Latest / The Bigger Stage w/ Matt Stone / Rewriting Success: From Hollywood to CMO with Adrian Fulle
Transcript
- BBR Pod Pre-launch Convo - Adrian Fulle === Matt Stone: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Building Business Relationships Podcast. I'm Matt Stone. And before we officially launch, we are exploring what matters most when it comes to relationships in business and the business of relationships. These early episodes are about testing ideas, learning from guests, and hearing what you think belongs in the conversation. So listen in, share your thoughts. And help shape what this podcast becomes. And in order to do that, I'm so grateful to be joined today by Adrian Fulle, a storyteller and marketing leader whose career spans Hollywood and high growth companies alike. After early work in the entertainment industry with Variety Magazine and other major studios, Adrian shifted his focus to brand strategy and digital transformation. Today as chief marketing officer and former CEO at Good Salt Life, he helps purpose-driven brands grow through creativity, curiosity, and data-driven strategy. A graduate of Harvard and Stanford's [00:01:00] graduate School of Business emerging CCE CMO program. It's a bit of a mouthful. Adrian brings a rare blend of cinematic storytelling and business acumen to every conversation, so we have very high hopes for this one. Adrian, thank you for joining me. Adrian Fulle: Thank you, Matt. You forgot to say Maine West High School in Des Plaines, Illinois, which I'm sure everybody knows. You Matt Stone: Ah. Adrian Fulle: that to the bio Matt Stone: Maine West High School. Yes. The Ultimate Feeder School for, um, what was that again? Adrian Fulle: for, uh, yeah. This, uh, Matt Stone: yeah. Adrian Fulle: Yeah, Matt Stone: Ah, okay. Yeah, no, no offense to your high school. I, mine was South Salem High School in, in Oregon. And um, you know, other than winning some Grammys for high school music, uh, nothing there. Okay. Alright. Listen, Adrian, I am really, really grateful. You know why we're here. We're talking about business relationships. You've had a number of them over the years, right? Uh, and, and I love that you've been in different industries too. So I'm excited to get your stories and your perspective. But I wanna start off like I'm [00:02:00] starting off with all of these pre-launch conversations, hearing a story about somebody who made a really big impact on you. So can you think of a business relationship that was transformational or had a major impact on your career and or your life in general? Adrian Fulle: Yeah, actually it's really interesting. So as you mentioned, I've had a, had a change of careers halfway through my life and went from the entertainment industry into marketing into corporate America, so to speak, and I've had a lot of, um. Really influential mentors in entertainment and have had some as well, um, as a marketer in the marketing world. Um, but there was a guy who bridged the gap and that that's who I want to talk about today. His name is Steve Gatos. He was the former executive editor at Variety Magazine and, uh, I believe his last title when he left was EVP of Content or something like that. But the reason I bring up Steve is because Steve, first off, variety was the first real. Corporate America job that I had. [00:03:00] A lot of people around the country don't think of it as a corporation or a corporate bit job. They think of it as a magazine that does red carpet stuff and interviews with big celebrities and it's really cool. And it was, and there were a lot of creative people that worked there, but it was a business. And I remember going and pitching myself for the job. Um. The CMO at the time, uh, Deia Lawrence had reached out to me. We had known each other from the past. They were looking to start a content studio, but Adrian, I'm not gonna just give you the job. You gotta come in, there's gonna be other candidates. You gotta do the whole dog and pony show, which I did. And I'll never forget, I got hired. I went in and the first thing, and Steve was the guy I was reporting to, and the first thing Steve said to me was, well, I didn't wanna hire you. I was the no, the no vote in the room. I said, what, what do you mean? He goes, well, you're a writer and you're just gonna be writing all the time. You're not gonna actually focus on the work. I said, no, that's not the case. I'm gonna focus on the work. And so from there, that initial weird moment actually led to this amazing, well, quite honestly, great, uh, personal friendship and, uh, [00:04:00] mentorship. Steve is, he just, he knows how to do it, man. He knows how to be creative. And he also knows business. And he taught me, I, I always remember the three main things he taught me. He basically said, be on the side of revenue, that's number one. And I said, what do you mean sales? He goes, whatever it means. Just be on the side of revenue. I said, okay. And then he said, always ask questions. So we'd have these giant meetings of variety in this really cool like top deck room with like 40 people around this marble. You know, it was just like you'd see in the movies, you know. And nobody would raise their hand and ask a question of the, of, um, uh, the owners or, or whoever was speaking at the time, except for Steve, every single time his arm shot up. So I learned to do that. And then the last thing he said had nothing to do with variety, but it did, or at least I, think it did. Ultimately did. He said, one thing you always have to remember Adrian, is that writing is rewriting. And he was a [00:05:00] writer himself. And so I just took that as a writing note. Um, but it really has stuck with me out of all of the things he taught me. Essentially, I think what he was saying, Matt, and maybe you could dig into this a little bit too, there is no final draft. Do you know what I mean? Like Matt Stone: Yeah. Adrian Fulle: constantly reworking the story, the narrative, our own personal journey story and whatever it is. And um, and I think that really stuck with me. So Steve Gatos, variety Magazine was really the guy who, and then really helped me launch into the wacky world of marketing in corporate America. Matt Stone: You still in contact? Adrian Fulle: Yep. I called him today just to get his permission not to talk about him, my name, was like, I'd be honored. I said, okay, we're Matt Stone: Steve Gatos, this one's for you. All right, buddy. I, I'd like to meet him now. I love that. Adrian Fulle: Yeah. Matt Stone: Um, it, Adrian Fulle: He is met everybody Matt Stone: yeah. Adrian Fulle: so. Matt Stone: Yeah. How did you know [00:06:00] I was talking with somebody else, um, about their person, you know, the relationship, one of the relationship was coming for them and. We were talking about how there was this moment where the, the person felt really seen for who they are and what they bring, their gifts and even the, the, the talent that was good but could be developed even further. Do you remember that moment with Steve where you felt like, this guy really gets me? Adrian Fulle: That's a great question. There were two moments. I'll never forget the moment. Uh, so we, the way the, the office space and variety was set up at the time was I had a cubicle and I was with a bunch of other folks in cubicles and the content studio was new. I was the only hire at that time. And then they pulled in another guy, David Cohen, from a series called Artisans, which was really popular at the time. And, um, we just had cubicles and. So we worked in this like open floor plan, except for the executives. And Steve had his own office, but it was right across the, like, literally like 20 feet away. And I was a [00:07:00] little nervous to go in there, you know what I mean? Like, I wasn't just gonna knock on this guy's door. I, it would have to be a scheduled meeting or something like that. Right? Um, one day he sticks his head out of the office, which he never did. And he goes, Adrian, I got, I got a question. So I'm okay. So I go into his office sweating bullets, thinking this is where I'm gonna get fired, or some something's going wrong. Right? And he asked my opinion about budgeting for Video Con for a video production. And then it went to a second question that he asked my opinion about producing, you know, just around the general sense of producing video productions. And in that moment, I remember going, oh, he, he values my opinion. You know, and, and this is a guy who knows a lot. He's not a know-it-all. That's not what I'm saying. But he like, you know, need to ask me that kind of stuff. He could, he the answers and he could figure it out, but I think he was trying to show me that. He valued me in the role that I was hired for, and he valued my opinion. And I think that was, that really, that really stuck with [00:08:00] me. Uh, we ended up doing a number of, um, business trips together to different film festivals. We went down to Savannah, Georgia, which I had never been, uh, to scad the, the School of Design down there, which was fantastic. They were so cool to us. And the food, by the way, I would never survive in the South Matt because, uh, after about four days of eating that amazing fried chicken, I'd be. Matt Stone: Hang on, let me wide, we're gonna go wide lens on this shot. Okay. Go ahead. Adrian Fulle: Exactly. Matt Stone: Yeah. Adrian Fulle: yeah, I had the meat sweats like first night in, it was too much. Yeah. No, but I loved it down there and um, uh, and so that was like one of the first big trips where it was just Steve and I. And I was like, man, I'm with the top guy. Uh, it, it just, you know how, I don't know how to, I can't articulate it, but it's just like, wow, I'm with the top guy and he's treating me as an equal and I'm actually going and doing meetings without him in some cases the [00:09:00] guy. And so it was just, um, I don't know. It was a quick lesson in, in feeling really confident about yourself and then from there forward I was like, okay. I got his trust, now I can go do my thing. And we, and we blew it up if, I mean, it was fantastic. We did it. We, you know, in three years we went from zero to like $8 million a year in revenue, which I know doesn't sound like a lot, but when you think about, that's close to one fifth of all of variety revenue at the time. I mean, you know, with two guys and Steve for the longest period. And then we ended up bringing in two other hires. But yeah, it was, uh, I'm starting to get a little teary eye because those were some fun days. Matt Stone: Those are some good days. Wow. So revenue, ask good questions, and writing is always rewriting. Adrian Fulle: That's Matt Stone: I wrote those down because those are, those are so good. And actually I have a friend who's just a prolific writer. He runs a writing company, helps people think deeply and write clearly. That's literally the name of his. I'll probably [00:10:00] have him on at some point. Adrian Fulle: Yeah. Matt Stone: And I was talking with him the other day at World Trade Center and uh, you know, you're sitting up on the 60 whatever floor, looking out on the city, you know what I'm saying? The observation area and, and they have a cafe up there and it's such a great place to think. Because you're just literally looking out over everything and, and we're talking about like the role of writing in making content that matters in this digital age that. You can have, and I use chat. We all use chatt, PT or whatever, you know, for lots of different things. But actually the imp import of writing is, is only growing because to write, to be unique, to, to have real creative ideas, to get your ideas really out there is gonna require that you, that you write. And it's a never ending exercise. I mean, which is maybe not as satisfying for people to realize. It's never gonna be perfect. Adrian Fulle: Yeah. Matt Stone: But, but the writing itself, um, is how you develop your ideas. It's, it's, it's how you, how you get it out there. So, Adrian Fulle: [00:11:00] my biggest problem in entertainment. I started out as a screenwriter Matt Stone: hmm. Adrian Fulle: I did okay. I, I mean, I sold some scripts and I got mostly, interestingly, I was mostly hired to rewrite scripts as a script doctor. Uh, primarily the dialogue, and that was because I learned one little trick in improv comedy when I was at Second City right out of college. And that was, well, there's a couple little tricks, but you know, essentially have your characters not ask any questions. They just make statements and they never say no, they always yes and everything. Um, and so you take that and there's some other things, but you take these two little key things and try to write dialogue that way. And you always get great dialogue. Uh, you don't even have to really be a great writer to get great dialogue using these little tricks. Um, also dialogue is, is musical. It's a rhythm. Um, so it's particularly obvious in comedy and especially sitcoms, you know, that's ba ba you know, it's like there's a rhythm and that song gets boring after a [00:12:00] while and you wanna switch to a drama. But, but you see what I'm saying? Like, if you can hear the, the music of the, of the dialogue, you can write great dialogue and, um. And that was something for me, that I kept in writing when I went into marketing and writing brand stories, writing copy for ads. But the one thing I do, the one thing I do find is I'll go back and look at old campaigns that we've done and, oh, that should have had a, an exclamation point at the end, not a period, you know what I mean? Like, I just, I still continue to rewrite the stuff that doesn't matter anymore. It just stuck within me, man, you know, Matt Stone: Yeah. Adrian Fulle: it. Matt Stone: Yeah, and that's a good thing that, you know, you, you want to improve it. That's the kind, kind of the point. Um, but, uh, listen, we're making this super short and I do want to get, you out on time as well, but I, I want to extract a little more juice from that giant brain of yours. So, Adrian Fulle: Great. Matt Stone: I just have like two more questions for today. Okay. [00:13:00] The first one is, what's the conversation that we're not having publicly, that we should be about relationships and business ? Adrian Fulle: Yeah, that's a great thing. it, and I think that conversation is not happening at the office or the virtual office. I think that conversation is that coworker who's sitting next to you physically, or you know, you see them on the screen, uh, for example, has a mug that promotes, uh, one political party over another and you don't agree with that, or an ideology that is different than yours. We're not having that civil conversation anymore. They're not coming to our family barbecue like they used to. They're not getting invited to our events and vice versa. We're all just angry at each other. And in business in particular, I think what happened is everyone froze up. just don't wanna address these topics, and I'm not suggesting we should on the show, but I, I am suggesting that we should be talking about how can we, having differences [00:14:00] of opinion on certain things outside of the business, get along and still do great business together. And then more importantly, when we're working together, how can that business contribute to the civility and to the advancement of our society, regardless of left, right center ideology, any of those things. That's what I think. Matt Stone: Mm. Couldn't say it better myself, although I've tried. Adrian Fulle: Well, I'll rewrite it for you and then Matt Stone: Thank you. Adrian Fulle: Yeah. Matt Stone: It'll never be done. Um, so Adrian Fulle: No, not ideology. Matt Stone: yeah, no, that's the wrong word. Adrian Fulle: Yeah. Matt Stone: I, no, I mean, I really think business, especially small and medium sized businesses, um, play a critical role in the relational architecture of the country. The threads that tie us together, because it's one of the few remaining places that we can congregate and where we have to congregate with people with whom we don't agree on other things, [00:15:00] but we work together. We see the humanity where, you know, Adrian Fulle: Yeah, I'm Matt Stone: and, uh, Adrian Fulle: ' cause that's 90% of all business in America is Matt Stone: yeah. Adrian Fulle: and small businesses being mom and pop. Five employees, maybe less, you know. I think it's even more important for them 'cause they're usually local to communities. You know what I mean? Like it's, it's a network of individual. There's just a network of Americans, man and human Matt Stone: Yeah, Adrian Fulle: and we all don't agree on everything, but we can agree that we're all in this great country together and we should be doing the best we can to make it even greater, you know, Matt Stone: Yeah, that's right. I here, here. Adrian Fulle: but Matt Stone: Not again, but greater. Yeah . Always moving forward. Always moving forward. Adrian Fulle: Yeah. Matt Stone: Last question. The podcast launches, as you know, in 2026, we're, we're already putting content out. We're getting excitement. We're looking for sponsors, we're building the team. We're doing all kinds of good stuff. What excites you most about the launch of the Building Business Relationships podcast? Adrian Fulle: So I [00:16:00] am, uh, seven years ago sitting in a New York apartment with Vincent Pastore, who played, Big Pussy on the, on the Sopranos, interviewing Vincent for a variety thing we were doing a branded content project and it hit me like a ton of bricks. This is what I love. I love, like my purpose in life is to be able to sit with a person and have a conversation. Now, how do I make that a career? I don't know. I didn't really pursue that as a career, but what I love and what I'm most excited about with the BBR pod is having those real conversations with other business folks, other business leaders about all of these things that we're talking about. I'm just really looking forward to those real conversations. Matt Stone: As am I. Thank you for taking a few minutes today. Adrian Fulle: Yeah, Matt Stone: Great stories. You should be a storyteller. I bet there's a graduate program for that. Adrian Fulle: I'm sure there [00:17:00] is. Matt Stone: Alright, thank you for listening to the Building Business Relationships Podcast. This pre-launch phase is all about discovery. So if something sparked your interest, I'd love to hear from you, share your thoughts, ideas, or guest suggestions, and help us shape the conversations to come. And of course, subscribe. So you'll be the very first to know when we officially launch. But before then, there's plenty of content. So stick around. Thanks again for listening or watching. We'll see you again next time.