Latest / The Lila Rose Show / E253: I Met Jesus and Gave Away My Multimillion Dollar Company | Lila Rose Show

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E253: I Met Jesus and Gave Away My Multimillion Dollar Company | Lila Rose Show · The Lila Rose Show

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  In my bathroom, walking to my closet and I'm stopped dead in
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  my tracks. I had no idea what was going on.
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  It was like a near death experience.
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  I was horrified, it was painful. I had fancy car, celebrity
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  friends, like everything that was like, you've made it.
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  And now I'm on this rooftop mountaintop moment looking in
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  the compact mirror and I was just like, who are you?
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  I didn't know. Love covers a multitude of sins
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  and Saint John to the Cross is in the evening of life.
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  We will be judged on love alone. She had a supernatural vision
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  that led her to walk away from her multimillion dollar business
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  and radically change her life. She called it an illumination of
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  conscience and said it was terrifying but ultimately
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  changed her life for good. Welcome back to the Lila Roche
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  show. Today I'm sitting down with
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  Joelle Marin, who is a businesswoman, an actor, and an
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  author. We discussed the literal fire of
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  her childhood and the trauma that she experienced.
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  We also talk about the difficult process of her annulment and
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  separation and then the beautiful path of her faith in
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  Jesus changed her life. If you want to support this
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  mission over at the Lila Rose show of sharing the good, the
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  true, the beautiful so that we can all flourish in this life
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  and in the next, make sure that you're subscribed.
• 1:11
  Over 70% of viewers watching this show aren't even subscribed
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  yet. So what are you waiting for?
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  app, please leave us five stars and write us a review.
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  Those written reviews and those five star reviews help the show
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  grow tremendously and I read all of them.
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  I hope you enjoy this episode. Joelle Marin, welcome to the
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  podcast. Yeah.
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  Thanks, Lila, for having me. You know, it's so funny.
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  I met you and I feel like I've known you forever.
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  It's like I feel like it's a reunion and we're just meeting.
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  Yeah. Well, thank you for coming in.
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  I know you're back and forth between, I guess it sounds like
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  Austin, Nashville and LA. Yes, yeah, all three, yeah.
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  And this month I'll be in South Dakota too for a pro-life talk
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  actually. And I'll be in Iowa at a Lagadas
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  talk. So I just praise the Lord I'm
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  all over but here. I'm I'm with you today.
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  And I was in this area nine years ago.
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  And I guess just coming back to the area and coming on your show
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  and realizing, you know, I was really broken at that time.
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  And I was still, you know, letting God heal me and pick up
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  the pieces of my life. And so to come back here and
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  just see all he's done, you know, it's given me just that
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  hope and remembrance that, you know, through him all things are
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  possible. And for any of us suffering
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  anything there have been through trials or tragedies, you know,
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  like, like God can put us back together and this is possible.
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  So it's just incredible to be back and and to like look back
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  and see, you know, things seem dark and hopeless.
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  And could God fix this? And he can fix anything for any
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  of us, too. Amen.
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  Well, your story, I, I might start crying just talking about
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  your story, but your story is very moving.
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  What God has brought you through, what you've been
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  through, what you went through through and how ultimately God
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  brought you through it and, and has strengthened your faith.
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  Your, your professional work is also really fun.
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  I you are going to be playing Mary in a film soon, which are I
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  think you're already. Are you already filming that
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  right now? We've been filming for a long
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  time, but we're not done yet. And you know, it's a beautiful
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  film about the Eucharist, actually, it's called The New
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  Mana. And so it's a docudrama, but
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  it's done like with the highest film production quality and
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  blessed Carlo St. Carlo Okudis is now a St.
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  amazing. His mom is a producer on the
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  film. We have an incredible director,
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  Angela Labudi, who's known for his work for Lion King and his
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  art direction and won Academy Awards and stuff.
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  And so and Scott doctor Scott Honda's in it.
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  Father Donald Callaway, Father Rippinger, a lot of, you know,
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  people testifying to the miracles of the Eucharist.
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  But then I get to be in the live action scenes acting out the,
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  you know, the passion of Christ, which I was.
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  That's a whole nother story of like, how do you go to those
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  places? And that was really, you know,
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  when God put me back into film and television, he wasn't joking
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  around. So I really, I spent four years
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  actually with the secular Carmelites years ago when I had
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  my reversion. And if it wasn't for my prayer
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  and work with them, I don't think I could have ever.
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  I say I didn't play the role of Our Lady, I prayed the role of
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  Our Lady. But it was that prayer, that
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  kind of religious perspective and and studying the life of
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  Mary that allowed me to even attempt to let God work through
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  me. I can definitely see you playing
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  Mary and I'm excited to see that.
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  And OK, so we there there's so much to talk about.
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  We're going to go back and just go to your back story because
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  it's very moving and you know, through your career.
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  And then obviously you meant you just you, you've mentioned a
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  couple times you've you've had this conversion or reversion
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  experience and there is a lot to share.
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  I know. So you're obviously in film and
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  television space and entertainment.
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  You your story that started when you were a kid and what you
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  experienced as a kid. So bring us back to the
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  beginning where you were growing up, your family of origin, and
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  just what your childhood was like.
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  Yeah, I'm from a little town in New York called Marlboro, NY
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  It's only, I think, a few miles big.
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  Not many people, a few 1000 people, Very humble beginnings.
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  But you could see the Saint Mary's Church from her house.
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  I just was always a really prayerful little girl.
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  Very simple faith. I think that we spend the rest
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  of our life trying to get back to you.
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  Like, Jesus loves me. This I know because the Bible
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  tells me so. Like, life was beautiful and
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  easy and prayerful. But when I was six years old, in
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  the middle of the night, I woke up to a raging fire and the
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  whole front of my house was already gone.
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  And I could barely hear my father, like screaming, you
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  know, Joelle, Joelle, get out. There's a fire.
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  Like I just, it's just roaring flames, all pitch black.
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  And you know, I, by the grace of God, I found my way into his
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  arms and he carried me through the flames.
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  I don't know how I wasn't burnt, Lila.
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  Like, you know, I think of that scripture, how the Lord carries
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  us through the fires in life. But unfortunately, my sister
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  Maria, who was 11 at the time, they couldn't, he couldn't get
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  to her. There were flames around her
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  door. And he, I just remember him
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  like, you know, just like a Wildman, you know, like a father
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  so in love with his child, just trying to get to her.
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  But his arms were being burned to happen.
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  I was like, I knew he was going to die in the fire.
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  I was scared to get help. And so he came with me to get
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  help, you know, And then the fire department didn't show up.
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  They thought it was a prank call.
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  They live they were right on the same St. the Volunteer Fire
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  Department like everything that could have went wrong did that
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  night. And you know, actually just
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  driving here today before the show, literally right before I
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  turned it to park here was a fire truck.
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  And you know, I just know that God is is with us even when
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  these horrible things happen. We don't understand it, but it's
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  like my sister's here with us. You know, our life is eternal
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  when we turn our lives to God and our our goal is heaven.
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  But as a little girl, I didn't understand that.
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  And when the doctors came in and said she didn't make it and I
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  was there for smoke inhalation and my father was getting his
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  arms bandaged up, I just, I saw my dad like he came running over
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  to me and like leeched on to me for dear life, wailing and
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  screaming like the pain of a father in love with their child.
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  And I was just six, you know, And I just said, like, Lord,
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  like, why did you let this happen?
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  We, you know, we have to do something.
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  And it was my birthday, a few months later, my 7th birthday.
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  And I was like, oh, that's right.
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  You can raise the dead. So I had dolls that were donated
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  to me because I had no possessions.
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  Like literally my life burned down to the ground like material
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  things. And then my family to the grief,
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  you know, and my mother, she wasn't home the night of the
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  fire. She was at a play rehearsal.
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  So she blamed herself for not being there because she had a
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  theater company. And of course it wasn't her
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  fault either, but everyone just kind of blamed themselves.
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  And she ended up in a mental institution.
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  She's given permission to share that.
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  And just, she's never recovered and she's still struggling
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  because it's the loss of a child, you know?
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  So I just saw my whole family consumed with the with these
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  flames. It's flames of grief and loss.
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  Of course, I was too. And she was my only sibling.
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  So now I was all alone and I had these dolls that people donated
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  and I had one doll saved from the fire that was my sister's
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  and I'll never forget it smelled horrible.
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  It had, you know, the that that smell from the fire and burn
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  marks on it. But it was like my treasure.
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  And I laid these dolls out on my bed in the shape and size of my
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  sister Maria. And I would like tried to speak
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  life into them and ask the Lord to raise her from the dead like
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  because he could do it. And I and I prayed once and it
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  didn't happen. I'm like staring at, you know,
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  like, just like it's going to happen, it's going to happen.
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  Like just super faith filled. I tried again a second time and
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  I'm staring at the dolls. Nothing happens.
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  And I was like, I was starting to get a little discouraged, but
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  I went for a third time because I'm, you know, I'm Italian girl.
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  Deep down. There's a little bit of fire of
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  that in me. And I just, I couldn't believe
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  that he didn't raise her from the dead the third time.
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  And my heart shattered. I thought, you know, we, I think
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  we all go through this. Why do bad things happen to good
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  people? Like, why does God allow that?
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  And I didn't understand. And I asked a nun at the time
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  and she's like, oh, your sister's in heaven.
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  It's beautiful there. Like, it's amazing.
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  And I was just like, well, like, why didn't God take me then?
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  Because now I'm stuck here in this pain and this misery, you
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  know, and if heaven's so great, like I want to go there, I'd
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  rather be there with her than than here.
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  So I just didn't understand a lot.
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  And I would say that was when I kind of pulled my phone line to
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  God that that direct prayer, simple childlike faith.
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  I was like, OK, I'll still pray. I'll still go to church on
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  Sundays, you know, at least until I reach college.
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  And then I was like, but I don't know if I trust you.
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  So, like, my prayers got more shallow.
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  They got more distant. And of course, God is all good.
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  He's a good father. But I just couldn't understand
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  at that age why something like that would happen.
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  I'm so sorry, Joel. I can't even imagine what that
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  must have been like. And you know, this was your
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  only, like you said, your only sibling, and it sounds like you
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  were really close. Yeah, Oh, I mean, I looked up to
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  her. I just, I think, you know, I was
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  probably annoying to her, but like she I was like just
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  idolized her. She was my big sister.
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  She was looked like an Angel. She had blonde hair, blue eyes,
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  fair skin. She was tall.
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  Like we were the exact opposite. But she was, she just glowed and
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  was beautiful and yeah, I loved her very much.
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  I still do. How did your parents, as they
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  were dealing with that grief and you were beginning to experience
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  grief that no child should ever experience losing a sibling in
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  such a traumatic way? What did you observe them do?
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  You mentioned your mother ended up having to be admitted to a
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  mental institution. Yeah.
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  What was their journey like that you were observing as a very
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  impressionable young and hurting 7 year old yourself?
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  Yeah, no, I mean, my house was chaos, you know, the fire, as
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  far as I'm concerned, continue to rage, you know, and and we
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  all have like, if even if you didn't have a house fire, we all
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  have fires around us all the time.
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  Distractions, hurts, betrayals, like just things happening, you
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  know. So in my house was still all
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  these interior fires. My father turned to alcoholism
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  and his lived his whole life as an alcoholic and my mother to
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  depression and mental illness and just the griefs.
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  Luckily my grandparents lived down the street on the same St.
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  and they were devout Catholics and my grandmother, she prayed 4
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  rosaries every day Divine Mercy at 3:00 every day.
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  Like, she just would glow because she was filled with love
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  and prayer and just like a simple, I would say like a
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  Mother Teresa kind of kindness and beauty and just treated
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  everybody with, you know, tender love and didn't ask them too
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  many questions. She just evangelized by her
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  faith. So I had that balance that that
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  would run to my grandparents as a refuge.
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  But my house was a mess. I was the parent.
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  I was always breaking up fights. There was chairs flying.
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  You know, sometimes I was getting in trouble getting
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  chased around the table. Luckily, I was faster than my
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  dad, but it was, it was rough. And my father even up, he died a
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  couple years ago. Even until like a week before
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  his death, my mom would say that he'd cry at night.
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  It's not my fault. It's not my fault, you know?
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  And so he was just spent his whole life consumed by the
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  flames. And it wasn't his fault, you
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  know, so that's, he couldn't. Yeah.
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  I mean, so it's just, it's one of those things that it's, it's
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  the reason I get out of bed every morning.
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  It's the reason why I push myself, you know, to do work,
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  you know, and, and to serve the Lord is because I don't want
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  anyone, any of us to be consumed by the flames of life where we
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  didn't get to be who we were created to.
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  Because when he was on his deathbed, you know, and I
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  forgave him for it was just a grace, like something had
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  happened even before that that I couldn't, I couldn't see him the
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  last couple of months because he had he had fallen and broken his
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  neck. And when I went to visit him, he
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  was like just raging and screaming.
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  He doesn't remember any of it. But it broke my heart.
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  And so my last words to him where I love you.
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  And then I left the hospital and my spiritual director said you
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  don't need to go back anymore. So I didn't see him again till
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  he was on his deathbed and he couldn't talk.
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  And I'll be honest, I was like relieved that I couldn't be
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  attacked, you know. But at the same time, I was
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  filled with a grace of like a love for him.
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  And I'm just staring at him thinking this is a child of God.
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  Like God had amazing plans for my father.
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  He was a good man. He actually had a sweet, tender
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  heart, even though he hid it behind, you know, a tough
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  exterior. He was a really, really good
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  man. And he never got to be who he
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  was created to be. And that's why I wrote Become
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  the Fire book, because I don't want any of us to become
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  consumed with the flames where we like get to the end and we
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  never got to contribute to the world, You know, what we were
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  supposed to do in our mission and to be filled with love and
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  life. Because we're so caught up on
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  the trauma or also just as distractions.
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  It could be the fire. I think as I understand it, it's
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  you presented as it could be a lot of.
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  Things. A lot of things.
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  Not just a horrific house fire. No, I mean, we have fires all
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  the time. And so someone said to me like,
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  oh, now that you've turned your life to God, like how's it feel
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  to have no suffering? And I'm like, are you kidding
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  me? Like, that is not scripture.
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  We can't get away from fires and trials and sufferings.
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  And it's just that we have to learn to, you know, like Saint
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  Joan of Arc was standing in the fire at the end of her life,
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  surrounded by real flames. And she had a priest stand in
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  front of her, and she said, hold the cross higher so I could see
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  it through the flames. And so I think that's, you know,
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  I'm still working on that. The difference is now I know
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  what to do, but there's always things trying to get our
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  attention, trying to make us think it's hopeless, you know,
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  You can't get out of this. God will never forgive you.
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  You have no purpose, you know, and we need to stop looking at
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  those flames and keep our eyes on Jesus.
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  When you were a little girl and you're then start having these
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  basically distance from God because you thought God didn't
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  save her and so you would have to, you'd spend years having to
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  navigate that. And we're going to get into
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  that. But I'm curious, with your
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  sister, was there that, you know, you said you idolized her.
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  Was there any sense in your heart about regret about your
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  relationship with your sister or you felt at peace with your
• 15:20
  relationship? It was more just the pain of
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  missing her and losing her in such a traumatic way.
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  Yeah, I had a piece, but then like I always got upset if
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  someone was fighting with their sibling or didn't you know?
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  Of course there's real things that happen in real life were,
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  you know, but I just was like, you really don't know what you
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  have till it's gone. And I just, I just missed her.
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  Even when I went on church retreats, like our confirmation
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  retreat and stuff, I saw other sisters together sharing, you
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  know, like, I don't know, a hair clip or it could have been the
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  silliest thing, you know, like a hair tie.
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  And I was just like, I just wish my sister was here and that I
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  could have that relationship with her.
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  So yeah, I just, I just missed her.
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  What was it like then in high school?
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  You still your sweet grandma for?
• 16:02
  Grandparents are trying to hold down the Fort.
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  Parents are struggling. You're still going to church.
• 16:08
  Yeah. At what point do you decide I
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  don't even want to keep going to church?
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  What did that process look like for you?
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  Yeah, well, I would say, you know, I've been on stage since I
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  was five years old because my mother had a theater company.
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  And so and then I started going to Manhattan to audition and
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  stuff. So I was just constantly hiding
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  behind other characters, like misusing a gift because I
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  especially like the really sweet, like perfect characters
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  whose life just seems like amazing, you know, like a fairy
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  tale. I loved to play those roles and
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  just kind of hide behind it. So I would say I was, I was
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  getting further and further out of touch with who I was and just
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  trying to create some perfect facade that doesn't really exist
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  in real life, I think for anybody.
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  And going there and going to the city and, you know, eventually
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  going to college and stuff. I was getting caught up in the
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  things of the world and stopped going to church on Sunday.
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  Still called myself Catholic. Or if I came home, you know,
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  went to Mass with my family. But I would say my heart was far
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  from God. I was never, I would say like
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  trying to be a bad person or, you know, I didn't realize how
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  far I was. I just, I didn't trust him.
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  I think that was really it. And everyone sells us like, oh,
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  do this and you'll be happy. Achieve this and you'll be
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  happy, you know? And then I just went for things.
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  And then I found out it was just a web of lies because I never
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  felt satisfied. It was just this endless pit
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  that made you feel worse and worse because it wasn't heavenly
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  things, you know? What was your relationship like
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  with your grandparents during this time?
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  My grandparents were my rock, you know, they really took on
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  the role of parents for me. Again, I'm, I feel lucky to even
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  have had that because I wonder who I would have been if I
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  didn't have that or those prayers.
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  And my grandmother, like I said, she's just like, was like a
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  Mother Teresa. People would call her.
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  I think she had a gift of prayer, you know, and she, she
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  wrote a book at 84 years old called No More Holes in My Shoes
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  because she grew up very poor. And she lived a Cinderella story
• 18:04
  with my grandfather, you know, who was like, I'll take care of
• 18:07
  you. And he worked three jobs and
• 18:09
  was, you know, an Italian American immigrant and.
• 18:13
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 18:14
  And just, they lived such a simple, happy, humble life.
• 18:18
  And he was like her hero. And so I would say like, I got
• 18:20
  to see that kind of love where she always respected him.
• 18:23
  It was like, oh, my Prince, she would call him my Prince.
• 18:26
  And, you know, and he just idolized her and just, you know,
• 18:30
  whatever you want, it's yours. I just he he was even towards
• 18:34
  the end of his life when she left to go down the street, like
• 18:36
  to the post office, he said, I prayed for you the whole time.
• 18:39
  I thank God you're back. Like it was just a love that I'm
• 18:43
  so grateful that I got to witness.
• 18:45
  How did they, during this time, and you're kind of beginning to
• 18:48
  fall away from your faith. How did they communicate to you
• 18:52
  about faith, especially in the context of that, the horrific
• 18:56
  tragedy of losing your sister and the and the fire?
• 18:59
  And how did they explain that to you?
• 19:00
  I'm sure there were conversations with them, but it
• 19:03
  didn't. It sounds like it didn't rock
• 19:04
  their faith, even though it rocked your parents and it
• 19:07
  deeply wounded you. I think, I think it, you know,
• 19:10
  it was definitely a tragedy for them, but they were just so
• 19:13
  strong in their faith that they, you know, my grandmother was one
• 19:17
  where if something bad happened, she would just find God in it.
• 19:22
  It is kind of like, you know, Saint Joan of Arcs says battles
• 19:24
  are first won or lost in the mind.
• 19:26
  I would say my grandmother just had a very, very strong mind and
• 19:30
  always was looking for God in it.
• 19:32
  And so I think her faith, you know, said that my sister's in
• 19:36
  heaven. And actually she got a huge
• 19:38
  healing. She went to Metro Gori on a
• 19:40
  pilgrimage and she ended up staying with a family.
• 19:43
  And the girl, my sister's name was Maria.
• 19:45
  And the girl, she stayed with a host family and the girl came
• 19:49
  running up to her. Her name was Maria.
• 19:51
  She was 11 years old, the same age as my sister when she
• 19:54
  passed, blonde hair, blue eyes, the same coloring, and came
• 19:58
  right up to her and gave her a hug.
• 20:00
  And for my grandmother like that, which may seem very
• 20:03
  simple, my grandmother took that as a sign from God, you know,
• 20:06
  that Maria was OK and it healed her.
• 20:08
  So I would say the fact that she not only prayed, she went on a
• 20:11
  pilgrimage, you know, she went seeking God.
• 20:13
  She. Went.
• 20:14
  After the trauma and to heal her.
• 20:16
  And then when she had that encounter, she just saw God in
• 20:19
  that moment and she would recount that.
• 20:22
  And I think a lot of times we forget to recount our blessing
• 20:25
  things because there's all again, all these fires and
• 20:28
  drums. I'm not discounting grief or
• 20:30
  loss. We have to go through the
• 20:31
  process and we have to feel the pain, you know, But at some
• 20:34
  point we just have to unite our pain with the Lords and know
• 20:37
  that He suffers with us and count our blessings.
• 20:41
  Like try to put our mind back on the truth and the good and the
• 20:44
  hope of heaven and you know what is to come, You know, and that
• 20:48
  God is with us even in the greatest suffering.
• 20:50
  So I would say that's what I learned from her.
• 20:52
  She counted her blessings. She recalled that story over.
• 20:55
  She didn't let it just heal her once, she she recounted.
• 20:59
  Anytime God did something great in her life, she would play it
• 21:02
  over and over and over. And think about what the
• 21:05
  psalmist says, how he meditates on what God has done for him, on
• 21:10
  the works of God. And he's always thinking of God.
• 21:12
  He remembers the great things that God has done for him.
• 21:15
  And there's always this, like, constant recollection, renewing
• 21:18
  of the mind about who God is, about what is good, what God has
• 21:22
  done that is good. Because, yeah, our minds can
• 21:25
  take us complete opposite directions if we're not
• 21:30
  thoughtful. You know, we don't, we don't use
• 21:32
  our wills to direct our minds the way that they should go.
• 21:35
  What was the relationship like between your grandma and your
• 21:37
  mother because she's suffering so much?
• 21:40
  Yeah, I think my grandmother always had a tender spot in her
• 21:43
  heart for my mom. She, she really felt bad for.
• 21:46
  And she'd always say, would you all be nice to your mom?
• 21:48
  Be nice to your mom? Because it was maybe not easy to
• 21:51
  be nice to her given, you know, like I was kind of left behind
• 21:55
  was the feeling. But I think my grandmother had
• 21:58
  compassion for her. And I do too, you know,
• 22:00
  especially now I am a mom, so I have compassion and understand
• 22:04
  on a deeper level what that could have looked like.
• 22:07
  Yeah. So she was just trying to love
• 22:10
  your mom and your but your mom, it was completely out of
• 22:13
  Commission, it sounds like so. Yeah, I think when when somebody
• 22:15
  is, is that deeply hurt, you know, it's not.
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• 24:47
  So you're getting involved in you.
• 24:49
  You've been, excuse me, involved in, like you said, theater from
• 24:52
  a very young age. Acting.
• 24:54
  You're now full blown into your career.
• 24:56
  You're doing very fun things, modeling, hosting, acting.
• 25:03
  And you, you see it earlier, you're feeling empty.
• 25:06
  At the end of the day, you'd achieve something, you'd have
• 25:08
  success, and then it would not fill this deep hole in your
• 25:11
  heart. Yeah.
• 25:12
  Was there a moment when you or what was the moment where you
• 25:16
  decided maybe I should turn back to God?
• 25:19
  Oh, yeah, This is, it was a huge moment.
• 25:22
  You know, it was actually a mountaintop moment.
• 25:24
  I was out in LA, in Hollywood. How old are you?
• 25:29
  This was in 2012, so about 13 years ago.
• 25:33
  And I was on this rooftop with the Hollywood sign behind me
• 25:36
  wearing a $4000 dress, doing a photo shoot for a company I
• 25:40
  owned a cosmetic company. And I'm looking in the compact
• 25:44
  mirror at this photo shoot, you know, and it, it looked
• 25:47
  glamorous. It looked like everything the
• 25:49
  world said. And at this point, I had, you
• 25:51
  know, 2 beach houses, 1 you lay in bed, you could see, you know,
• 25:54
  looks like you're floating on the ocean.
• 25:55
  I had another dream house, multiple properties.
• 25:58
  I was investing in real estate around the country.
• 26:01
  I had, you know, fancy car, celebrity, friends, like
• 26:04
  everything that was like, you've made it.
• 26:07
  And now I'm on this rooftop mountaintop moment looking in
• 26:10
  the compact mirror. And I was just like, who are
• 26:14
  you? Who have you become?
• 26:16
  Like I didn't have you ever looked in the mirror and you
• 26:19
  just don't recognize it, you know, like, who is that person?
• 26:21
  Sometimes for better or worse, you know who, who did you
• 26:24
  become? Like, what did this get you?
• 26:27
  Because inside I was just like smashed to pieces.
• 26:30
  Like the pieces at that point, I was so disintegrated with who I
• 26:34
  was as a person in my relationship with the Lord and
• 26:36
  so empty and so lonely. I had I had so many like fake
• 26:41
  friends, you know, like it was just more what can you do for me
• 26:44
  or like at surface level and I was seeking community nudity.
• 26:48
  I wanted to be united with God. I just knew I was so smashed to
• 26:52
  pieces. So that day I went out on, you
• 26:54
  know, I it kind of hit me. Something was really off and I
• 26:57
  really need a God in my life was on rodeo Dr. hanging out
• 27:01
  celebrities finally get back to my hotel like temptations, crazy
• 27:06
  temptations, some drummer from the Grammys trying to get me to
• 27:09
  go do things with him. And I just can't believe like I
• 27:11
  was like, oh, should I like, no. And by the grace of God, I got
• 27:16
  back to my hotel room and I'm just spent the night crying on
• 27:20
  the the shower floor for hours, like hours.
• 27:23
  I got out of the shower. Like I look in the mirror.
• 27:26
  I have like black mascara running down my face.
• 27:29
  My hair is just from all like the heat products, you know,
• 27:32
  from the photo shoot a mess. I look like a heavy metal rock
• 27:35
  star. But when I was in the shower, I
• 27:38
  said the first true, true prayer in years because my prayers were
• 27:42
  like, God, can I work with this person?
• 27:44
  Can I have this? Can I have that?
• 27:45
  Like more very irreverent. I'm not proud of that at all.
• 27:50
  But I finally said a true prayer of Lord, I need you.
• 27:53
  I'm broken, I'm lost, my life isn't working.
• 27:57
  You know, everyone told me this was going to make me happy.
• 28:00
  I'm not happy. I don't know what to do.
• 28:03
  And I think it was at that moment that all my grandparents
• 28:06
  prayers, all those years rushed in because my heart was open.
• 28:10
  And so I always tell people like, if you're praying for
• 28:13
  someone, I mean, nobody would ever think I'd be sitting here
• 28:16
  with you talking about God, you know, or using my career for God
• 28:20
  and doing something good. Like that was not who I was.
• 28:23
  I wasn't bad, but I just was so self focused.
• 28:26
  And The thing is, is that in this moment when your heart is
• 28:31
  finally open, all the prayers rush in.
• 28:33
  So I would say if you're, if someone's listening to this and
• 28:35
  they're praying for somebody or you're praying for somebody to
• 28:38
  pray for their heart to be open to receive the prayer, the
• 28:41
  second it's there, it's not wasted.
• 28:44
  Our prayers are not wasted. Any act of love that we do on
• 28:46
  this planet is not wasted. So I returned from this trip in
• 28:51
  Hollywood and I was living in Austin, TX and I'm wide awake in
• 28:54
  my bathroom, walking to my closet of all places, wide awake
• 28:58
  and I'm stopped dead in my tracks.
• 29:00
  I had no idea what was going on. It was like a near death
• 29:03
  experience. I don't know if you've heard of
• 29:05
  the illumination of conscience, but Saint Faustina talks about
• 29:09
  it, I think St. Padre Pio.
• 29:11
  It's in the Catechism, it's in the Bible.
• 29:13
  You know, we will have to account for what we did or
• 29:15
  didn't do on earth. I think it will be shown to all
• 29:18
  of us in different ways. But it's an illumination of the
• 29:21
  soul. And I basically was shown it in
• 29:25
  columns and I was shown to my left.
• 29:26
  Like I had this column to the left that was all my sins.
• 29:29
  And I didn't, again, I thought I was a great person, like I
• 29:32
  didn't, I wasn't trying to be bad.
• 29:34
  I was nice to people, but it was loaded with all these sins and
• 29:38
  also the ripple effect. So I saw like, I addressed him
• 29:41
  modestly and someone copied me and copied them and copied them
• 29:45
  and copied. And I was just like, what?
• 29:48
  Like I didn't even know that I was putting that influence out
• 29:50
  there and that it was wrong. I didn't know because I was
• 29:53
  dressing like the culture and, you know, being in the fashion
• 29:55
  industry and stuff, I didn't understand until it was shown to
• 29:59
  me in full light. And I was, I mean, I was
• 30:00
  devastated. I dropped to the ground very
• 30:02
  quickly, you know, when all this started happening.
• 30:05
  And then I was shown to my right was a good column.
• 30:08
  And that column was the column to love and to be who I was
• 30:12
  created to be like all the gifts and graces everything, the
• 30:15
  talents, everything God gave me to like make the world a better
• 30:18
  place. And I wasn't even shown anything
• 30:20
  in that column. I was shown a line that was
• 30:23
  really low to the bottom, like like you didn't love.
• 30:28
  There was nothing in the column. There I didn't.
• 30:29
  I wasn't sure. I'm sure I had something, but
• 30:31
  the way it was shown to me, it was a line of like, you missed
• 30:35
  the mark and the pain of that and seeing that like I had a
• 30:40
  purpose and I didn't love was the most excruciating pain.
• 30:44
  And then this column, the good column lifted up.
• 30:46
  I was shown and that if there was something in it, it would
• 30:48
  have crushed my worst sin. I didn't know Love covers a
• 30:51
  multitude of sins, and Saint John to the Cross is in the
• 30:54
  evening of life. We will be judged on love alone.
• 30:56
  But like I, that is our judgement.
• 30:58
  Our judgement is on love. And I think that's why there's
• 31:01
  such an attack against us, you know, against our lives, against
• 31:04
  birth, against babies, and against us once we're actually
• 31:07
  on the planet. And that's why the enemy wants
• 31:09
  all the fires to consume us because we have a good column
• 31:13
  and we each one of us has a very special mission to fulfill
• 31:17
  different gifts, different graces.
• 31:18
  We don't need to be somebody else that God gave everybody
• 31:21
  their own thing. And when we start to see that in
• 31:25
  each other, we build each other up, we come together, we want to
• 31:28
  get out of bed. We realize like our missions are
• 31:31
  important and we will be judged. And if we loved.
• 31:35
  Gives me chills hearing that and I think about the fact that
• 31:38
  Jesus Christ is love, right? He's given he's the one who can
• 31:44
  take away our sin. He saves us and that one little
• 31:48
  bit of love like that opening of the heart to say God, here I am.
• 31:51
  Let me be whatever you want me to be.
• 31:53
  I trust in you that can overcome any evil we've done because of
• 31:59
  Jesus's gift, you know, to us of, of giving his whole life to
• 32:02
  us and dying for us. There's so many questions I have
• 32:07
  even just about that experience you had because I think there's
• 32:10
  a lot that can be gleaned from it.
• 32:12
  When you mentioned the two columns and you had the column
• 32:15
  of your sins, basically you mentioned modesty and that was a
• 32:19
  big one. Was there omission?
• 32:22
  Sense of omission. That was the good column.
• 32:23
  The column was the sense of omission.
• 32:26
  Yeah. So the column to love had
• 32:28
  nothing but sense of omission. It was empty, Yeah, so there
• 32:32
  was. So the two.
• 32:33
  Columns 1 was just things you had committed that was wrong.
• 32:35
  And then sins of omission were just an empty column.
• 32:37
  I mean, that was that was that visibility of it.
• 32:40
  And then I'm curious if there are other insights you received.
• 32:42
  I mean, I think the modesty 1 is pretty convicting because, and
• 32:46
  it's interesting that in your illumination it wasn't about
• 32:49
  leading other people to lust, it was actually about being a bad
• 32:52
  example to other women. Yes, yeah.
• 32:55
  And even innocently, because I didn't know that, that I didn't
• 32:59
  know theology of the body, I didn't know Saint JB 2.
• 33:03
  I don't even know how men think when they see women.
• 33:05
  Like I was just following the culture and you know what I
• 33:08
  thought was going to make me beautiful.
• 33:10
  Of course, now I know that modesty protects the heart, but
• 33:13
  I didn't know that at the time. So I was shocked.
• 33:16
  I mean, I really was shocked to see that and to see that I was
• 33:19
  setting and I was shown, I was given a gift of leadership and
• 33:21
  that was leading people in the wrong direction.
• 33:23
  Were there other things that you feel comfortable sharing about
• 33:27
  that we're convicting for you in that moment because it sounds
• 33:30
  like you were living a good like this is the thing that's so
• 33:33
  compelling. I think about your story and
• 33:35
  relatable is you were living, you were an honest
• 33:37
  businesswoman. You were accomplished.
• 33:40
  You were sweet and kind of people.
• 33:42
  You weren't some jerk out there doing drugs and crazy stuff like
• 33:45
  you were doing. I think a lot of people in our
• 33:47
  culture probably look at you or did look at you and think, oh,
• 33:50
  she's a role model. Look at this career woman who's
• 33:52
  like very loving and sweet and feminine and being beautiful
• 33:55
  work. So it wasn't that you were bad
• 33:59
  by worldly standards. Yeah, I think that was what was
• 34:01
  shocking to me. I actually thought I was a good
• 34:03
  person and had a free ticket to heaven.
• 34:05
  And and I and I don't like what was shown to me.
• 34:08
  I pray for everyone who's watching or listening to this.
• 34:11
  They're in a better spot than me because I was shown.
• 34:13
  I actually like God doesn't stand over you and say like you
• 34:16
  go to hell, you know, you go to purgatory.
• 34:19
  You do, you know, it's it's not like that.
• 34:21
  It was the soul itself sees what it missed and I wanted to throw
• 34:26
  myself into hell. I was just like I could.
• 34:30
  I was horrified. It was painful.
• 34:32
  And that's God's mercy and justice.
• 34:34
  It was an act of mercy to show me this, but it was also an act
• 34:37
  of justice for me to see that. And I would say like I was
• 34:40
  showing I was very selfish that it was all about like, what,
• 34:44
  what can I get? What could you know, like look
• 34:46
  at me, look at me and it I, I actually never expected to go
• 34:49
  back and film and television. I had a break.
• 34:51
  I've made a vow never to go on camera again, which is
• 34:53
  hysterical because I'm on camera all the time.
• 34:55
  But God had to put me back in, had it be his plan.
• 34:59
  And I think that's the difference is when we just try
• 35:01
  to do things for ourselves because we want to do it and
• 35:04
  we're not walking with God. That's a recipe for a disaster.
• 35:07
  So even selfishness, you know, because God is love and when we
• 35:10
  receive his love, love is a relationship.
• 35:12
  We want to go deeper with other people.
• 35:15
  After that illumination of conscience, you, what did you
• 35:20
  do? I mean, did you feel hope?
• 35:21
  Did you? Were you tempted to
• 35:23
  hopelessness? No, I would I would say I was
• 35:26
  motivated like I read the full Bible front to back in two
• 35:30
  months. I didn't know you should
• 35:32
  probably start with the Gospel of John, but I was just like.
• 35:35
  What did I do? I want to be a different job.
• 35:37
  I need to know what I did wrong and I'm reading the Bible and I
• 35:40
  felt like it was open to me for the first time and I didn't
• 35:43
  realize the questions to everything we have in life or in
• 35:46
  the Bible. So I was just got really into
• 35:48
  scripture. And at the time, I actually was
• 35:51
  going to like a big Christian Church, but I was singing on
• 35:55
  stage and it was still all about me, you know, and I was reading
• 35:59
  about Jesus being lost in the temple, listening to the
• 36:02
  teachers. Of course, you know, he was
• 36:04
  teaching them to and amazed they were amazed by the things coming
• 36:07
  out of his mouth. But I wanted to be lost in a
• 36:09
  temple. I wanted to find something where
• 36:11
  I could really like connect with God in a deeper way.
• 36:14
  And the Catholic Church kept coming to mind.
• 36:17
  And I was, one day I would just resolved, I'm going to go to
• 36:20
  daily Mass and, and go. And when I walked in, I felt
• 36:23
  like the stained glass windows just for singing.
• 36:25
  And it was just the beauty, you know, there's just such a beauty
• 36:28
  to the artwork and the statues and the presentation, you know,
• 36:32
  and the altar. And I just felt like I was at
• 36:34
  home. And I started going to church
• 36:37
  and joining ministries and just really just throwing myself into
• 36:42
  the work of the Lord and ended up in the secular Carmelites for
• 36:45
  four years as well and made first promises.
• 36:48
  So this was this in Austin or in LA?
• 36:50
  That was in Austin, in Austin. There, what church was it?
• 36:53
  Saint Thomas More. OK, I don't know if I've been to
• 36:55
  that one, but I know there's in every city in America.
• 36:59
  Well, not every, but most. There is at least one really
• 37:02
  beautiful church, not every, but most.
• 37:04
  So it's like finding, I mean, they're all blessed, obviously
• 37:07
  the blessed sacraments there, but finding those beautiful
• 37:11
  inspiring ones are are such a gift.
• 37:13
  So were you still doing any acting, producing right, you
• 37:17
  know any hosting anything during this time or you're kind of on,
• 37:21
  Hey, it is just I want to get deeper into faith.
• 37:23
  Yeah, well, I still, I still had, I was so modeling and stuff
• 37:26
  and have my cosmetic company, which, you know, took seven
• 37:29
  years to build and have my life savings invested in it.
• 37:33
  And you know, then I had this experience and Lila, this is
• 37:36
  really it's, it's hard for me to wrap my mind around and it's
• 37:39
  interesting how God works. But the name of my company,
• 37:42
  which sounded great in Italian, meant naughty.
• 37:45
  And now I'm like had this reversion and I own a company
• 37:48
  that means naughty cosmetics, Kativa Cosmetics.
• 37:51
  So it sounds great. And the brand was very high end
• 37:54
  and sold in, you know, Stanley Korshak in Dallas and on Sunset
• 37:57
  Blvd. in Hollywood and you know, West Hollywood.
• 38:01
  So it was a beautiful looking brand, crystal studded Swarovski
• 38:05
  crystal lip glosses, you know, but the message that I was
• 38:09
  sending. So then I tried to change the
• 38:11
  message to, you know, making naughty nice like howdy.
• 38:15
  And then I was like how you can't make naughty nice, you
• 38:20
  know, And I just, I kind of looked back.
• 38:21
  I even my discernment in picking the title, like Karina cosmetics
• 38:25
  was available at the time or Karita, which meant love and I
• 38:29
  just went down the wrong path. I picked the wrong thing and I
• 38:32
  couldn't reconcile it. So, you know, few and a half
• 38:34
  years in, it was because I had a lot invested in this company
• 38:38
  through spiritual direction, through prayer.
• 38:40
  I just couldn't. It was so heavy.
• 38:42
  And you know, the book I just wrote Become the Fire is based
• 38:45
  on Saint Ignatius of Loyola discerning God's will.
• 38:47
  So I was studying the Saints. I was studying discernment of
• 38:50
  spirits and I was like, I am so heavy doing this.
• 38:52
  This is not me anymore. I can't and so I basically left
• 38:56
  everything to start full time ministry with no job insight.
• 38:59
  And that was 9 1/2 years ago, so.
• 39:03
  What does that mean? You left everything you just the
• 39:05
  the companies defunct. Yeah, I, I was 70% owner.
• 39:08
  I did. I gave it away for free, but I
• 39:10
  prayed that it didn't ever take off again.
• 39:12
  It never did. So because I just couldn't be a
• 39:16
  part of it. I had to walk away, I had to
• 39:18
  close the doors and I don't think it could survive without
• 39:21
  me kind of start. To see a makeup line that is an
• 39:25
  in skin care line that's aligned.
• 39:27
  Yeah, something something more aligned, but yeah, I.
• 39:29
  Talk. We need one.
• 39:31
  Yeah, so. But, you know, it seemed like a
• 39:35
  hard decision. I think a lot of people were
• 39:36
  shocked by this. But to me, like when you do the
• 39:39
  right thing, it just feels light and bright.
• 39:42
  And I finally had peace and joy in my heart and was open and I
• 39:46
  had no idea what God was going to do.
• 39:48
  I just knew I wanted to serve him.
• 39:50
  And and you know, here we are years later, and he came through
• 39:53
  So so was this. Before or after you discern
• 39:56
  joining the Carmelites? I have to think back and maybe
• 39:59
  like within there I was already with starting with them.
• 40:02
  I think there must have been an overlap because I was really
• 40:04
  deep in prayer, you know, and I would say like the beautiful
• 40:07
  thing about the spiritual life, you know, in Saint John of the
• 40:09
  Cross is when you think everything's the lost, you're
• 40:12
  actually could be like getting. Closer to God, you know, because
• 40:14
  his light is blinding you and you're kind of seeing how far
• 40:17
  you are and how far in a merciful way, you know, And so I
• 40:21
  just, I love the Carmelites and prayer and Saint Teresa of
• 40:24
  Avila. And, you know, when I read her
• 40:25
  book, it was interior castle and I just, I felt like I could
• 40:29
  relate to her and I just loved all the things that she was
• 40:32
  writing. That's when I, you know, found
• 40:34
  out that there was a secular order.
• 40:36
  So you could, you could, you know, you don't have to be a
• 40:38
  nun. Those are the nuns are
• 40:39
  cloistered the secular order or lay people.
• 40:43
  So are you a MEMP? Did you become a member or you
• 40:45
  were saying you were discerning? Yeah, I was discerning and I did
• 40:48
  make first promises. I was there four years, but then
• 40:51
  with my travel, I couldn't make the monthly meeting.
• 40:54
  So then I just discerned basically it's on hold unless if
• 40:57
  God ever wants me back. But sometimes, you know, God
• 40:59
  sends us places for a period of time and I just look back at all
• 41:04
  that formation and all the silent retreats and them and the
• 41:07
  readings we did and, you know, just meeting and community and
• 41:10
  and how I got to witness love through prayer.
• 41:14
  I could not do what I'm doing today if it wasn't for that
• 41:18
  preparation, you know, and, and to look at things through the
• 41:22
  eyes of faith. I love that perspective because
• 41:24
  when we follow the promptings of the Holy Spirit, he is our
• 41:28
  teacher, right? He's our guide, our counselor.
• 41:31
  And he will take us in a school of love.
• 41:32
  And it will maybe take us to the Carmelites for a season and
• 41:35
  it'll take us to the Franciscan Friars, or it'll take us to
• 41:38
  wherever it's going to take us. And we learn one step, you know,
• 41:42
  each step of the way, whatever he has to teach us.
• 41:44
  So during all of this time, you're also a mom, you become a
• 41:49
  mom, you have a relationship, the father of your children.
• 41:54
  Tell me that story and how that connects with this whole
• 41:58
  spiritual conversion that you're experiencing.
• 42:01
  Yeah, yeah, my kids are the the best thing that has ever
• 42:04
  happened to me. Honestly, like I've had, if you
• 42:06
  read my book, I master the pieces to a lot of broken
• 42:08
  pieces. We all do.
• 42:10
  But my kids, for some reason, God was easy with me.
• 42:13
  Like I told them all the time, either you have me fooled,
• 42:16
  either you're really good or you have me fooled.
• 42:18
  I was like, either way, don't let me know because I think the
• 42:20
  world of them, I really, really do.
• 42:22
  My daughter is Sienna and my son is Blake.
• 42:25
  But, well, you know, when I had gotten married, Lila, there was
• 42:28
  a lot of I have an annulment, by the way, you know, in the
• 42:31
  Catholic Church, but I didn't discern.
• 42:33
  I didn't know discernment of spirits.
• 42:34
  I didn't know discerning God's will, you know, And like looking
• 42:37
  back, there were a lot of things that were very wrong, but.
• 42:39
  Is this pre conversion? Yeah, so it's pre conversion,
• 42:42
  you know, and, and oddly enough, now I'm, I have my certification
• 42:46
  and the catechesis on human love.
• 42:48
  I've taught marriage prep classes.
• 42:49
  So God's just funny how he, like, brings that around.
• 42:53
  The girl who didn't was shown she didn't love, like got
• 42:55
  certified in love. I don't know what that means,
• 42:58
  but I'm trying to help people. I'm trying to live it.
• 43:01
  But I didn't discern it. And it was a horrible marriage
• 43:03
  and I'm so grateful to be out of it.
• 43:05
  But my children are the best thing that ever came from.
• 43:09
  And I, you know, in some way, I think there's no way that could
• 43:11
  be a mistake because of how incredible.
• 43:14
  Like I can't imagine this Earth without that.
• 43:16
  You mentioned an annulment. I do think it's really
• 43:18
  instructive for people to understand what that means.
• 43:22
  I mean, people have heard, I'm sure the word annulment.
• 43:24
  They're like, oh, that's Catholic divorce.
• 43:26
  And it's not. It's not so can you share both
• 43:30
  your discernment process when you're becoming passionate in
• 43:33
  your faith and following your faith?
• 43:35
  You're still married. During part of this, you discern
• 43:38
  that this is not a marriage, and that's ultimately corroborated
• 43:42
  that it wasn't actually a marriage.
• 43:43
  Can you share whatever you're comfortable sharing?
• 43:45
  Yeah, about that. I wish I knew that annulments
• 43:48
  existed earlier on. I don't think I would have
• 43:51
  stayed married 15 years and and suffered what I did, but an
• 43:56
  enrollment is basically going back and looking at the before
• 44:00
  the marriage, like right at the union and before it where their
• 44:04
  puzzle pieces missing that actually invalidated the
• 44:07
  sacrament. So after I turned my life back
• 44:09
  to God and I realized what a sacrament is, you know, and I
• 44:12
  was trying to save the marriage and go on a retreat and meet
• 44:15
  with a marriage counselor and all this, but it didn't feel
• 44:17
  Sacramento. It didn't feel grace filled and
• 44:20
  I just knew something was wrong. And that's when I met with
• 44:23
  spiritual directors and, you know, people who could help me
• 44:26
  navigate that. But I would say that even
• 44:29
  there's a lot of misinformation out there because even one of
• 44:31
  the women that was in the Carmelites with me said to me
• 44:34
  like, oh, you're divorced, you can't receive communion.
• 44:36
  And that's not true. Obviously no one can receive
• 44:39
  communion if you're like living in a, you know, in sin.
• 44:43
  But I, I wasn't and it wasn't, you know, and I had my annulment
• 44:48
  and I wasn't like living with another guy or, you know, doing
• 44:51
  anything where I couldn't receive.
• 44:52
  So an annulment is basically saying the marriage never took
• 44:55
  place. There's no divorce.
• 44:57
  I mean, I think this is very maybe shocking to some people
• 45:03
  that you are falling more deeply into your faith.
• 45:06
  You're you're entering more deeply into your faith is just
• 45:08
  that you're reunited with your Catholic faith.
• 45:11
  You're attending Mass, you're deepening your prayer life.
• 45:13
  You're, you know, confessing your sins.
• 45:14
  You're rejecting the ways of the world, trying to follow God's
• 45:16
  plan to your life. You are married at this point by
• 45:18
  the world's code, right? Yeah.
• 45:22
  And you have two beautiful children.
• 45:23
  Yeah. And you discern in that process
• 45:25
  that actually I'm not married. I've never been married.
• 45:28
  And we need to separate. Yes.
• 45:30
  I think some people hearing that would think, oh gosh, so you
• 45:34
  become a Jesus follower and then you leave your husband.
• 45:36
  You know that the the the negative, cynical view of that.
• 45:39
  Yeah, sure. Walk us through what that really
• 45:42
  was and why ultimately, it was God's call not to leave your
• 45:46
  marriage, but to discern that this wasn't a marriage to begin
• 45:49
  with. Yeah, I mean, honestly, I was
• 45:52
  shocked because at first I was really, because now I know what
• 45:55
  marriage is and I'm doing everything I can to make it the
• 45:58
  Sacramento marriage. But it wouldn't.
• 46:00
  And I would say there were very serious things wrong.
• 46:04
  And, you know, just for the sake of my children and their
• 46:07
  protection, I I don't feel like I need to get into what those
• 46:09
  pieces are. But I had priests and counselors
• 46:13
  telling me it was an unfixable situation and that they actually
• 46:18
  recommended the annulment process to me.
• 46:20
  So that could be shocking too, right?
• 46:22
  Like, oh, you have a priest telling you get out of this.
• 46:25
  But it wasn't Sacramento. It wasn't a marriage.
• 46:28
  And and it was deep prayer. You know, this is not was not an
• 46:31
  overnight discernment and and I pray for my ex and you know, and
• 46:34
  I I forgive him and it's OK, but it's, it's sometimes you have to
• 46:40
  really just, you know, I was living a different life.
• 46:45
  Now I turn my life to God and I have the light of Christ.
• 46:48
  And in that light, we get to see things, you know, more clearly.
• 46:53
  And what I saw the most clearly is this was not a sacrament.
• 46:58
  And so it goes through the annulment process.
• 47:00
  It's not like I get to declare it's not a sacrament.
• 47:02
  You know, you submit it to the authorities, It gets submitted
• 47:05
  to the authorities of the Church.
• 47:06
  It goes through a tribunal. And there's witnesses, you know.
• 47:10
  And so in the process, Lila, this will also shock people.
• 47:15
  I got my annulment in six months, but my ex appealed it to
• 47:19
  Rome and I got stuck in Rome for seven years.
• 47:23
  So for many years I've only been able to date but not get
• 47:26
  married. So it's kind of like, what's the
• 47:28
  point? So I'm finally able to get
• 47:30
  married. I actually feel a strong
• 47:31
  vocation of marriage and I am single and I'm looking forward.
• 47:35
  I feel like God has been preparing me for whoever he has
• 47:39
  for me. And it's going to be Sacramento
• 47:42
  and it's going to be beautiful, you know, and that man will love
• 47:44
  my children as his own and they'll love him as a dad.
• 47:47
  I believe that I do. So I think there is a big
• 47:50
  difference of looking back at our lives when God is cleaning
• 47:54
  it up and say like, what is really, really off here and what
• 47:58
  is, you know, what can we do about it?
• 48:01
  And unfortunately it was not a fixable situation.
• 48:04
  I know for the sake of the your kids privacy and respect you,
• 48:08
  there are certain details you cannot share.
• 48:10
  But I do think it is helpful for people because there are a lot
• 48:14
  of people who are struggling in their marriages or they have a
• 48:17
  friend who is and divorce would be a relief.
• 48:22
  But it is not a situation that's unknowable.
• 48:26
  You know, this is this was a marriage, but there's they're
• 48:28
  just having struggles in their marriage.
• 48:30
  And so I do think that there is, you know, this teeter totter,
• 48:34
  right, the culture that is very much pro divorce today.
• 48:37
  Just if there's an issue, leave each other, right?
• 48:40
  And then the God's way, which is, you know, marriage is for
• 48:44
  life until death to us part, but it has to be a marriage for that
• 48:48
  to apply. And the prerequisites of a
• 48:50
  marriage include you go into this with full knowledge of what
• 48:54
  you're getting yourself into, freedom that you're committing
• 48:57
  this fully with your whole heart.
• 48:59
  You have the intention to be married for life, to be open for
• 49:01
  children. There's certain prerequisites
• 49:02
  that make it a marriage. Those prerequisites aren't
• 49:05
  there. Then there could be grounds for
• 49:07
  annulment because maybe you went into this thing.
• 49:10
  Yeah. I'm not going to have kids with
• 49:11
  this person or I'm not going to tell this person about this
• 49:14
  secret life I'm living. Then that person can't really
• 49:17
  choose you because you are not telling them the truth about
• 49:20
  yourself. These are examples of grounds
• 49:21
  for annulment. Is there anything more you feel
• 49:24
  comfortable sharing even generally about maybe a message
• 49:28
  to people listening who in tough situations in their marriage or
• 49:32
  they know marriages that are struggling and there may be a
• 49:35
  temptation to, well, I'm just going to get an annulment to try
• 49:38
  to start over. And maybe there's not grounds
• 49:40
  for annulment and this is just a difficult season you have to
• 49:44
  navigate. Yeah, that this is where it gets
• 49:46
  really difficult because the the attack is on the family.
• 49:49
  I think it was saying JP two said that and relationships are
• 49:54
  under attack through marriage, even friendships, like because
• 49:57
  God is a relationship, right? And relationship and love are
• 50:01
  one. And then we're all called into
• 50:03
  communion with each other. And then through marriage,
• 50:05
  through this really deep union, there's going to be a great
• 50:08
  attack against it. And so there needs to also be a
• 50:11
  great discernment of is this an attack against something that's
• 50:14
  so beautiful and how can it be repaired and fixed versus
• 50:18
  something that is not Sacramento to begin with?
• 50:21
  So I would say this is like, really, there's a fine line.
• 50:24
  I, you know, I don't want to each individual is specific
• 50:29
  situation that I think needs to go to prayer.
• 50:32
  And maybe the first thing to ask would be like, Lord, you know,
• 50:36
  is this Sacramento or is this just an attack?
• 50:39
  Because there's something so beautiful here and the enemy
• 50:42
  knows the difference that we can make as a family.
• 50:45
  And I would say to anyone who is struggling to definitely to meet
• 50:49
  with priests and, you know, people that you trust who are
• 50:52
  very prayerful and skilled to help you discern the difference
• 50:56
  between something that can be worked on and saved versus
• 50:59
  something that never existed. You know, in the case of an
• 51:02
  annulment, it's such a intimate, deep thing.
• 51:07
  And obviously, like I've done marriage prep, but I can't wait
• 51:10
  to be married. Like I am so excited about it,
• 51:12
  you know, but I also know that there are attacks on the family
• 51:17
  and on marriage because it's a representation of God and it's 2
• 51:21
  souls coming together. And so that is an individual
• 51:25
  deep discernment, but it's just sacred.
• 51:29
  It's just so, so, so sacred. But mine became, you know, three
• 51:33
  years of prayer was an overnight discernment, just so clear that
• 51:37
  it wasn't a sacrament. And there were things that we're
• 51:39
  not going to be able to be worked out.
• 51:42
  And again, I never looked back. This was a light at the end
• 51:45
  after the deep discernment and the tears and the crying, you
• 51:48
  know, it was a like, OK, this, I'm moving now in the right
• 51:53
  direction. So God is always about love.
• 51:56
  He's always about truth. He's never going to separate two
• 52:00
  people that were joined together.
• 52:02
  That's the Scripture. Nobody should separate what God
• 52:06
  has joined together, and He means it, and He means business.
• 52:09
  To be the one joining, yeah, but God.
• 52:11
  Has to be joined. So that is the question, did God
• 52:14
  join you together? Did you discern properly?
• 52:17
  Was something missing? You know, did you have?
• 52:20
  In my case, I had a childhood trauma and couldn't return home
• 52:23
  to my house, you know, And so I knew in college I just had to
• 52:26
  pick a husband. That's a wrong reason to get
• 52:29
  married. That is grounds for an
• 52:31
  annulment, you know, and there were many grounds to pick from.
• 52:34
  You know, there's different Canon laws.
• 52:36
  I will look up the Canon laws. I would try to see where their
• 52:39
  puzzle pieces missing during your discernment leading up to
• 52:44
  the marriage. Did you know what you were
• 52:45
  getting into on my wedding day? My ex did something the night
• 52:51
  before that I felt was a betrayal.
• 52:53
  And on my wedding day, I told my best friend I can't marry him.
• 52:57
  And people had traveled in for the wedding.
• 52:59
  My grandparents left me $16,000 like I had to pay them back, you
• 53:03
  know, And so on my wedding day, I knew I wasn't supposed to get
• 53:07
  married. And she said you just have cold
• 53:09
  feet. You have, you have to do this.
• 53:11
  So literally there, you know, I can trace it back to there were
• 53:14
  very things very, very wrong on the actual day of the wedding.
• 53:20
  So I just think that's where we need to look is what was that
• 53:24
  discernment? What was the before that
• 53:26
  marriage? Was somebody deceived?
• 53:28
  Was something hidden from them? You know, and then look at the
• 53:31
  Canon laws and talk to a priest about it.
• 53:34
  God doesn't want people in anything that's unhealthy,
• 53:37
  abusive. You know, certainly if someone's
• 53:40
  hurting you, like get yourself to a safe place while you try to
• 53:43
  figure this out. Do not stay in abusive
• 53:46
  relationships or things that are hurting your, your mind or your
• 53:50
  heart, your soul, or letting someone sin against you and get
• 53:54
  to a safe place to make that discernment and get that the
• 53:56
  help. It's just, it's such a fragile
• 53:59
  topic, Lila. I have an annulment, but I have
• 54:02
  serious grounds for an annulment and I wasn't able to make a
• 54:06
  proper discernment given my past, you know?
• 54:10
  Because marriage is so precious and so God designed.
• 54:15
  Because marriage is marriage. It's a sacrament.
• 54:19
  That's why there is there is a code, you know, for what it
• 54:23
  means to get married. It's not just because you walk
• 54:25
  up and you say we're married now or you get a slip of paper.
• 54:28
  I mean, right now the government's handing out same
• 54:30
  sex marriage licenses, you know, and polyamorous, you know,
• 54:34
  licenses are potentially going to be offered and, and things
• 54:36
  like that. So the question is, what does
• 54:38
  God say about marriage? And I think, you know, there
• 54:43
  also is this, and I appreciate you by the way, talking about
• 54:45
  this with me because it is a very sensitive topic, as you
• 54:48
  know, we personally have experienced.
• 54:50
  I know many people who have been on different parts of this very
• 54:54
  sensitive topic and I do think it's so important to talk about
• 54:57
  because I think Satan does his best work when everybody is
• 55:01
  afraid to talk about it and silent.
• 55:04
  And so another question, if I may, just about your experience
• 55:08
  of the annulment process. Was there anything that
• 55:11
  surprised you as you coming back into your faith about what
• 55:14
  marriage actually means? And then also what it what an
• 55:18
  annulment process even is that before you had no idea about
• 55:21
  before you're falling back in deeply into your faith?
• 55:25
  Yeah, I, well, and I funny enough, I ended up on like the
• 55:28
  annulment pathway to healing team.
• 55:30
  Like God, it's just so funny and how he like, but it is a healing
• 55:33
  process and you have to go back in the annulment process to look
• 55:37
  at all these pieces, your childhood, family of origin, the
• 55:40
  other person's family of origin, their childhood.
• 55:44
  You're trying to like put things together.
• 55:46
  It's not an easy process. I would say it's painful to some
• 55:49
  extent, to a big extent, but just going into those places,
• 55:55
  trying to figure things out, letting God heal those those
• 55:58
  pieces and putting you back together is a big part of it.
• 56:02
  But I, yeah, I was surprised by the process.
• 56:05
  I got the annulment in six months.
• 56:07
  I was very surprised that you can appeal an annulment for
• 56:10
  $1000 and send it straight to Rome and that it got stuck there
• 56:14
  for seven years. And that was a great pain and
• 56:17
  suffering for me. And I don't think the Pope even
• 56:19
  knows like that that was the process because he had, Pope
• 56:23
  Francis had streamlined things quite a bit.
• 56:25
  So, so just to be clear, you actually had the annulment, but
• 56:28
  then you didn't have it anymore? I had no.
• 56:30
  I had the annulment, but since the appeal took seven years, I
• 56:33
  wasn't allowed to get married. So I could date, but I couldn't
• 56:36
  get. Married for seven years.
• 56:38
  Old Yeah, you. Knew the marriage was not valid
• 56:40
  you just couldn't get another you just couldn't get married I.
• 56:42
  Needed I needed the Roman Rhoda to affirm the decision of the
• 56:47
  diocese because it went to a higher court.
• 56:49
  And So what happens is Rome gets anything that gets appealed from
• 56:53
  the whole world, not just the this country gets sent to the
• 56:56
  Roman Rhoda and it got stuck there for many years.
• 56:59
  And so I finally, by the grace of God on Our Lady of perpetual
• 57:02
  helps feast day got a couple years ago, have my annulment and
• 57:07
  no one can ever repeal it or take it away from me.
• 57:10
  And you know, so it was a it's not the typical process, but I
• 57:14
  even in that I feel like God kept me from marrying the wrong
• 57:17
  person. I think he gave me time to heal,
• 57:19
  gave me time to grow so that when the right person comes, I
• 57:23
  am ready And I know it's a sacrament and I, you know, I
• 57:26
  like trust me, I never want to go through that again.
• 57:28
  So I'm only going to marry who God says and like, and it's
• 57:31
  going to be forever and it will be, you know, indissolvable and
• 57:34
  nobody's going to be able to separate this because I am going
• 57:38
  to pray like there's no tomorrow and I know what it means.
• 57:41
  So that's that's a huge difference to go into the
• 57:45
  process of looking at something that I didn't understand what it
• 57:48
  was to now I know what this is and I'm going to treasure it and
• 57:51
  I'm going to fight for it and I'm going to work for it.
• 57:53
  And I know that I'm not going to say yes or walk down the aisle
• 57:57
  until God himself puts in my heart.
• 57:59
  This is the one I have for you. How were your kids impacted by
• 58:03
  your conversion and also by watching you separate?
• 58:07
  You know you and your ex separate.
• 58:10
  Your kids are also watching your conversion.
• 58:12
  How? How have they been impacted?
• 58:14
  And what if you can share whatever you're comfortable
• 58:16
  sharing. I know you want to protect their
• 58:17
  privacy too, but how have how? What has their process been
• 58:20
  like? Yeah.
• 58:21
  Well, I would say, I'm sure I can't speak for the heart of
• 58:25
  somebody else, but I'm sure that the actual divorce part would
• 58:28
  break a child's heart, you know, and that that part is very
• 58:30
  tender and sensitive. So I don't want to ever discount
• 58:33
  that. But I do remember at the time of
• 58:35
  the annulment, you know what, we won't even say divorce.
• 58:38
  It's an annulment that the kids also made comments, you know,
• 58:43
  and told me that they knew it was the right thing.
• 58:46
  You know, that's how bad things were.
• 58:47
  So it's a balance of like they know it's the the right thing
• 58:51
  that we had like this had to happen.
• 58:53
  But at the same time, of course, everybody wants to be 1 big
• 58:56
  happy family. And so it's just a tender place
• 59:00
  to be. But you know, I started all over
• 59:01
  again as a single mom. I left everything for the Lord.
• 59:05
  I actually, I let a lot of things go in the divorce.
• 59:09
  I just wanted to restart and just was so prayerful.
• 59:13
  And we did have moments of suffering and moments where I
• 59:17
  cried out to the Lord for bread from heaven.
• 59:19
  And literally my daughter shows up at the front door with a big
• 59:22
  round loaf of bread. And I was like, what?
• 59:25
  I'm like, I didn't mean that kind of bread, you know, but I
• 59:27
  knew God. Is there money in it?
• 59:29
  But I knew God heard me, you know, and my kids, I started
• 59:32
  sharing stories and they started to see things and our faith got
• 59:34
  built up and God always provided and kept our flower jar full and
• 59:38
  like made a way where there's no way.
• 59:40
  And so they started to just grow in, in prayer, We'd pray
• 59:44
  together every night. And even my son, he's 16 now, he
• 59:47
  goes to weekly confession with me.
• 59:49
  And he's, I'm like, do you want to go to confession?
• 59:50
  They. Oh, yeah, yeah, I want to go,
• 59:52
  let's go. And, you know, my kids both go
• 59:54
  to church and love it. And I think even as teenagers,
• 59:59
  they at some point one of them had kind of gotten a little
• 1:00:03
  confused or pulled a little away from God and then actually came
• 1:00:05
  and confessed to me, hey, mom, you know, like.
• 1:00:09
  I, I started to pull away and I realized that my life is empty
• 1:00:14
  and I feel so lonely. And, you know, I want to come
• 1:00:16
  back to church. I want to be close to God.
• 1:00:18
  I want to pray, you know, And so I think that sometimes we have
• 1:00:21
  to go on that journey alone. But them seeing what God has
• 1:00:26
  done for us, them seeing like, you know, him putting me places
• 1:00:31
  and into things we could be at like Home Depot at the OR the
• 1:00:33
  grocery store and we have an encounter with something And
• 1:00:36
  before I know it, like, you know, everyone's crying.
• 1:00:39
  That person's crying, sharing their story were hugging like
• 1:00:41
  they've gotten to see Christian community and what love looks
• 1:00:44
  like in in new ways. And I think that that has really
• 1:00:47
  strengthened them and they're really just great, prayerful
• 1:00:51
  spiritual children. But I don't discount what like
• 1:00:55
  all of us, I wanted this to be a perfect merit.
• 1:00:58
  Do you know, I don't think anyone goes into it ever,
• 1:01:01
  especially if you don't know what an annulment is.
• 1:01:03
  I don't think you go into something like wanting it to
• 1:01:05
  fall apart. You think like, we'll make a
• 1:01:07
  way, like we'll make this work. And every child wants to be part
• 1:01:11
  of a family. But then I also want to say
• 1:01:13
  something to the men, you know, that might be watching or
• 1:01:15
  listening to this. If you meet a woman who is a
• 1:01:18
  single mom, you know, and who has an annulment, you know,
• 1:01:22
  maybe you're being called to step up and be a dad in a new
• 1:01:25
  way. You know, maybe we need to
• 1:01:27
  realize that these children are still longing for a loving
• 1:01:30
  family and a loving home and A and a family unit.
• 1:01:33
  And maybe that is part of being a man, being a father figure,
• 1:01:37
  you know, maybe if if it's not just biological, but a spiritual
• 1:01:41
  father. And I still, you know, I long to
• 1:01:43
  be a Holy Family. I long for my children to see me
• 1:01:46
  with my future husband and be like, wow, that's what love
• 1:01:49
  looks like. And I know God's going to give
• 1:01:52
  that to me, Lila. I know it because he's God.
• 1:01:55
  Yeah, I already see it. I know it's going to happen and
• 1:01:58
  it's going to be a testament to God's goodness.
• 1:02:01
  And so for the single moms that may be watching this, I want to
• 1:02:04
  give them hope too. 1 is a very small number for God.
• 1:02:07
  Just pay for him to send you the right one, you know, and.
• 1:02:10
  And to know that he loves you and you're not alone.
• 1:02:13
  And I think the greatest desire of every human heart, those
• 1:02:17
  vocation to marriage especially, is to be a Holy Family.
• 1:02:21
  And I and I just, that is what it is all about.
• 1:02:24
  Now, obviously, if you're called to religious life or you want to
• 1:02:27
  be a celibate single, like that's great too.
• 1:02:29
  I mean, there's just different ways to serve and one is not
• 1:02:31
  better than the other. But if you're calling as
• 1:02:33
  marriage, like let it be a Holy Family and, and let God be at
• 1:02:36
  the center of it. And it's never too late for
• 1:02:38
  those that are married and it feels like it's falling apart.
• 1:02:41
  You know, it's never too late to get that grace.
• 1:02:43
  It's never too late to turn to God and to say, like, I need
• 1:02:46
  your strength. I need you in this.
• 1:02:48
  I welcome you in this, you know, and to storm heaven for your
• 1:02:51
  spouse. If if if it if the problems on
• 1:02:53
  the other side like do not give up like storm heaven and and
• 1:02:57
  pray for their heart to be open to receive that grace.
• 1:03:00
  That's so beautiful and encouraging and I hope anyone
• 1:03:03
  listening that they know a single mom or a single dad.
• 1:03:06
  You know, I think there's also single dads today that are
• 1:03:09
  struggling, but both singles that there is.
• 1:03:12
  God has a plan. Yeah.
• 1:03:14
  And I love that you said that there's just takes 1.
• 1:03:17
  It's a small number. Thank God.
• 1:03:18
  It's a small number. Yeah.
• 1:03:20
  And I think it's, it's also about mission, you know, when
• 1:03:22
  you, when you are looking for a spouse or discerning a marriage
• 1:03:26
  is like how, how do you guys serve together as God, as a
• 1:03:30
  couple? What does that look like?
• 1:03:31
  You know, and just knowing that there's always something deeper,
• 1:03:34
  there's a bigger part to his plan.
• 1:03:36
  Beautiful. When you were converting or
• 1:03:40
  reverting, going back to your faith, you left behind some big
• 1:03:44
  opportunities. Yeah.
• 1:03:46
  You mentioned you sold. You didn't even hardly sold, you
• 1:03:49
  just gave away your entire makeup company.
• 1:03:52
  Yeah. And there were other
• 1:03:53
  opportunities to tell me more about that.
• 1:03:56
  Yeah, and actually, I I sold my jewelry, I melted my gold.
• 1:04:01
  I had no money. I left with nothing, and I
• 1:04:05
  started all over again. I sold my diamond ring.
• 1:04:07
  I sold my have my gold melted. I had silver melted.
• 1:04:10
  I left everything. I had enough to live for four
• 1:04:11
  months in cash. I did have real estate, you
• 1:04:14
  know, because I was an investor. So I did have still some real
• 1:04:16
  estate. So, you know, but it wasn't
• 1:04:18
  liquid. So, you know, I made this leap
• 1:04:21
  of faith and I was shaking in my knees as I handed these items
• 1:04:25
  over. But I had a piece that I was
• 1:04:27
  going to try to do what I felt God was calling me to do.
• 1:04:30
  And either I was crazy and in four months I'm just going to go
• 1:04:34
  find something else to do with my life and I made the whole
• 1:04:36
  thing up, or it was God speaking to me and He was going to bless
• 1:04:40
  and multiply my little offering. And I've been in full time
• 1:04:44
  ministry for 9 1/2 years. And when you were selling the,
• 1:04:49
  you know, the jewelry quite literally, and just getting
• 1:04:52
  Kativa, offloading it, you know, multi $1,000,000 deals, just
• 1:04:56
  like we're leaving, we're walking away because I just have
• 1:04:59
  to go pray basically and just radically change my life.
• 1:05:03
  I mean, this is like massive action that you took.
• 1:05:05
  How did you first discern what God was calling you to do
• 1:05:08
  outside of business? Modeling, acting, everything
• 1:05:12
  else. Yeah, it was, it was through
• 1:05:14
  prayer and contemplation and meeting with the spiritual
• 1:05:17
  director and I just knew I wanted to go into full time
• 1:05:19
  ministry. And actually at the time I felt
• 1:05:21
  called the youth ministry, which didn't make sense to me.
• 1:05:24
  I just still didn't understand it.
• 1:05:26
  And through prayer I discerned that that was, am I right about
• 1:05:31
  the semester of the pieces? It's it was just one miracle
• 1:05:34
  after the other of how I found out about a job.
• 1:05:36
  I sent in a resume. I didn't hear about it.
• 1:05:39
  And then all the sudden I was just praying.
• 1:05:42
  I was like, Lord, I thought you wanted me to do this and I
• 1:05:44
  haven't heard from the priest. I said, so put a little fire
• 1:05:47
  under his butt and get him to call me if you want, if this is
• 1:05:49
  your will. And then like my phone rings,
• 1:05:51
  you know? And so it was just a lot of
• 1:05:53
  little miracles and just going to each step.
• 1:05:56
  So I did end up in full time ministry as a youth minister and
• 1:05:59
  director of confirmation. And there I started speaking on
• 1:06:04
  Sundays and I realized I had a gift to speaking I didn't know.
• 1:06:07
  And that was like one of the favorite things, you know, I got
• 1:06:09
  to do as well as working with the youth and hearing their
• 1:06:11
  struggles. And that's where I started like
• 1:06:14
  kind of realizing, wow, like just because you're Catholic
• 1:06:17
  doesn't mean you don't have problems.
• 1:06:19
  And wow, you know, these kids are suffering a lot that I did
• 1:06:22
  and all these broken pieces. And so Master of the Pieces, my
• 1:06:24
  first book was born out of all of those broken pieces and
• 1:06:27
  working with the youth. And so I felt like the Lord sent
• 1:06:30
  me there to to obviously try to help them in any way and to
• 1:06:35
  learn from them and to speak on Sundays.
• 1:06:38
  But then I started getting asked to speak, you know, at
• 1:06:40
  conferences and I couldn't balance both.
• 1:06:42
  So it was just, you know, making another choice of, OK, I was
• 1:06:45
  sent here. I really think sometimes God
• 1:06:47
  just sends us places for periods of time.
• 1:06:50
  I think a lot of people are like, we have this model,
• 1:06:52
  actress, teaching confirmation. I mean, some people are like,
• 1:06:55
  oh, that's so cool. And other people were like, who
• 1:06:57
  is she, you know, to be teaching a sacrament.
• 1:06:59
  So but either way, God sent me there.
• 1:07:02
  And so it also say what what may look ridiculous to the world if
• 1:07:06
  it's God's desire, like don't worry what anybody thinks about
• 1:07:09
  you do it anyway. It's really all that's the main
• 1:07:13
  thing is who are you doing it for?
• 1:07:15
  And then when I went there and learned I was a speaker and
• 1:07:18
  started speaking all over and then COVID hit and then, you
• 1:07:21
  know, I'm like, now what do I do?
• 1:07:23
  And I'm praying and I'm watching all my videos of film and
• 1:07:25
  television and I felt the Lord was calling me to be ATV host.
• 1:07:29
  And I was like, you know, calling friends up, you know,
• 1:07:32
  some well known theologians and they're like, where are you
• 1:07:35
  going to host a show like Catholic TV host?
• 1:07:37
  Like it's not, you know, like there's not a big market for
• 1:07:40
  that. I said, I don't know.
• 1:07:41
  Well, on my grandmother, you know, who I was so close with
• 1:07:43
  and she passed away during COVID.
• 1:07:46
  But I know she's one of my greatest intercessors in Saints
• 1:07:49
  in heaven. On her birthday, just after she
• 1:07:52
  passed, my phone rang on the day that I had put together ATV
• 1:07:56
  hosting resume and never sent it to anybody.
• 1:07:58
  And my phone rang and Shalom World said, we're praying about
• 1:08:01
  who should be the host of our TV show for faith-based film and
• 1:08:05
  television. Are you interested?
• 1:08:09
  And I was like, oh, my goodness, like this was already on my
• 1:08:11
  heart. I put together a resume like,
• 1:08:13
  and I didn't even have to send it to them because this was
• 1:08:15
  divine. And so that's the difference is
• 1:08:17
  I just, I know this, it could sound crazy and I just don't
• 1:08:20
  care what anybody thinks when you are in the will of God and
• 1:08:25
  you were praying and literally I would pray all day and just like
• 1:08:28
  that was my office. And I'm like, God, you're my
• 1:08:30
  boss. I surrendered my life to him and
• 1:08:33
  I would walk out of adoration, you know, and there would be an
• 1:08:36
  e-mail or a phone call or something.
• 1:08:37
  It was divine. I think that when we're doing
• 1:08:40
  God's will, he opens the doors and needs to be open.
• 1:08:42
  And by the way, he shuts and closes and let him nail shut the
• 1:08:47
  ones that are not from him, you know, and then I started praying
• 1:08:50
  that prayer everyday, like Lord open the doors that need to be
• 1:08:53
  open and close the doors that need to be closed.
• 1:08:55
  And it's a bold prayer. But when we're walking with God,
• 1:08:58
  like he only wants the best and it's not about us.
• 1:09:01
  It's it's yes, we'll find our fulfillment in helping other
• 1:09:05
  people, but it's always going to be about the masses and
• 1:09:08
  community and leading people to him.
• 1:09:10
  And like when I, you know, die, I want to leave a legacy of love
• 1:09:14
  like my grandmother did. I, you know, she these little
• 1:09:17
  acts of love, the bowls of pasta that she made me and she and her
• 1:09:20
  dishes are like flowers on the bottom.
• 1:09:22
  And she would say eat. So you see the flowers.
• 1:09:24
  Well, I still have two of those bowls, Lila.
• 1:09:26
  And, you know, sometimes I'll just eat off of those bowls just
• 1:09:29
  just to know she's with me, to feel that memory like the love
• 1:09:33
  lives on the bowl of pasta lives on the plate might look empty,
• 1:09:37
  but it's full because it's full in my heart.
• 1:09:40
  And that's really the message for all of us is that we're
• 1:09:43
  called to love. And that is what will radiate
• 1:09:46
  through all of eternity. And I think, you know, just be
• 1:09:48
  more compassionate and merciful. And I know some people listening
• 1:09:51
  may not understand the depths of my story because there's certain
• 1:09:54
  pieces that I can't go into, you know, But God knows them, and
• 1:09:59
  God knows your heart. And God knows everyone who's
• 1:10:02
  listening to this and seeing this, their heart and what
• 1:10:05
  they're suffering and the full details of their whole life and
• 1:10:08
  their purpose and what's holding them back.
• 1:10:10
  And I think there is also a battle when you know you, every
• 1:10:14
  single person has a call in their life.
• 1:10:16
  Every person and then there's always this battle to try to
• 1:10:20
  keep us in a fear or held back or depressed or hopeless or, you
• 1:10:24
  know, and just pushing past that to continue to get up every day,
• 1:10:29
  you know, to for me, it's finding that fire within and
• 1:10:33
  knowing that God is with us. And I think 2:00 there's two
• 1:10:36
  huge principles or lessons that stand out to me as you share
• 1:10:40
  that so beautifully. And one of them, just based on
• 1:10:43
  what you're just saying, is that when we submit our lives to the
• 1:10:46
  authority of God and his church, it brings so much freedom and
• 1:10:52
  healing and freedom from shame, forgiveness of sins, obviously
• 1:10:56
  through Jesus Christ, passion, death and resurrection.
• 1:10:59
  But we have this freedom and we don't have to figure it out
• 1:11:04
  constantly strategically, like, OK, is this the right thing to
• 1:11:07
  do? That the right thing to do?
• 1:11:08
  Because we know these are the moral laws, follow the moral
• 1:11:11
  laws and everything is love and discerning the love through
• 1:11:14
  prayers and just taking the next right step.
• 1:11:16
  And so, you know, there is no shame.
• 1:11:18
  I think that is the thing that, you know, again, you know, just
• 1:11:22
  a put a bow, bow on the story. And I so appreciate you being
• 1:11:25
  willing to share about it because it's so sensitive.
• 1:11:26
  But like with the the Acts and the annulment and everything
• 1:11:29
  else, like this is God's church and this, this wasn't a marriage
• 1:11:32
  and, and God gave you this understanding and ultimately
• 1:11:36
  freedom. So he can give you the vocation
• 1:11:40
  he's calling you to. And your ex, quite frankly, it's
• 1:11:42
  for his good too, for your children's good.
• 1:11:45
  So no shame and only freedom and beauty in that.
• 1:11:48
  And if we can see that and trust in that, in God, God has
• 1:11:53
  everything in store. And then the other piece that I
• 1:11:55
  think is so beautiful about your story, is this really
• 1:11:57
  receptivity to what God is doing in the moment?
• 1:12:00
  Like you said, you got the call from the priest when you're
• 1:12:02
  praying. I, I applied to be this, you
• 1:12:04
  know, youth bastard because I feel, you know, youth minister,
• 1:12:07
  I felt called to that. And you're, you know, leaving
• 1:12:09
  behind business and modeling and all this, you know, glamorous
• 1:12:12
  stuff and the phone rings. But you're not in that position
• 1:12:15
  now, You know, now you're doing books and movies and all these
• 1:12:19
  other amazing things. I think business, more
• 1:12:21
  businesses are in your future too.
• 1:12:23
  That's my little guess, but. But maybe with you, Lila, let's.
• 1:12:26
  Do it. I mean seriously, I was like,
• 1:12:28
  let's do that. I don't know.
• 1:12:30
  I don't know if I would do the rhinestone encrusted for the the
• 1:12:34
  purchase that I would make, but we'll have that line too.
• 1:12:37
  But I do. Have another right now that
• 1:12:38
  you're saying that I have something I think you're going
• 1:12:40
  to want to do OK, well, I'm. Excited to talk to you about it,
• 1:12:43
  but I just love this about taking that next right step.
• 1:12:45
  Yeah. And where you were a week ago
• 1:12:48
  will look different than where you are in another week.
• 1:12:50
  That is the venture of the lives of the Saints in the making.
• 1:12:53
  And how exciting. How exciting.
• 1:12:56
  It is, it is exciting and, and the other thing I, I part of why
• 1:12:59
  I wrote become the fire is it's discerning God's will, but it's
• 1:13:02
  also learning how to hear God speak to you because some people
• 1:13:05
  could hear this and be like what, like, how did she know
• 1:13:07
  what to do? Like I pray and I don't hear
• 1:13:08
  God. And so I, I certainly through
• 1:13:12
  the movements of the mind and heart, the Saint Ignatius talks
• 1:13:14
  about you could start to find his will and hear him speak in
• 1:13:17
  those ways. But you know, we, if we start to
• 1:13:20
  look for him everywhere, you know, I, part of my, I think
• 1:13:23
  secret to success is I'm just desperate for God and I'm, I'm
• 1:13:27
  drawn to him and, and I know he's drawn to, to me and to you
• 1:13:30
  and to all of us. And he's just waiting for
• 1:13:32
  someone to like, want to be with him and hang out with him.
• 1:13:34
  I go to adoration a lot, you know, and I'm just constantly
• 1:13:37
  desperate, like asking him questions.
• 1:13:40
  Lord, what do you think about this?
• 1:13:41
  What should I do here? You know, what is your plan?
• 1:13:43
  Like just constantly checking in and then you start to see him in
• 1:13:47
  different ways. It could be like the gospel or
• 1:13:50
  one of the readings at church lined up with a question or
• 1:13:52
  what's going on in your life. It could be you turn on a song
• 1:13:56
  on the radio and it's just it just touches you and you start
• 1:13:59
  weeping. You know, it could be that
• 1:14:01
  you're spending so much time in silence that in that still, you
• 1:14:04
  know, silent place in your heart.
• 1:14:06
  There's like a thought in your heart where you know it's not
• 1:14:08
  yours because it answers a question on a deeper level.
• 1:14:11
  And you could have never thought of that yourself.
• 1:14:14
  But I think we have a shattered it and I did have, I have myself
• 1:14:16
  a shattered image of God, not realizing he's a good father.
• 1:14:21
  But he is. And he's not the kind of God
• 1:14:24
  that's like, I don't want you to ever hear from me.
• 1:14:26
  You do as I say. And you know, it's it's no, he
• 1:14:29
  wants this relationship. He's like, I love you.
• 1:14:31
  I have not just plans, I have good plans for you, plans for
• 1:14:34
  your future, plans for your welfare.
• 1:14:36
  You know, he talks about like calling on his name.
• 1:14:39
  He makes a way where there's no way.
• 1:14:40
  Like by the way, he wants you to be happy.
• 1:14:42
  He wants you to succeed, you know, he wants people to be who
• 1:14:47
  they're supposed to be, to glorify him, you know, and to
• 1:14:50
  bring that light into the world. So I think that if if we think
• 1:14:54
  God's not speaking to us, maybe we'll look for different ways
• 1:14:58
  and he'll speak to everybody in a unique way.
• 1:15:00
  But he 100% wants you to hear him.
• 1:15:03
  He loves you. He's not done with you.
• 1:15:05
  He's so merciful. No matter what we've been
• 1:15:08
  through, we're given a new chance.
• 1:15:11
  Beautiful. And that open of the opening of
• 1:15:13
  the heart, like you had at your lowest point before that moment
• 1:15:17
  of the conscience, your conscience being illuminated,
• 1:15:19
  that grace you received that was very tough in that moment, but
• 1:15:23
  was painful, excruciating, but it opened the door for so much
• 1:15:27
  conversion and and metanoia, true changing of your heart and
• 1:15:30
  your mind. And but it but but you opened
• 1:15:34
  your heart. And I think that that is such a
• 1:15:37
  honestly, when I'm in any kind of dumps myself or I'm like
• 1:15:40
  feeling overwhelmed or I feel like feel far, far from God, or
• 1:15:44
  I feel like I'm am I on the right track or something tough
• 1:15:46
  happens or scary or whatever. It's like Jesus, Jesus,
• 1:15:50
  everything is yours. Like I surrender everything just
• 1:15:53
  open move, whatever you want, God.
• 1:15:55
  Or I literally imagine whatever physical thing is concerning me,
• 1:15:59
  or I place my children, my marriage, whatever in front of
• 1:16:02
  Jesus, just like here, it's completely yours, whatever you
• 1:16:05
  want to do. And there's always so much
• 1:16:08
  tremendous relief that comes with that, even if in the moment
• 1:16:11
  it's still difficult, because he just wants your heart.
• 1:16:14
  He just wants your surrender. Yeah I do the surrender novena
• 1:16:19
  perpetually. So after 9 days I just repeat it
• 1:16:21
  over. I love that I do a 365 days a
• 1:16:25
  year and you know, I think there's sometimes you'll hear a
• 1:16:28
  conversion story and I, I heard one on the radio like last week
• 1:16:31
  and the guy's like, oh, ten years ago I got on my knees and
• 1:16:35
  I prayed out to God and like he healed me and that's it.
• 1:16:38
  I've been good ever since. And I'm just think I'm listening
• 1:16:41
  to that and I'm like, wow, like that's not my story, you know?
• 1:16:45
  Yeah, I've had all these great things happen, but there's still
• 1:16:48
  fires, there's still trials. They're still suffering.
• 1:16:51
  You know, I think the difference is it's, it's knowing to
• 1:16:54
  surrender them and keeping our eyes on the Lord so that we
• 1:16:56
  don't get burned by the the flames.
• 1:16:58
  But my story, I'm still on my knees.
• 1:17:00
  This is not like, oh, I went on my knees 12 years ago or 13
• 1:17:04
  years ago and everything's fine. I never had to do it again.
• 1:17:07
  I'm on my knees maybe every day, hopefully ever, hopefully every
• 1:17:11
  day, hopefully many times a day, hopefully when nobody's looking
• 1:17:15
  because that's what God wants. So you know, in the privacy of
• 1:17:19
  our our little war rooms or our prayer places, the hidden place
• 1:17:23
  in our heart could be in the middle of a meeting that we just
• 1:17:26
  stay connected to him that he hears us, he sees us, he loves
• 1:17:29
  us, He knows us. That's I did want my one of my
• 1:17:32
  films that I did a few years back and was fully known and it
• 1:17:37
  was about identity in Christ. He fully knows each and every
• 1:17:41
  one of us. You know, we're knit together in
• 1:17:43
  the womb and that God, he literally like has a plan for
• 1:17:48
  each and every one of us. He's we're not on earth for him
• 1:17:51
  to forget us or for us to be forgotten about.
• 1:17:53
  We're here to have a relationship with Him and then
• 1:17:56
  have a relationship with each other through His love.
• 1:17:59
  So beautiful. With you, you know could guess
• 1:18:03
  that what a moment of conscience illumination would look like for
• 1:18:08
  you right now. Oh my goodness, I don't.
• 1:18:12
  That's a scary question because I.
• 1:18:15
  Feel like I didn't go to confession.
• 1:18:16
  It's been a week since confession.
• 1:18:17
  I try to go, I try to go every week because it's beautiful.
• 1:18:21
  I even like V Nielsen's like I don't want to ever have my soul
• 1:18:27
  look like what it did. And I think what what I noticed
• 1:18:30
  at the the illumination was one sin turned into another sin.
• 1:18:34
  Like it was a snowball effect that blinded me to the fact that
• 1:18:37
  I didn't think I was in sin. So I never want to do that
• 1:18:41
  again. So I don't go like, like
• 1:18:43
  scrupulously, but more just like a conversation.
• 1:18:46
  I think of the priests, you know, conversation with Jesus
• 1:18:49
  and just an act of humility. And also I feel that it brings
• 1:18:52
  to light the more we confess what our struggles are.
• 1:18:56
  And those are usually connected to wounds.
• 1:18:58
  And by the way, those wounds are usually connected to a trauma or
• 1:19:00
  a past event and and a lot of times childhood.
• 1:19:03
  So, you know, I think to know yourself is was it Saint
• 1:19:07
  Augustine, I think said the very perfection of man is to know his
• 1:19:09
  imperfections. So I still have a ton of
• 1:19:12
  imperfections because there wouldn't be a battle in our mind
• 1:19:15
  if there weren't things to battle.
• 1:19:17
  But each and every one of us will struggle with different
• 1:19:19
  things. The difference is to put truth
• 1:19:23
  in those places. And so I have a workbook that
• 1:19:25
  goes with my first book, Master of the Pieces.
• 1:19:27
  Master of Pieces workbook where each broken piece, each chapters
• 1:19:31
  like betrayal, rejection, fear, broken dreams, each broken peace
• 1:19:35
  comes with identity. Lies like I'm not good enough.
• 1:19:38
  God doesn't love me. He'd never speak to me.
• 1:19:40
  He'd never. How could he forgive me?
• 1:19:42
  You know, all these lies and then all the pinpointed
• 1:19:45
  scriptures that go against the lies and that tell the truth.
• 1:19:48
  So I still have to tell myself the truth.
• 1:19:50
  But if I were to see my soul today, I'd be lying to you if I
• 1:19:54
  knew what that looked like. Because I don't want to think
• 1:19:56
  I'm further ahead or further behind.
• 1:19:57
  I don't want to condemn myself. In the in the column of love,
• 1:20:01
  you've accepted the love. Of Jesus.
• 1:20:03
  I have time. Have to hope and pray that it
• 1:20:07
  looks better than I would think it would.
• 1:20:09
  I just, and I do. I mean I am very bold with my
• 1:20:12
  prayer, Lila. Like I ask God for a plenary
• 1:20:15
  indulgence every day without even doing anything to deserve
• 1:20:18
  it because I'm just. Laying all the grace.
• 1:20:19
  And I and I, you know, of course I'll try to go through a holy
• 1:20:22
  door. I'll try to, you know, pray at
• 1:20:24
  the basilica and just beg. I just beg God for grace is
• 1:20:27
  because he's so merciful. And this morning I was reading
• 1:20:30
  something from Saint Faustina and I get like a daily
• 1:20:33
  meditation from her book, her diary.
• 1:20:36
  And ironically, today, the date that was on it was December
• 1:20:40
  18th, which is the date my sister died, you know, and
• 1:20:43
  again, I see God in this little detail and I, I think of that.
• 1:20:46
  Well, this is a sacred moment. And the, the excerpt was about
• 1:20:49
  like Jesus saying, ask me for more graces, like I will shower
• 1:20:53
  you like don't. So we need to just, I'm just
• 1:20:55
  bold. I'm like, Lord, I need all the
• 1:20:57
  graces. Like, you know as much as you'll
• 1:20:59
  give me if you'll give me a plenary indulgence today, not
• 1:21:02
  because I deserve it, but just because you're that merciful.
• 1:21:04
  And I just don't even want a stain on my soul.
• 1:21:07
  Like I want to be so close to you.
• 1:21:09
  I'm not saying that I don't have stains on my soul.
• 1:21:11
  I'm not saying I'm perfect. I'm saying we have a God that
• 1:21:13
  I'm going to ask him, and then it's up to him whether or not he
• 1:21:16
  gives me that. And so I don't know what my soul
• 1:21:19
  looks like, but I know I have a God that loves me.
• 1:21:22
  I know that I'm trying every day to love.
• 1:21:24
  I know I love him. I know I love you.
• 1:21:25
  I know I love everyone listening to this whether they love me or
• 1:21:28
  not. And that's what true love is.
• 1:21:30
  True love is loving without expecting anything in return and
• 1:21:33
  willing the good of another and speaking truth even if it hurts.
• 1:21:37
  So beautiful. Well, thank you.
• 1:21:38
  I know it's a funny question to be like what is the state of
• 1:21:40
  your soul look like? But I'm curious what you would
• 1:21:42
  say about the state of hope. It's better.
• 1:21:44
  I hope it's. I hope it's shining.
• 1:21:46
  I hope it's bright. Jesus's love, Yes, Amen.
• 1:21:50
  Joel, what a beautiful testimony you have.
• 1:21:52
  Thank you for your willingness to share it and write it so
• 1:21:54
  beautifully. How can people find your books
• 1:21:57
  and find you and follow your work, all the exciting things
• 1:21:59
  that God is doing for your ministry?
• 1:22:01
  Thank you. Yeah.
• 1:22:02
  So the books Master of the Pieces, Master of the Pieces
• 1:22:05
  Workbook and Become the Fire are all on Amazon.com, so easy to
• 1:22:09
  find there. You can put the title or my
• 1:22:10
  name, Joel Marin, and then my website isjoellemarin.com.
• 1:22:15
  Just very easy and yeah, just have a lot of great things
• 1:22:18
  coming up. So I can't wait to see you as a
• 1:22:20
  Blessed Mother, and I'm so excited for all that God's doing
• 1:22:23
  in your life and for what He has in store for you for your
• 1:22:26
  vocation too. Yeah, thank you.
• 1:22:28
  Me too. Yeah, Maybe I'll be back on
• 1:22:29
  here. Yes.
• 1:22:30
  I love that. Tell the love story.
• 1:22:32
  We love those here. Yeah.
• 1:22:33
  Thank you, Joelle. Yes, thank you.
• 1:22:34
  God bless you, love. You also thanks so much for
• 1:22:37
  listening to this episode of The Lila Rose Show with Joelle
• 1:22:40
  Marin. I hope it was inspiring to you.
• 1:22:42
  All of us have the opportunity to change our lives every day if
• 1:22:45
  we're willing to go all in for our faith and go all in for God.
• 1:22:49
  Make sure you're subscribed if you're not already subscribed
• 1:22:51
  and be sure to share this episode with a friend or
• 1:22:54
  somebody that you love. A huge thank you to our partner
• 1:22:57
  EWTN. The largest religious
• 1:22:59
  broadcaster in the entire world, EWTN is reaching millions of
• 1:23:02
  people every single day with the beautiful truth of the gospel.
• 1:23:05
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• 1:23:09
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