
• 29:13
  they include it anyway. That's actually how we know that
• 29:16
  it really happened, that it was true, that it was real.
• 29:19
  And there are so many even like non Christian scholars that are
• 29:21
  just historians that they understood how how history
• 29:24
  played out and they understood the the customs of ancient
• 29:27
  history. When they look at the writings
• 29:29
  of the New Testament, they'll tell you they're like, look,
• 29:32
  this we know that this happened. This had to have happened
• 29:35
  because there's all of this dirty laundry in these writings
• 29:39
  that there is no way that they would have put these in there
• 29:42
  if, if this was a lie, if the apostles were lying, there is no
• 29:46
  way that they would have actually included all of these
• 29:48
  details in there because it actually hurts their
• 29:50
  credibility. And one of the things that that
• 29:52
  is always brought up is that Jesus appeared to women first.
• 29:56
  Jesus first appeared to women and in the ancient world after
• 29:59
  the resurrection, after the resurrection, after the
• 30:02
  resurrection, he appeared to women.
• 30:04
  And, and what a lot of people don't know is that women, they
• 30:08
  could not even give like testimony in court.
• 30:10
  They were not allowed to give because they were seeing their
• 30:12
  testimonies not reliable because they're women.
• 30:14
  Well, Jesus, when he rises from the dead, he appears to women.
• 30:17
  And what these, what these historians say is they said, we
• 30:20
  know that the apostles could not have been making this up.
• 30:22
  Because if this was just a made-up story, the apostles are
• 30:25
  trying to just dupe everybody into thinking that this Jesus
• 30:28
  character was really existed and that he really rose from the
• 30:30
  dead. There is no way, no way that
• 30:33
  they would have added that detail to the gospel that he
• 30:35
  appeared to women first. Because it's almost like
• 30:38
  they're, it's almost like they're making it harder for
• 30:40
  themselves. And because they included that
• 30:42
  it shows like, yeah, everything that we read about, like the
• 30:46
  embarrassing things that happen with, like with the apostles,
• 30:48
  all of the apostles left Jesus when he was going into his
• 30:51
  passion, that they doubted that one of them betrayed Jesus.
• 30:54
  That Peter who was the leader, that he denied him publicly 3
• 30:57
  times. All of that is so embarrassing.
• 30:59
  And then Mary's the one at the foot of the.
• 31:01
  Cross. Mary's the one at the foot of
• 31:02
  the cross with John. Who John you like.
• 31:04
  People don't realize that the Apostle John, he was, he was
• 31:06
  like a teenager. He was young.
• 31:07
  He was a young kid and so a woman and some young kid were
• 31:12
  the ones at the foot of the cross.
• 31:13
  You know, you know, seeing this, the guy that your whole religion
• 31:17
  is based around was executed like a like a criminal, like the
• 31:20
  worst type of criminal crucifixion.
• 31:23
  Every single detail that we read about in the gospel historians
• 31:27
  have included this had to have really happened because it it
• 31:30
  meets the criterion of embarrassment.
• 31:32
  If it was just a story, they would not have said this because
• 31:34
  they're trying to make it look as appealing and as credible as
• 31:37
  possible. This had to have really happened
• 31:39
  because in the ancient world, all of it from the first page of
• 31:41
  the New Testament to the last page scandalous.
• 31:44
  And that's how you know what's real.
• 31:45
  It's like a raw look raw look at it.
• 31:47
  And one of the the reasons is the way that Jesus and the early
• 31:51
  Christian community treated women.
• 31:53
  When you read about, you know, Paul addressing the women that
• 31:58
  he addressed, like in his letters, like in his episode of
• 32:00
  the Romans, and he addresses women with affection and with,
• 32:02
  with care, and he addresses them with dignity.
• 32:05
  And, and he, he shows that some of his helpers were women and
• 32:09
  that the women, the women in the early church were the ones that
• 32:12
  kind of, they helped the apostles and they were taking
• 32:15
  care of the apostles and they were helping them with, with
• 32:18
  whether it was food or shelter, whatever it is, the women were
• 32:21
  helping the men. And that's something that it's
• 32:24
  scandalous. You don't put that in something
• 32:26
  that you're in a written document because that makes the
• 32:31
  ancient people, the pagans back then would probably say that the
• 32:34
  other Christians were, I don't know, feminists.
• 32:38
  I've been accused of that too. I get accused of that
• 32:41
  occasionally. Isn't that crazy, right?
• 32:43
  But what? Does it mean what does it mean?
• 32:45
  I mean today, because that's the thing with like even that term,
• 32:47
  right? Like modern feminism as we
• 32:49
  understand today is looks insane abortion, all of this wild stuff
• 32:53
  right. But this idea of women elevated
• 32:55
  to have the same dignity as men, which is very much essential to
• 32:59
  Christian teaching is a is was a wildly just shocking claim for
• 33:04
  the Roman Empire. Like it was not something that
• 33:07
  people accept it easily. Especially when you consider the
• 33:10
  type of women that are highlighted like in the
• 33:12
  scriptures, like when Jesus talks to you know, to to the
• 33:15
  woman cut in adultery, right. That's.
• 33:17
  A great point. Yep.
• 33:18
  That they, they had pasts, right?
• 33:20
  The woman at the world where the with the five husbands with you
• 33:24
  see that and he's still elevates their dignity and he tells them
• 33:28
  go and sin no more. And they become part of the
• 33:30
  Christian community. And and they're they're they're
• 33:34
  famous in the early Christian community because of how close
• 33:36
  they are to Jesus and Jesus was able to transform them.
• 33:40
  That's unheard of in the ancient world, the way that that women
• 33:44
  were treated and respected and and and and elevated.
• 33:47
  Easter is a season to celebrate Jesus Christ, resurrection and
• 33:50
  go deeper into our faith. That's why I'm a big fan of
• 33:52
  Hollow App, which is the number one prayer app in the world.
• 33:55
  They have a whole series dedicated to helping you go
• 33:57
  deeper into your faith this Easter season, and they're doing
• 34:00
  a special on Jacques Philippe's interior freedom.
• 34:03
  This is a spiritual classic that I love and have been benefited
• 34:06
  by over the years to help us deepen our relationship with God
• 34:09
  and our freedom as God's sons and daughters.
• 34:12
  Hallo App also has thousands of prayers, prayers, meditations,
• 34:16
  sleep stories, and even worship music.
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  Some of the content is for kids. A lot of it is for adults.
• 34:21
  Really, anybody and everyone in the family will find something
• 34:24
  for them that they can do even on a daily basis on the Hallo
• 34:27
  app. So during this Easter season, I
• 34:29
  hope you deepen your prayer life and make use of the amazing tool
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• 34:34
  And you can try the Hallow app risk free and completely free
• 34:37
  for a full 3 months at hallow.com/lila.
• 34:41
  That's hallow.com/lila. The other thing that I find so
• 34:45
  fascinating, I love your thoughts on is this idea of
• 34:48
  virginity in the early church, because there are all these
• 34:52
  really intense virgin martyr stories coming out of the early
• 34:57
  church in the first few centuries where you have these
• 35:00
  young girls convert to Christianity and, and young
• 35:02
  guys, I mean, Saint Stephen is the first martyr.
• 35:04
  He's this young man who's like, you know, kill me now because I
• 35:07
  love Jesus and like he's stoned to death, right?
• 35:09
  So like, it's this young, young man.
• 35:11
  And then you have these early Christian martyr girls who were
• 35:15
  being told that they needed to get married and they literally
• 35:19
  died over being forced to marry. Like this is very interesting to
• 35:24
  me because their love was obviously focused on Jesus
• 35:26
  Christ. They'd made a promise to Jesus.
• 35:28
  They were a consecrated virgin and consecrated virginity
• 35:30
  existed before Christ. You know, the Jewish tradition
• 35:33
  had it. But my understanding is with
• 35:35
  early Christianity, this was this new thing of now I'm like
• 35:38
  married to Christ, like I'm imagining today, right?
• 35:40
  Let's just like for the thought experiment today, someone comes
• 35:44
  to a girl who's like, it's totally in love with Jesus and
• 35:46
  they're like, you got to marry this guy.
• 35:48
  He will treat you, you know, pretty nicely.
• 35:51
  He's not a Christian, but you know, he'll probably come around
• 35:54
  if you just work on him and pray for him.
• 35:56
  Or you can go be like stabbed to death, right, like burned at the
• 36:00
  stake, right, or, or whatever, you know, violent torture over
• 36:03
  here. And, and like, imagine a woman
• 36:05
  today being like, Oh, I'll choose the mayor.
• 36:07
  Like we'll do the, we'll do the work on this Pagan man and like,
• 36:10
  love him. And I'll try to like, you know,
• 36:12
  take. And usually he's like a faint,
• 36:13
  like he's in in these virgin martyr stories.
• 36:16
  It's usually like the emperor's son or like someone, you know,
• 36:18
  someone like of high rank and stuff.
• 36:20
  And so, but it's so fascinating to me that they're upheld, as,
• 36:24
  you know, martyrs for our admiration when they were
• 36:26
  literally dying, obviously for love of Christ.
• 36:29
  But I might be misreading the stories though, because I think
• 36:31
  obviously part of it was you need to now come under our
• 36:33
  religion. It's not just like.
• 36:34
  You can be a Christian. It's not like you can go
• 36:36
  worship, you know, Jesus Christ and be married to the emperor,
• 36:39
  you know, nobleman or something like this.
• 36:41
  So that's a very important detail, of course, but it's
• 36:43
  still fascinating to me that they were so in love with Jesus
• 36:48
  and I it was all about their unwillingness to submit to this,
• 36:53
  you know, man that wanted them both sexually and obviously
• 36:56
  wanted their their religious devotion.
• 36:58
  Yes, and you hear so many of these stories in the early.
• 37:00
  Years there's countless stories of of the virgin martyrs and
• 37:04
  that's because they they understood, they understood the
• 37:07
  purpose of sex, that sex is reserved for your spouse.
• 37:12
  They understood that. So for them that it was out of
• 37:14
  the question. Never think I could give myself
• 37:16
  to someone that isn't my spouse. So the way that they were
• 37:19
  thinking about it was if I am completely have given myself
• 37:24
  consecrated myself to Jesus and I'm he's my spouse now I cannot
• 37:29
  give my body to someone that isn't my spouse.
• 37:32
  That's why you know, in in in in Christianity, we have the
• 37:36
  beautiful discipline of our ordained ministers.
• 37:39
  It's it's the tradition of celibacy.
• 37:42
  Ordained ministers. You know, the church ordains men
• 37:45
  who who take vows of celibacy, you know, ordains them to
• 37:48
  ministry, ordains them to the priesthood because we understand
• 37:51
  that our ministers imitate our Lord Jesus Christ and our Lord
• 37:55
  Jesus Christ. He was celibate virgin who never
• 37:59
  took a wife, who was completely devoted to God.
• 38:02
  He himself tells us like in Matthew 19, where he says that
• 38:05
  there are people that got a cause to this life to be
• 38:08
  celibate for the Kingdom. And Saint Paul, I mean, tells us
• 38:11
  in First Corinthians 7, he literally says that it's better
• 38:14
  to be like him in celibate. St.
• 38:16
  Paul was celibate as well for the Kingdom because we offer
• 38:23
  everything that we have to to our Lord and sacrifice.
• 38:27
  The new talks, the New Testament talks so much about sacrifice,
• 38:31
  right? And and that's another thing in
• 38:33
  the ancient world when we talked about sacrifice, it was always
• 38:35
  like animal sacrifices. You, you sacrifice animals or
• 38:40
  even with some pagans like the like, you know, the, the
• 38:42
  indigenous pagans, like the Aztecs, they would sacrifice
• 38:45
  even other humans, human sacrifice to appeal the gods.
• 38:48
  But in the Christian community, it was we sacrifice the things
• 38:51
  that we love, the things that make us feel good.
• 38:54
  We sacrifice food, drink, sex, you know, sacrifice taking a
• 38:58
  wife. We sacrifice all of those things
• 39:00
  and we offer these sacrifices to the true God.
• 39:04
  So we, we understood that we give God our very best.
• 39:07
  We give God our very, very best. And then people in the ancient
• 39:11
  Christian community that they said, I would love to be
• 39:14
  married, I would love to have a spouse, but I love Jesus Christ
• 39:17
  so much more than that, that I would even offer that to him.
• 39:19
  And I'll give that to him. The thing that you love the
• 39:22
  most, give it to God. It's.
• 39:25
  Beautiful. And they, they did that and a
• 39:28
  lot of them got, were, were killed for it because all the,
• 39:32
  all the women, all of the beautiful women who love Jesus
• 39:37
  Christ, they knew something that no one else knew in the ancient
• 39:41
  world, that their dignity and the, and their, their virginity
• 39:47
  was something that could be given to God.
• 39:49
  Yeah, I'm, I'm so humbled. Like I feel so incredibly
• 39:52
  humbled when I read any, any martyr story.
• 39:54
  And you're like Lord Jesus, like I can't, I can't eat like, you
• 39:59
  know, that I may have a little bit of faith if I ever face any
• 40:01
  kind of trial, like, I don't know, I would crumple in the
• 40:03
  first instance. And these people like I, this is
• 40:05
  the story of St. Agatha.
• 40:07
  And she said, I consecrated, you know, my, my, my body to the
• 40:11
  Lord from infancy. She's saying, like for her, it
• 40:12
  was like from the beginning of my life, I was for the Lord
• 40:15
  alone. And it's Quintin, it's
• 40:18
  Quintianis who's a consular official of Sicily wanted to.
• 40:22
  You know, not even marry her per SE, like just wanted to like
• 40:24
  wanted to have her, like basically her.
• 40:27
  She refuses. They they brutally torture her
• 40:31
  and continue to torture her again and again and eventually
• 40:35
  she obviously dies without at any point reneging.
• 40:38
  She's saying like no, it's it's her.
• 40:41
  Saint Agnes is another one, of course, who refused to be, you
• 40:46
  know, she was dragged to a brothel, refused obviously to
• 40:50
  give in to her tormentors. So it's a, it's an incredible
• 40:54
  legacy in these early church to look at the courage.
• 41:00
  It's just hard to imagine like today, you know, we have so many
• 41:04
  blessings. We're so free.
• 41:06
  We're so comfortable as Christians, at least here in the
• 41:08
  West, especially in the United States.
• 41:11
  It's incredibly humbling because their faith was so strong.
• 41:15
  They really had something so powerful in their faith that
• 41:19
  they would withstand that kind of torture.
• 41:22
  The love of Jesus. Only the divine love of God.
• 41:24
  Yes, only an infusion of love for the Holy Spirit that could
• 41:27
  allow you to withstand something like that and to go to willingly
• 41:31
  go to your death or that. Yeah, I also think about the
• 41:37
  fact that there were so many martyrs, not just the virgin
• 41:39
  martyrs, but just even whole families that were martyred
• 41:43
  because fed. To the Lions.
• 41:45
  Yeah, fed to fed to actual lions again in in public as a as
• 41:48
  bloodsports. As a spectacle.
• 41:50
  As a spectacle and looking at the early church, you know for
• 41:53
  the first before Constantine, right in the first few centuries
• 41:57
  there was Christianity was illegal, right correct.
• 42:00
  And so but it grew. I think some of the numbers are
• 42:03
  is it you might know this better than me.
• 42:05
  I think it's a it's a few 100,000 by the time of
• 42:08
  Constantine and then it got to the millions once it was
• 42:10
  legalized. Yeah.
• 42:11
  Does that sound? Right, Yeah, yeah, it would be,
• 42:13
  I think around the time of of Constantine.
• 42:17
  It was something I think a little under 300,000, I think.
• 42:19
  Yeah, but the time of Constantine.
• 42:21
  But what's so fascinating is that the, and, and you know, Joe
• 42:25
  Heschmeyer, who's a great Catholic apologist, he had a
• 42:27
  video recently, he put out a video where he's looking at the,
• 42:30
  at the evidence, you know, about why the Christian community was
• 42:33
  able to grow so much. And the reason that it grew, not
• 42:36
  only that was it getting so many converts, you know, during the
• 42:40
  time of persecution, so many people were converting during
• 42:42
  times of persecutions, but also the Christian community, they
• 42:45
  were having so many babies. Not only were they having kids,
• 42:48
  they were adopting kids that were going to those landfills
• 42:50
  and they were taking in all of the babies that were abandoned
• 42:53
  by their Pagan parents and, and raising them in the faith.
• 42:56
  And the community grew out of love, grew just out of pure
• 43:00
  love. Let's make babies, let's adopt
• 43:02
  babies and let's just make our whole community centered on, on,
• 43:06
  on babies and show them, educate them and teach them the ways of
• 43:08
  our Lord Jesus Christ. And that's why it was growing
• 43:12
  even during times of persecution that it was growing.
• 43:15
  And that phenomenon, you only see that in in, in Christianity,
• 43:20
  the phenomenon of even during times of persecution, the
• 43:22
  community is still growing. Usually the reason that whole
• 43:25
  communities get persecuted is to suppress the community so that
• 43:27
  it doesn't grow. But it's only in Christianity
• 43:30
  that it'll, it'll even grows more.
• 43:31
  It, it's worse. It's almost like we don't even
• 43:33
  want to persecute the community because if we do it, you know,
• 43:36
  it'll, it'll slow them down if we just leave them alone.
• 43:39
  But for some reason with, with, with the Christian Church,
• 43:41
  whenever they're persecuted explodes.
• 43:43
  And we see that even today happening in Africa and in Asia,
• 43:47
  where some of the most, the worst, most terrible atrocities
• 43:51
  are occurring in those in, in, in Africa.
• 43:53
  And then and in Asia of, of things that are happening to
• 43:56
  Christians of the communities there are exploding.
• 43:59
  I think that by the end of, I don't, I think about like the
• 44:02
  year 2050, I think they said Africa is going to be the, the
• 44:06
  biggest Catholic country continent in the entire world,
• 44:09
  that there will be more, more, more, more Catholics in Africa
• 44:13
  than anywhere else in the world while they're being persecuted.
• 44:17
  Same thing in, in, in in Asia and it just grows.
• 44:22
  Why do you think that is? Why?
• 44:23
  Why is it that persecution, especially in the early church,
• 44:27
  was the driver of conversions? More conversions.
• 44:30
  There's, you know, we're talking about the, the stories of, of
• 44:33
  martyrs. There are so many stories from
• 44:36
  the early church, from ancient Christianity of Christians being
• 44:40
  martyred and the people that were there witnessing the
• 44:44
  martyrdom, seeing that, hey, the, the Christian martyrs, they
• 44:48
  don't behave like the other non Christian martyrs.
• 44:51
  They're happy to go to their death.
• 44:53
  They have joy in their hearts. Why?
• 44:55
  Why, why do they have so much joy and just the people that are
• 44:58
  there that are just the spectators that are just the
• 45:02
  spectators. They, they say, maybe I need to
• 45:04
  look into this. What is it that these people
• 45:06
  know? What is that they have that
• 45:08
  would allow them to willingly kiss their executioners before
• 45:12
  they, they get executed? You know how many stories we
• 45:15
  have of that of, of, you know, Christians that are about to be,
• 45:17
  you know, you know, have their, have their heads cut off and
• 45:20
  they kiss their, their persecutors 1st.
• 45:24
  And then they go and they put their head on the, on the, on
• 45:25
  the, on the guillotine and they get their heads cut off.
• 45:29
  And people see that and they think, maybe I should look into
• 45:34
  this and see what it is. Why, Why do they behave in such
• 45:37
  a way? Because the non Christian
• 45:38
  motors, they didn't behave like that.
• 45:40
  They were dragged kicking and screaming to their execution.
• 45:42
  Meaning it's just like the political prisoners or the
• 45:44
  criminals. Others that were being.
• 45:45
  Murdered. But the Christians?
• 45:48
  You you heard of Saint Lawrence? Oh yeah.
• 45:50
  Roman Deacon. Oh yeah.
• 45:52
  I remember first hearing this from like a Catholic friend
• 45:54
  years ago because I, I knew about Saints, you know, before
• 45:57
  becoming Catholic, but I also didn't really know about Saints.
• 46:01
  And they were saying, you know, the famous things like turn me
• 46:03
  over. I'm not done yet.
• 46:04
  I'm like, oh, what's that? Yeah, they grilled them.
• 46:07
  They grilled them. Like, literally.
• 46:08
  Grilled them to death, yeah. This is like he.
• 46:10
  Was making jokes. This is like 3rd century.
• 46:13
  What was this 3rd century? This was 2nd, 2:15 or 3rd
• 46:17
  century. OK, so 3rd century.
• 46:18
  And, and and he was, what was his story?
• 46:21
  I can I can pull it up too. Because his story was doing.
• 46:23
  Catholic. We're doing the early church
• 46:25
  bingo right now. Tell me about Saint Lawrence So.
• 46:28
  Saint Lawrence. Jeopardy, I should say, not
• 46:30
  bingo. Jeopardy.
• 46:31
  We're doing early Jeopardy. Yeah, he was a Deacon in the
• 46:32
  Church of Rome and he got, he got intercepted basically by the
• 46:36
  Roman authorities, Valerian. And then, yeah, they knew that
• 46:38
  he was, that he was a minister of the Christian Church.
• 46:42
  And, and they thought that the Christians were like hiding like
• 46:46
  treasures that they had like all this gold or whatever.
• 46:48
  They had all these riches. So they were, they wanted to
• 46:50
  confiscate the riches. And they told him to take us to,
• 46:53
  to, to the riches of the church. And he took them to one of the,
• 46:56
  the, the, the houses where they were holding all of the poor,
• 46:59
  all of the like the Pagan babies and everything that they threw
• 47:02
  out, that the pagans are thrown out.
• 47:03
  He took them there. And he said, here are the riches
• 47:05
  of the church, all of the poor people that the, that the
• 47:07
  Christians, you know, the, the first nurses were nuns and you
• 47:11
  know, that they were taking care of the sick, the elderly, the
• 47:13
  dying widows, orphans. And Saint Lawrence was like,
• 47:16
  here are our treasures, the people that we get to take care
• 47:19
  of and the people that we serve this, this, these are our riches
• 47:21
  right here. And they thought that he was
• 47:24
  being cute. So they killed him.
• 47:26
  And the way that they killed him was that they, they literally
• 47:28
  grilled him to death. They put him on a hot grill and
• 47:32
  he was making jokes while he was being, while he, while he was
• 47:36
  dying, while he was. And one of the jokes that he
• 47:38
  made was he said, you can turn me over.
• 47:40
  I think I'm done now on this side.
• 47:42
  He said, turn me over. I'm done on this side.
• 47:44
  I can't even imagine. Imagine, Saint Lawrence, pray
• 47:47
  for us like grace. The faith and the grace.
• 47:50
  Yeah, laughing and having joy, making jokes about it.
• 47:53
  That's. Grace builds in nature.
• 47:58
  Yeah, we talk about this. At the show, live on nature,
• 47:59
  Absolutely. And that's our mom was like, how
• 48:01
  do you grow your virtues? Cuz you're, you know, the
• 48:04
  theological virtues can grow on your natural virtues and you can
• 48:08
  develop these and then God confuse them with these
• 48:11
  supernatural graces for love, for faith, for hope.
• 48:14
  You know, only a man madly in love into Jesus Christ will like
• 48:18
  submit himself to be grilled alive.
• 48:20
  Like that's love right there that's driving him.
• 48:22
  And it's faith and it's hope. It's all of it.
• 48:24
  But what do you like? What did it look like in your
• 48:27
  view? You know, based on what you
• 48:28
  know, the history, and then also just your, your, your, your
• 48:31
  opinion on this. You know, theologically
• 48:32
  speaking, for someone to develop the natural virtue to them be in
• 48:37
  the position, the state of grace, to receive such an
• 48:40
  infusion of supernatural virtue and grace that you can say, turn
• 48:44
  me over. I'm not done yet when you're
• 48:45
  being tortured to death. Well, let's see.
• 48:52
  That's the project, right? Like how do we do that?
• 48:54
  I just like. That can only come out of joy.
• 48:58
  That can that, that right there is the because the theological
• 49:02
  virtues are faith, hope and love.
• 49:04
  The the only thing that could drive a man to to make jokes
• 49:08
  about being grilled to death or being, you know, or killing
• 49:11
  your, you know, kissing your executor before he executes you
• 49:14
  is those those theological virtues of faith and hope and
• 49:18
  love. You're being so ingraced so
• 49:21
  perfectly, so full of grace that those virtues are just
• 49:24
  overflowing that they're able to, that nothing that happens in
• 49:31
  the world will be able to take your, your, your peace away.
• 49:35
  Because if you have faith, hope and and love, you will have joy
• 49:37
  and you'll have peace. But like, even on a human level,
• 49:40
  if someone is like, you think about somebody like trains for
• 49:43
  marathons, right? Or they train for like the
• 49:45
  Olympics, they're like physically, mentally tougher
• 49:49
  than me, like, you know, than your average person who doesn't
• 49:51
  do that, right? Yes, it's a virtue of virtue,
• 49:55
  which isn't a theological virtue.
• 49:56
  Like a lot of the Romans, like Spartans, they had fortitude
• 49:59
  like we're going to like, literally like go to our deaths
• 50:01
  if we need to, like Sparta, like whatever it takes.
• 50:04
  And we're tough. So you can develop that on a
• 50:06
  natural level. But I wonder, like these
• 50:08
  Christians who are giving their lives for Jesus so joyfully,
• 50:11
  they must have worked really hard on their, their natural
• 50:14
  virtues in order to receive the OR maybe not because God is
• 50:19
  power, right? So he could literally give
• 50:20
  somebody who's like, a couch potato, had never like, you
• 50:23
  know, really been physically tough, and they could still go
• 50:26
  to their death with a smile on their face.
• 50:28
  Think about the apostles. They were cowards.
• 50:30
  That's true when Jesus was comforting.
• 50:32
  They were, they ran away when they arrested our Lord.
• 50:34
  They ran away like cowards, right?
• 50:36
  They ran away like cowards. But then what happened?
• 50:40
  You know, You know, on the third day our Lord rises and then 40
• 50:45
  days later he ascends into heaven.
• 50:48
  And then for, for about 9 days they were, they were still in
• 50:51
  the upper room and they were still afraid.
• 50:53
  But when the Holy Spirit in Acts chapter 2 at Pentecost and the
• 50:58
  Holy Spirit held upon them. Then you keep reading the book
• 51:02
  of Acts and you see what Peter and, and all of the apostles
• 51:05
  and, and, and what Paul, what they were saying to the face of
• 51:08
  their, of their oppressors. That's divine.
• 51:12
  That's just divine. There's no other.
• 51:14
  There's no other way. How you know?
• 51:15
  How you know? Did the apostles really work on
• 51:19
  their natural virtues for 40 days while Jesus is with them?
• 51:21
  The resurrected Lord, I'm sure. Special boot camp, but you know,
• 51:24
  special. 40 day boot camp for, for natural virtue, but for when
• 51:27
  you read about what they did in the book of Acts, you're like,
• 51:30
  there's no, there's no way there's no way.
• 51:34
  Like that's just a supernatural. That's just a supernatural
• 51:36
  grace, a gift because that's part of the strength of the of
• 51:40
  the the the credibility of the faith and why we should believe
• 51:44
  it to be true is because most of the early Christians, the
• 51:48
  ancient Christians that they would willingly go to their
• 51:51
  death willingly in the in masses.
• 51:57
  Like when else do you see that in history where where where a
• 52:00
  large group of people, a a community, a religion, whatever
• 52:03
  it is that they all at the same time willingly.
• 52:05
  Let's go to our death because we're.
• 52:09
  Crazy. Wills does that.
• 52:11
  The other big teaching that was so I think earth shaking was the
• 52:17
  treatment of other people in terms of when they've wronged
• 52:20
  you or are your enemy. Because again, in the Roman
• 52:24
  Empire, it's like you conquer your enemy, you Vanquish your
• 52:28
  enemy, you loot and rage your enemy.
• 52:31
  You know, you, you ransacked the town, you know, like, and not to
• 52:35
  say there were no rules of engagement in terms of warfare,
• 52:37
  because there were, but the Christian, you know, and
• 52:40
  obviously pacifism can maybe be an extreme element of, you know,
• 52:44
  an extreme taking it too far. But the Christian way was, you
• 52:47
  know, and you, you turn your cheek right.
• 52:50
  You give someone asking you, you know, pressing on you for your
• 52:53
  stuff. You give it to them, to them,
• 52:55
  You know someone asks for something of you, you give it
• 52:57
  freely. It's radical.
• 52:59
  It's radical. That's something else that did
• 53:01
  not exist in the that that that didn't.
• 53:04
  Honestly, I didn't even exist, like in Judaism, an ancient, you
• 53:07
  know? Yeah.
• 53:07
  It was an eye for an eye. It was an eye for an eye.
• 53:09
  Tooth for a tooth. Yeah.
• 53:10
  They hit you on one cheek, you hit the other cheek because.
• 53:12
  It's justice. It's justice.
• 53:14
  Right. But our Lord, you know, again,
• 53:16
  like you said, grace, you know, grace builds on on nature,
• 53:21
  right, right. But you, you need a whole lot of
• 53:25
  grace to be able to trend the other cheek when somebody when
• 53:30
  somebody slaps you, you need a whole lot of grace for that.
• 53:34
  But all of the early Christians did it.
• 53:38
  So why can't we do it? We should do it.
• 53:42
  We honestly, there's a lot more of us now in the world back then
• 53:44
  and we and we live in these circumstances.
• 53:46
  We're so relaxed and we're so, you know, we have so much
• 53:49
  liberty, so much freedom. Why can't we live good, You
• 53:52
  know, virtuous Christian lives. It seems like it's always, it
• 53:56
  isn't until we get persecuted that we kind of wake up and
• 53:58
  realize like this is something that we, we should be willing to
• 54:01
  die for. I think that's the, the, the,
• 54:05
  the problem with getting a little, a little too
• 54:07
  comfortable, a little too comfortable is that you kind of
• 54:09
  get lazy and you kind of forget. You start to forget.
• 54:12
  That's what we always need to remember the Saints.
• 54:15
  We always need to remember the early Christian martyrs.
• 54:17
  We always need to remember how old of the apostles died, how
• 54:20
  they were all killed, how they were martyred, how they were
• 54:22
  persecuted not only back then, but today.
• 54:25
  I know. It's still happening.
• 54:27
  Today and still happening today. I think about, you know, Saint
• 54:30
  Clair of Assisi and Saint Francis.
• 54:31
  Oh my goodness, I. Remember going to Assisi and
• 54:33
  then I did a little pilgrimage there and there was this little
• 54:36
  Chapel for of Saint Claire's. And it's like, you know,
• 54:39
  learning about her and her words, her life.
• 54:41
  Obviously Saint Francis too. And their spiritual friendship
• 54:43
  was so beautiful too, and so like and so dramatic too.
• 54:46
  It's like that there are these profound spiritual friendships
• 54:48
  between men and women that were consecrated and celibate instead
• 54:51
  of part. The writings were that they
• 54:53
  wrote to each other. It's beautiful.
• 54:54
  Beautiful. But one of the things she said
• 54:56
  that like just really caught my eye was with you, Jesus, the
• 55:01
  suffering is sweet. The sickness is sweet because
• 55:03
  she suffered a lot. She had all these physical
• 55:05
  maladies. And then in addition to that,
• 55:06
  she actually wore, you know, I don't remember exactly if it was
• 55:09
  like a chain or basically a mortification to remind them of
• 55:14
  their need for Jesus and to offer those sufferings for him.
• 55:17
  But anyway, she had a lot of sufferings and she was like,
• 55:19
  suffering is sweet with Jesus. And I just think about like the
• 55:22
  modern sensibility in my, in my own life, like, oh, you know, I
• 55:25
  have to do something tough. And I'm like, you know, there's
• 55:28
  like this, like, you know about it.
• 55:29
  And it's like, no, like with Jesus, you can allow like the
• 55:33
  martyr is the ultimate example, right, of that of, you know,
• 55:37
  save. But Christ, like Christ is the
• 55:38
  example of it. But the martyr dying for Christ,
• 55:41
  that suffering is sweet to them because it's for Jesus.
• 55:43
  But anything in our life can be an opportunity to suffer for
• 55:47
  Jesus. Being a good spouse is a great
• 55:49
  way to do that. Being a good parent, being a
• 55:51
  good, a good, you know, son, daughter, being a good citizen
• 55:56
  of your country, that's hard. That's a That's a forgotten art.
• 55:59
  That's hard, you know, suffer. Well, a lot of people don't
• 56:02
  realize how much the New Testament talks about suffering.
• 56:05
  Read the Epistles of Peter, read, read James.
• 56:07
  And it's all about fortitude. It's all about Christian
• 56:10
  fortitude and it's all about suffering and suffering Well,
• 56:13
  and how, you know, read Second Corinthians.
• 56:16
  What I believe it's, it's in Second Corinthians, it's a whole
• 56:19
  chapter where Saint Paul, literally, he's lists out all of
• 56:22
  the terrible things that happened to him, all the
• 56:24
  terrible things that happened to him during his and everything.
• 56:26
  Else the. Shipwrecks and everything.
• 56:28
  It's the Second Corinthians. I want to say the second
• 56:30
  Corinthians. You can pull it up. 13 is it?
• 56:32
  That's the final chapter of that, of that epistle.
• 56:34
  But he goes through every everything that had happened to
• 56:38
  him, everything, all the ways that they try to kill them, the
• 56:40
  way they try to murder him. And he and he just like, like
• 56:45
  nothing. And he says, and you keep going
• 56:47
  because for, for Christ, you know, you do all of this for,
• 56:50
  for Christ. You can't go wrong.
• 56:53
  Learning about the early Christians and their faith, or
• 56:57
  the martyrs or the Saints and their faith like it, can only
• 56:59
  increase our faith and inspire us to love God more.
• 57:03
  Right. Oh, I found it at 2nd
• 57:05
  Corinthians 11. 11 OK read. Read it to us.
• 57:08
  So if you go to 2nd Corinthians, So if you go to 2nd Corinthians
• 57:11
  11, starting in verse 16, this is all about Paul's sufferings
• 57:15
  as an apostle. And, and before he gets to this,
• 57:18
  he talks about the importance for, for the importance of, of
• 57:22
  charity, the importance of generosity and giving.
• 57:26
  So he's talking about all of these virtuous things, this.
• 57:28
  Is to the early Christians. And this is to the to the
• 57:31
  Christians in Corinth, this is the second appeal to them.
• 57:33
  He says you need to be generous. You need to be generous in
• 57:35
  giving, you need to give all of yourself to to each other and to
• 57:39
  God. And then in 2nd Corinthians 11,
• 57:41
  starting in verse 16, he says this.
• 57:43
  He says, I repeat, let no one think me foolish.
• 57:48
  But even if you do, then accept me as a fool.
• 57:51
  So I too may boast a little what I am saying.
• 57:55
  I say, not with the Lord's authority, but as a fool in this
• 57:58
  boastful confidence, since many boast of worldly things, I too
• 58:01
  will boast. So I, I love the way that Paul
• 58:03
  sets things up, the way he sets things up.
• 58:06
  He says, OK, he says, I'm going to brag a little bit because I'm
• 58:10
  going to brag a little bit. I'm going to show you what,
• 58:11
  what, what I like to boast about.
• 58:13
  Let me tell you what, what, what I'm proud of what my boastings.
• 58:17
  And then he goes on to say in verse 19, For you gladly bear
• 58:20
  with fools, being wise yourselves.
• 58:22
  So he's kind of being like you. You're so wise.
• 58:24
  Well, bear with a fool like me, he says, for you, bear it.
• 58:27
  If a man makes slaves of you, or preys upon you, or takes
• 58:30
  advantage of you, or puts on airs, or strikes you in the
• 58:33
  face, to my shame, I must say we were too weak for that.
• 58:38
  But whatever anyone dares to boast of, I'm speaking as a
• 58:41
  fool. I also dare to boast of that.
• 58:45
  Are they Hebrew? So am I.
• 58:46
  Are they Israelites? So am I.
• 58:47
  Are they descendants of Abraham? So am I?
• 58:49
  Are they servants of Christ? I'm a better one, and I'm
• 58:52
  talking like a madman, With far greater laborers and far more
• 58:56
  imprisonments, with countless beatings and often near death.
• 58:59
  Five times I have received at the hands of the Jews the 40
• 59:02
  lashes, less, 1/3 times I have been beaten with rods.
• 59:06
  Once I was stoned. Three times I have been
• 59:09
  shipwrecked. A night and a day.
• 59:10
  I have been adrift at sea on frequent journeys, in danger
• 59:14
  from rivers, danger from robbers, danger from my own
• 59:18
  people, danger from Gentiles, danger in the city, danger in
• 59:22
  the wilderness, danger at sea, danger from false brethren, and
• 59:26
  toil and hardship through many a sleepless night, and hunger and
• 59:30
  thirst, often without food and cold and exposure.
• 59:34
  And apart from other things, there is the daily pressure upon
• 59:37
  me of my anxiety for all the churches.
• 59:40
  Who is weak and I am not weak. Who is made to fall, and I am
• 59:45
  not indignant. If I must boast, I will boast of
• 59:48
  the things that show my weakness.
• 59:51
  The God and Father of the Lord Jesus, he who is blessed
• 59:54
  forever, knows that I do not lie.
• 59:57
  So he goes on to talk about everything that he's suffered as
• 1:00:00
  as an apostle. So he's kind of like being a
• 1:00:02
  father, admonishing, like, hey, you guys are going to complain.
• 1:00:04
  You guys, you know, almost almost be the biggest fool
• 1:00:07
  you've ever seen because look at everything that I willingly went
• 1:00:09
  through for this. And that inspired the church.
• 1:00:14
  I mean, that's what's so incredible and it should inspire
• 1:00:17
  us today. It was it was what he wrote
• 1:00:19
  there in 2nd Corinthians 11, that all of those early murders,
• 1:00:22
  they've got that letter in the head and they're like, I want,
• 1:00:25
  let me, yeah, let's do it, Let's do it.
• 1:00:27
  You know, Paul was Paul was like that coach in the locker room
• 1:00:29
  that just, you know, hypes up the football team and gets ready
• 1:00:32
  to go out there and and how do you send?
• 1:00:35
  These letters, when they're under persecution, I mean that
• 1:00:38
  in that in and of itself was a dangerous task.
• 1:00:41
  It was communication, very dangerous.
• 1:00:43
  Text messages. Yeah, it DMS very dangerous.
• 1:00:46
  So they would write the letters in secret.
• 1:00:49
  So Paul, there's a wonderful movie maybe you've seen it's
• 1:00:51
  called Paul the Apostle of Christ.
• 1:00:53
  Paul the Apostle of Christ is such an amazing movie.
• 1:00:55
  And you see that when he's in prison, when he's, when he's in
• 1:00:58
  a Roman jail, the way that it worked in that's another thing
• 1:01:01
  in the ancient world when they would imprison people, the, the,
• 1:01:06
  the, the people that ran the jails, you know, whatever you
• 1:01:10
  call them, they did not have the obligation to feed them.
• 1:01:13
  They'll put you in a Roman jail and you don't need, we're not
• 1:01:15
  going to give you clothing. We're not going to give you
• 1:01:17
  food. We're not going to give you
• 1:01:18
  anything. No, no bed to sleep on.
• 1:01:20
  You're going to be in a hole in the ground.
• 1:01:22
  And we, you better hope that you have somebody that loves you to
• 1:01:25
  bring you water and bring you food because we're not giving
• 1:01:27
  you anything. And if you die in that, in that
• 1:01:29
  jail, it's your fault because you're the one that got yourself
• 1:01:31
  in jail. So it was the early Christians
• 1:01:34
  that they, they would go and they would actually feed all the
• 1:01:37
  imprison, not just the Christians, but also even the
• 1:01:39
  non Christians. They would go and they would
• 1:01:41
  give them food and they would share the gospel with them.
• 1:01:43
  They'd give them water, you know, they would bring them
• 1:01:46
  clothing and they would share the gospel with them.
• 1:01:49
  So that the prison ministry started also in the ancient
• 1:01:52
  church when they were ministering even to, to non
• 1:01:54
  Christians, when Paul found himself in prison, which
• 1:01:57
  happened a couple of times. It shows that like Luke, his,
• 1:02:01
  you know, Saint Luke, who wrote the Gospel of Luke, that would
• 1:02:03
  go and that Luke would actually be writing down.
• 1:02:06
  Paul would be like preaching and Luke would actually write down
• 1:02:08
  what Paul was saying. And then he would, you know, he
• 1:02:10
  would hide them in his, you know, in his, in his bag,
• 1:02:13
  whatever it was. And then he'd go and he'd give
• 1:02:15
  copies of the letters to, to different churches.
• 1:02:17
  And that's how it spread. And they did that so much that,
• 1:02:21
  you know, each church that got a letter, they would copy him
• 1:02:23
  down. As you know, they would make
• 1:02:25
  multiple, multiple, multiple copies of each letter.
• 1:02:27
  And then they would all pass them around and eventually all
• 1:02:30
  of the letters got passed around the entire universal church.
• 1:02:32
  And they'd be read in homes like during their liturgy of the
• 1:02:35
  like, around the time of the Liturgy of the Word or their
• 1:02:37
  gatherings or the Liturgy of the Eucharist in the gatherings.
• 1:02:40
  They would even read them like in the, you know, like the
• 1:02:42
  Christians that were in Jerusalem before the temple was
• 1:02:44
  destroyed in the year 70. They would actually read them.
• 1:02:47
  You know, they would read the Hebrew Scriptures and then they
• 1:02:49
  would read the writings of the apostles, you know, during the
• 1:02:52
  Liturgy of the Word. And that's exactly what we do
• 1:02:54
  today. We read in the, in the, you
• 1:02:56
  know, in, in church, we read the, the like in the Roman
• 1:02:59
  literature, we have a reading from the Old Testament, A Psalm,
• 1:03:03
  a New Testament reading, a gospel reading.
• 1:03:05
  That's exactly what the ancient Christians were doing back then.
• 1:03:08
  And even having, even having those writings was bold because
• 1:03:12
  if you got caught that you were, that you were, that you were
• 1:03:14
  copying, that you were ascribed, that was copying these writings
• 1:03:16
  down so that you could distribute them to all of the
• 1:03:18
  churches. There were penalties for that,
• 1:03:20
  including even even death. So if you got caught with one of
• 1:03:23
  those writings on you, it would not be good.
• 1:03:27
  And they risked it. They risked it.
• 1:03:28
  It was like the Scriptures, the New Testament writings of the
• 1:03:31
  apostles. It was like contraband, you
• 1:03:33
  know, And so crazy. If you get caught with him,
• 1:03:35
  you're cooked, as the kids say, like Saint Lawrence got cooked.
• 1:03:40
  He got grilled, right? He got literally, you're
• 1:03:42
  grilled. Yeah.
• 1:03:44
  All right, voice of reason, what is your favorite?
• 1:03:46
  Let's let's close out this fascinating conversation.
• 1:03:49
  Thank you. Always so good.
• 1:03:50
  To talk to you, what is your What would be a favorite book
• 1:03:53
  you would recommend on this stuff to people listening?
• 1:03:55
  On what specifically about and? Just early church that you like
• 1:03:58
  or the the impact of Christianity and western
• 1:04:00
  civilization? There is a great book I'm.
• 1:04:03
  Gonna see if you're gonna do my I have.
• 1:04:05
  One you have one you want me to go first?
• 1:04:07
  You go first. I'm gonna see.
• 1:04:08
  So there's actually a a just it's a very on the north title.
• 1:04:12
  It's called the Catholic Church Build Western Civilization.
• 1:04:15
  That's what it's called. That's the one.
• 1:04:17
  That's the one. That's the that's the one.
• 1:04:19
  OK, I don't know. If I've read that one, it's
• 1:04:21
  called the Catholic Church Built.
• 1:04:23
  Western Civilization. Right.
• 1:04:25
  That's the one Catholic who who wrote that. 10 Woods.
• 1:04:29
  Thomas E Woods, yes. All right.
• 1:04:30
  That's the one. Guys, get this book.
• 1:04:32
  It's fascinating. My book, my wreck.
• 1:04:34
  My shout out is going to be to the OG Rodney Stark.
• 1:04:38
  And he wrote a ton of books, but one of them that probably best
• 1:04:41
  encapsulate a lot of this stuff that I love is The Triumph of
• 1:04:44
  Christianity. How the Jesus Movement, what's
• 1:04:47
  his full title here, How the Jesus movement became the
• 1:04:48
  world's largest religion? But it's very cool.
• 1:04:51
  Like he looks as a sociologist, like tracking how civilization
• 1:04:55
  changed and why it changed. And I love his stuff debunking
• 1:04:58
  the dark ages. Right.
• 1:05:00
  Oh yeah. Like it was not dark.
• 1:05:01
  The dark ages were not dark. There were some massive rapid
• 1:05:04
  development in civilization. Yes, that was and the reason.
• 1:05:07
  That's another episode the. Reason they call it the Dark
• 1:05:09
  Ages because it was the church that was spearheading, yes,
• 1:05:12
  everything, all of the advances in science and art and
• 1:05:15
  everything. It was all the church that did
• 1:05:18
  it. So they call it the Dark Ages
• 1:05:19
  because it was. I guess they don't like that it
• 1:05:20
  was the Church of Jesus Christ that that did that.
• 1:05:23
  Awesome. It's amazing voice of reason.
• 1:05:24
  Thanks again for sitting down. Always a pleasure to talk to
• 1:05:27
  you. La de Rose, thank you for having
• 1:05:28
  me. It is always a pleasure to be
• 1:05:30
  talking to you and we'll, we'll keep going.
• 1:05:31
  We'll keep up the good work. You as well.
• 1:05:33
  You, just so you know, you are one of my heroes.
• 1:05:35
  Thank you SO. That's very nice.
• 1:05:36
  Thank you for everything that you're doing.
• 1:05:38
  Thank you for the one for inviting me to this wonderful
• 1:05:40
  event this past weekend. The live action summer was
• 1:05:43
  amazing and anything I can do for you, you let me know.
• 1:05:45
  You got it. Thank you.
• 1:05:46
  God bless you. Keep it up and a huge thank you
• 1:05:53
  to EWTN Eternal Word Television Network, which is the largest
• 1:05:56
  religious broadcaster in the world.
• 1:05:58
  You can get access to Lila Rose Show episodes 24 hours in
• 1:06:03
  advance at ewtn.com. Slash on demand and a big thank
• 1:06:06
  you to EWTN and their incredible mission to bring souls to Jesus.