Latest / The Steve Harvey Morning Show / Bishop TD Jakes Full Interview
Transcript
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- 1:21Speaker 1: heart or text I Heeart to five hundred, five hundred
- 1:24Speaker 1: my first guest. He is a New York Times number
- 1:27Speaker 1: one New York Times bestselling author of more than forty books,
- 1:31Speaker 1: and founder and senior pastor of the Potter's House, located
- 1:35Speaker 1: in Dallas, Texas. His television ministry program, The Potter's Touch.
- 1:39Speaker 1: It's watched by three point three million viewers every week.
- 1:43Speaker 1: He has produced Grammy Award winning music, as well as
- 1:45Speaker 1: hit films from such movies as Heaven Is for Real,
- 1:49Speaker 1: Miracles from Heaven, and Jump in the Room. Please Welcome
- 1:53Speaker 1: to Money Making Conversation. Bishop T. D. Jake's Hello, Thank
- 1:57Speaker 1: you for having me. Bishop. Did I lay out that
- 2:00Speaker 1: let you out that I wondered, it was that really me?
- 2:05Speaker 1: Your story is I've been fortunate and blessed I met
- 2:09Speaker 1: you over the years in my working relationship with Steve Harvey.
- 2:12Speaker 1: You've never disappointed and you you've laid a path of
- 2:16Speaker 1: opportunity for individuals like me just say I can do this.
- 2:20Speaker 1: And when I look at the book that we're going
- 2:22Speaker 1: to talk about, Soul Build your Vision from the ground up,
- 2:25Speaker 1: it is truly a person's blueprint for success as an
- 2:29Speaker 1: individual and especially an entrepreneurship. Why did you decided to
- 2:33Speaker 1: do it this time, sir? You know it was It
- 2:35Speaker 1: was really a lot of pout in prayer and effort
- 2:38Speaker 1: went into it because my liability is my own career.
- 2:42Speaker 1: And people see you as a clergyman. They have difficulties
- 2:45Speaker 1: seeing you as anything else. And yet the elephant in
- 2:48Speaker 1: the middle of the room is I've done over five
- 2:51Speaker 1: hundred million dollars worth of films gross at the box office,
- 2:54Speaker 1: continue to be in that arena, and now during television
- 2:58Speaker 1: with Lifetime, done a lot of projects and outside things
- 3:01Speaker 1: beyond the pale of clergy And when I look around
- 3:05Speaker 1: in our communities, it's not just preaching that we need.
- 3:08Speaker 1: We need information about business about entrepreneurship, recreating our lives.
- 3:13Speaker 1: People who were a second chance citizens, ex offenders, how
- 3:17Speaker 1: do they get back up on their feet again? Mothers
- 3:19Speaker 1: who have empty nests, People trying to subsidenze their income,
- 3:23Speaker 1: looking for a job when you may have to create
- 3:26Speaker 1: the job that you need. And I wanted to tell
- 3:28Speaker 1: a conversation with my generation about it. It's important. And
- 3:32Speaker 1: before we get into the book, it's two sections I
- 3:35Speaker 1: want to talk about. It's the front of the book,
- 3:37Speaker 1: in the back of the book, and in front of
- 3:39Speaker 1: the book you talk about the Texas Offenders re Entry Initiative,
- 3:43Speaker 1: which I knew nothing about. Let me give up my
- 3:45Speaker 1: listener to the background. Launching two thousand five, the t
- 3:48Speaker 1: o r I program has served over ten thousands formally
- 3:52Speaker 1: and cost the radio adults across the state of Texas
- 3:55Speaker 1: in healthcare, employment, housing, spirituality, education and but ten thousand,
- 4:02Speaker 1: Bishop TDJS, isn't that The number is actually up to
- 4:04Speaker 1: seventeen thousand now that have gone through our program. We
- 4:08Speaker 1: meet them once they get out of prison. We put
- 4:11Speaker 1: them into a year or two two year training program
- 4:13Speaker 1: that helps some of them to get g e D.
- 4:16Speaker 1: S of them have gotten jobs as a result of
- 4:19Speaker 1: being there. We direct them into housing, We work on
- 4:22Speaker 1: their family skills, We do anger management classes. We do
- 4:26Speaker 1: very practical dress how to dress for an interview, UH,
- 4:30Speaker 1: that sort of thing, and we continue to enhance it.
- 4:33Speaker 1: I meet the CEOs and corporate leaders about giving a
- 4:36Speaker 1: certain amount of job a lotments the second chance citizens,
- 4:40Speaker 1: and uh, we have had accommodations from the Obama administration.
- 4:44Speaker 1: We got down through the years, We've been appreciated by
- 4:47Speaker 1: the criminal justice system, and we're getting ready to have
- 4:50Speaker 1: a graduation insistently for a whole new match of students
- 4:53Speaker 1: who are coming through the program. So it's alive and
- 4:56Speaker 1: well if you ever need me to speak to them,
- 4:58Speaker 1: you know, I'm about motivation, about uplift. You know my life.
- 5:01Speaker 1: I've come from the inner city, fifth world. I've been fortunate.
- 5:04Speaker 1: My degree is in mathematics and corporate trained and IBM,
- 5:07Speaker 1: and I just know that sometimes you need to hear
- 5:09Speaker 1: a person just came from a community that wasn't supposed
- 5:12Speaker 1: to be the blessed community, stepped out there was was
- 5:16Speaker 1: was pushed in the right direction. You know what I'm saying.
- 5:18Speaker 1: We all are pushed, but sometimes we don't we ignore
- 5:21Speaker 1: that push or that motivation and the right people motivated me.
- 5:25Speaker 1: And when I was at the front of the book,
- 5:26Speaker 1: I wanted to bring that out because if it's important
- 5:29Speaker 1: to be in the book on one thing, I would say,
- 5:31Speaker 1: I bought the book on Kendle. I bought your books there.
- 5:34Speaker 1: They could at least go online and update ten thousand
- 5:37Speaker 1: and seventeen thousand. Okay, it's digital. They didn't go in
- 5:41Speaker 1: there and change that ten thousand and seventeen thousand. Okay.
- 5:44Speaker 1: You know. The number is so staggering. And people who
- 5:46Speaker 1: have been following me for years, some of them knowing,
- 5:49Speaker 1: some of them do. If you follow me on social media,
- 5:51Speaker 1: you get to see the graduation and the clips of
- 5:53Speaker 1: the graduation, or if you remember my church, you know it.
- 5:56Speaker 1: But if you just watch my television, so you would
- 5:58Speaker 1: never know that we're doing anything like that. I know.
- 6:02Speaker 1: And there's another segment before we get in the book
- 6:04Speaker 1: I want to talk about is the back of the book. Okay,
- 6:07Speaker 1: because it's an appendix section called where you it's called
- 6:11Speaker 1: definition of terms section where you really break down and
- 6:14Speaker 1: explain to people what a sole proprietorship is, corporation is
- 6:18Speaker 1: cash flow, balance sheet, and these are statements that scare
- 6:21Speaker 1: people because they don't know where to go. They don't
- 6:24Speaker 1: know where to turn. So and then you have another
- 6:27Speaker 1: section called other resource section where you explain to people
- 6:30Speaker 1: what a small business administration is and what website to
- 6:34Speaker 1: go to, you know, all these A score website to
- 6:38Speaker 1: go to, Black Enterprise, Entrepreneurship, Entrepreneur magazine, all these things.
- 6:44Speaker 1: Why was it important? Because I read a lot of books.
- 6:46Speaker 1: I've been motivated a lot over years, and I've been
- 6:48Speaker 1: fortunately they've done talk shows like you have, so I've
- 6:51Speaker 1: gotten a lot of books come my way over the
- 6:53Speaker 1: last ten years of my life. I've never seen this
- 6:56Speaker 1: in a book. Why did you decide to do to
- 7:00Speaker 1: a puff piece of fluff books? You know, you can
- 7:03Speaker 1: make it and name it and claim it and go
- 7:05Speaker 1: after your dreams and all that kind of stuff. Because
- 7:08Speaker 1: at the end of you know, motivation without information least
- 7:14Speaker 1: to frustration. So I did not want to further motivate
- 7:18Speaker 1: people without providing the kind of information that would call
- 7:21Speaker 1: him to end up with frustration. Uh. Every And you
- 7:25Speaker 1: know that's well, if you've done entertainment business like you have,
- 7:28Speaker 1: every genre of business has its own lingo and language.
- 7:33Speaker 1: You can't function in that genre if you don't learn
- 7:36Speaker 1: the language you you you wouldn't go to Spain to
- 7:39Speaker 1: live and not learn Spanish. You wouldn't go to Paris
- 7:42Speaker 1: and not learn French. And if you're going to go
- 7:44Speaker 1: into business, you have to learn the language. And I've
- 7:46Speaker 1: tried to make it simple enough. It's not like a
- 7:50Speaker 1: whole foreign language, but there are some terms so that
- 7:53Speaker 1: when you're in a meeting, you have some sense of
- 7:55Speaker 1: what they're talking about and you're not intimidated. So many
- 7:58Speaker 1: people are going in the business because they have a talent.
- 8:00Speaker 1: They have the talent, but they don't have the terms.
- 8:03Speaker 1: And the terms helps you to be able to escalate
- 8:06Speaker 1: the talent because then you can craft the business model
- 8:10Speaker 1: to protect you because business is a jungle and you
- 8:14Speaker 1: can get diviured out there if you don't know how
- 8:16Speaker 1: to protect yourself and you. And that's why I was
- 8:19Speaker 1: telling everybody right now. The show Money Making Conversation is
- 8:22Speaker 1: designed for entrepreneurship. Free information that I provide to my
- 8:26Speaker 1: listeners and viewers. If you on my Facebook page, this
- 8:29Speaker 1: is the first book I've ever encountered that is a book.
- 8:32Speaker 1: You go to the shelves, you walk away, and you
- 8:35Speaker 1: can build your career, build your life not only through
- 8:38Speaker 1: your faith, but all through two principles. Throughout this book,
- 8:42Speaker 1: it's about sorry. And the analogy is taken from the
- 8:45Speaker 1: fact that as a kid, which I was related to.
- 8:48Speaker 1: I related to the fact that my dad, my dignity
- 8:51Speaker 1: Land trip was to go to the airport and watch
- 8:53Speaker 1: your planes take off. Well you, when I read that,
- 8:55Speaker 1: I said, this is my book. It was chief entertainment
- 9:01Speaker 1: back then, we go to the airport Weston Place to
- 9:04Speaker 1: take off. My kids would think we were crazy if
- 9:06Speaker 1: I took them to the airport to Watson Players take off,
- 9:09Speaker 1: But it was the only kind of entertainment my parents
- 9:11Speaker 1: could afford. Uh. It led to be becoming fascinated with
- 9:15Speaker 1: the Right Brothers. The Right Brothers become the metaphor for
- 9:18Speaker 1: the book because they built their airplane in the bicycle
- 9:22Speaker 1: shop and and it just it's a great conversation that
- 9:25Speaker 1: I love the writing the book, and that's the type
- 9:28Speaker 1: of terminology is going to be relatable. You know. The
- 9:30Speaker 1: next break, we're gonna go into more detail about the
- 9:33Speaker 1: actual book because I want people to understand that it's
- 9:35Speaker 1: broken down in the four parts. I'm just gonna set
- 9:37Speaker 1: everybody up. It's four parts. Expand your vision, build your wings,
- 9:41Speaker 1: clear the clouds, sorts of new heights. And when I
- 9:44Speaker 1: when I, when I'm engaged in this next don't go
- 9:47Speaker 1: nowhere because you gotta hear the profound words of leadership,
- 9:51Speaker 1: fellowship and UH and entrepreneurship. That's gonna let you know
- 9:55Speaker 1: that you can win in the game of small business
- 9:58Speaker 1: and game of life. And the one thing I also
- 10:01Speaker 1: took away from the book is that if you'n employee,
- 10:03Speaker 1: you should read this book because you are a brand
- 10:06Speaker 1: and you should consider yourself an entrepreneur. We'll be right
- 10:09Speaker 1: back with more from Bishop t v j. We'll be
- 10:13Speaker 1: right back with more from mars Sean McDonald the Money
- 10:16Speaker 1: Making Conversations. But don't touch that down. Hi, This Rashan McDonald.
- 10:21Speaker 1: You're listening to money Making Conversation. I'm your host. On
- 10:24Speaker 1: the phone is Bishop tv Jake's and we're gonna go
- 10:26Speaker 1: in more detail about sore New York Times bestseller Build
- 10:30Speaker 1: your Vision from the ground up, And I'm telling everybody
- 10:33Speaker 1: it's truly is a person's blueprint for success. Bishop. The
- 10:38Speaker 1: reason I want to really start with your mom and
- 10:41Speaker 1: your dad because see when when people write books. The
- 10:44Speaker 1: one thing I don't like when they write books, it's
- 10:45Speaker 1: like they have no history and they don't have any resume.
- 10:48Speaker 1: Your mom was a real estate was involved in real estate,
- 10:51Speaker 1: and your father had a janitorial service. So you learned
- 10:55Speaker 1: this as as young as a youth. It was a
- 10:58Speaker 1: conversation in my house every day. Was it ronment I
- 11:00Speaker 1: grew up in and uh, my mother was always looking
- 11:04Speaker 1: for a deal or real estate and bound these pieces
- 11:07Speaker 1: of property and collecting rent from them. And in fact,
- 11:10Speaker 1: she did it when I was a child. She maintained
- 11:13Speaker 1: that property throughout her life. My mother finally died at
- 11:17Speaker 1: seventy three with Alzheimer's, and even as she was fading away,
- 11:21Speaker 1: my mother should had ripped money coming in that she
- 11:24Speaker 1: from houses. She couldn't remember anymore, and and it left
- 11:28Speaker 1: an indelible impression upon me because my mother was not
- 11:31Speaker 1: at the mercy of social security, She was not at
- 11:35Speaker 1: the mercy of her teacher's retirement. Though she received that
- 11:38Speaker 1: she had subsidized her income. And she becomes a catalyst
- 11:41Speaker 1: for conversation, particularly for women of color who have had
- 11:45Speaker 1: to scratch their way up and fight themselves, fight the
- 11:48Speaker 1: tide and the and and the male dominated uh disconnect
- 11:53Speaker 1: that existed in our country today. I think my mother
- 11:56Speaker 1: is a source of great inspiration. And as another reason
- 11:59Speaker 1: I gonnakeep, I'm gonna keep putting notches on why you
- 12:02Speaker 1: should read this book. You should read this book about
- 12:04Speaker 1: your mom because of the fact that you know, in
- 12:07Speaker 1: the times of racism, you know, and it was you know,
- 12:10Speaker 1: this stills exist today, but back then, you know, for her,
- 12:13Speaker 1: they had the inspiration. Understand, Okay, I'm a school teacher,
- 12:16Speaker 1: but I'm gonna put a little money over here, and
- 12:18Speaker 1: I'm gonna go go get this one house, get this
- 12:20Speaker 1: one house. That is to me is that's that just
- 12:24Speaker 1: have experienced that lets me know why you're successful today.
- 12:28Speaker 1: My mother bought so much real estate that they ended
- 12:30Speaker 1: up naming the street after her. She owned all the
- 12:33Speaker 1: property on the street and property in other areas of
- 12:35Speaker 1: the city. And so I had her on one hand
- 12:38Speaker 1: and my dad was on the other hand, who started
- 12:40Speaker 1: the business with the mom and the bucket and ended
- 12:42Speaker 1: up with fifty two employees in the sixties in West Virginia,
- 12:47Speaker 1: the second poorest state in the Union black in the sixties,
- 12:52Speaker 1: and he still worn in the art of business, my friend?
- 12:55Speaker 1: What leads up to your book? My friend? So Bill,
- 12:58Speaker 1: your vision from the up you broke it up in
- 13:01Speaker 1: the four chapters. I'm just naming each chapters. Just give
- 13:03Speaker 1: me a short synopsis on why that chapter is important
- 13:06Speaker 1: to first point one, expand your vision. You know, you
- 13:10Speaker 1: are no lord than the thoughts you think, and it's
- 13:13Speaker 1: very very important to expend your reason. I see so
- 13:15Speaker 1: many people who are even working good jobs. We mentioned
- 13:19Speaker 1: before the break about people who are are on a
- 13:21Speaker 1: job and they're building a vision for the company, but
- 13:24Speaker 1: they have but not built a brand for themselves. And
- 13:27Speaker 1: when the company gets finished with you, they tossed you aside.
- 13:30Speaker 1: You're back to ground level zero. You have not used
- 13:33Speaker 1: those principles that you used for the company, you don't
- 13:35Speaker 1: use them for yourself. I think that's a very important
- 13:38Speaker 1: place to start. The fact that African American women and
- 13:43Speaker 1: letting know women are going into business more readily than
- 13:45Speaker 1: any other people group is important to discuss as well,
- 13:49Speaker 1: because they're also going out of business because they don't
- 13:52Speaker 1: really have sustainability or access to finances in order to
- 13:57Speaker 1: be productive. So I start out by talking about vision.
- 14:00Speaker 1: Everything starts with the vision, expanding your vision, going to
- 14:04Speaker 1: new horizons, always being progressive, not being so busy doing
- 14:08Speaker 1: the work that you don't get to think the work
- 14:10Speaker 1: you do. Most entrepreneurs, the same thing that made them
- 14:14Speaker 1: great is killing them. They're so busy doing the work
- 14:17Speaker 1: that they don't get a chance to think the work.
- 14:19Speaker 1: And they cannot confuse business with business. You have two
- 14:24Speaker 1: chapters here, chapter two and chapter three. Build your wings
- 14:28Speaker 1: and clear the clouds. You have to build your own wings.
- 14:32Speaker 1: I use again the metaphor the Right brothers, and it
- 14:35Speaker 1: took them forever to get the plane in the air,
- 14:37Speaker 1: but they had to build their own wings in order
- 14:40Speaker 1: to get it done. It's not gonna happen through magic.
- 14:43Speaker 1: It is a building process. It is not going to
- 14:46Speaker 1: come through osmosis or just because you put a nice
- 14:50Speaker 1: picture on social media. And I deeply believe in marketing
- 14:53Speaker 1: through social media, but that it's not gonna come through
- 14:56Speaker 1: magic like that. And I talked about building those wings
- 15:00Speaker 1: because when you think of a business, a business is
- 15:03Speaker 1: not a destination, it's a transportation. The destination was to
- 15:08Speaker 1: get in the clouds. The transportation was the plane. So
- 15:12Speaker 1: your ghost should not be to have a business Your
- 15:14Speaker 1: ghost should be to have economic equity and your flight
- 15:18Speaker 1: pattern and your wing is through your business. And if
- 15:22Speaker 1: the goal is to have a business, you can have
- 15:23Speaker 1: a businesses start to death. The ghost should be to
- 15:26Speaker 1: have economic liquidity so that you have something pass onto
- 15:29Speaker 1: your errors and be able to bless your community, your generation,
- 15:33Speaker 1: so into your charities and whatever you that's a goal.
- 15:36Speaker 1: Now what are we gonna build to accomplish the goal?
- 15:39Speaker 1: Too many people see the business as the goal. The
- 15:42Speaker 1: business is not the goal. It is not the ends.
- 15:45Speaker 1: It's the means. You have to build those wings to
- 15:49Speaker 1: get you to the end of where you're trying to go. Wow.
- 15:53Speaker 1: In the last cap last like, there's four parts. Expand
- 15:56Speaker 1: your vision, build your wings, clear the clouds, and the
- 15:58Speaker 1: finaling one is sore to new heights, keep evolving, keep growing.
- 16:03Speaker 1: Whether you build the business to sell, and there are
- 16:06Speaker 1: logical reasons why many people build a business with selling
- 16:09Speaker 1: in mind, or whether you build a business to pass
- 16:12Speaker 1: on as a legacy to your tutor, you have to
- 16:15Speaker 1: keep momentum. You have to keep momentum. It is the
- 16:18Speaker 1: thrust that keeps the plane in the air. If you
- 16:21Speaker 1: lose your thrust, the plane will fall the law of
- 16:24Speaker 1: aero dynamics supersedes the law of gravity. And this is
- 16:28Speaker 1: the issue in all of our lives. We have a
- 16:30Speaker 1: gravitational pull that's always trying to pull us back down
- 16:33Speaker 1: to where we came from. In order to escape that
- 16:36Speaker 1: gravitational pull, you must maintain momentum. So you must be airborne.
- 16:41Speaker 1: Must maintain momentum, keep growing, keep building, keep going forward,
- 16:45Speaker 1: because if an airport, if an airplane stops his thrust,
- 16:49Speaker 1: it will immediately fall to the ground. Ladies and gym instore,
- 16:53Speaker 1: build your vision from the ground up. Bishop T. D.
- 16:55Speaker 1: Jake reveals how to build a uniquely personal vision within you,
- 17:00Speaker 1: within you, listen to me, within you, into your own
- 17:03Speaker 1: special and making have you make your own special contributions
- 17:05Speaker 1: to the world by blending common sense and information. That's
- 17:11Speaker 1: what this book springs to you, common sense and information,
- 17:14Speaker 1: and he wraps it up with faith. Don't ever walk
- 17:17Speaker 1: out that door thinking faith does not play a major role.
- 17:20Speaker 1: That's why I loved about this book because from a
- 17:22Speaker 1: minister's from a ministrel manager, from a preaching standpoint, you know,
- 17:29Speaker 1: we know what you do. You a bishop, you didn't.
- 17:32Speaker 1: You didn't start the book out like that. You go
- 17:34Speaker 1: through it all. I'mna lead out the stories with Oprah,
- 17:37Speaker 1: the Shelle Nichols as the Lieutenant hur You talked about Ms. Robbin,
- 17:40Speaker 1: you talked about padd lit Bell, how she saw an opportunity,
- 17:43Speaker 1: she just pray on it, she acts on it. She
- 17:46Speaker 1: acted on it. And that's what I love about this
- 17:48Speaker 1: book because you're telling people, Look, i'm gonna tell you
- 17:51Speaker 1: about business first, and then we're gonna pray. In a minute,
- 17:54Speaker 1: though we're gonna pray, but let gonna tell you this
- 17:57Speaker 1: is the business principle. Don't put prayer of it for
- 17:59Speaker 1: business this name and that is why I love these
- 18:03Speaker 1: books are and um wow, I know it's I know it.
- 18:06Speaker 1: I know it can't stay on the shelf. I know
- 18:08Speaker 1: it cannot stay on the sales. I'm excited about it.
- 18:11Speaker 1: Let me do a quick shout out, uh move before
- 18:13Speaker 1: you have to let me go. But there's a couple
- 18:15Speaker 1: of things I think they needed to know. My international
- 18:18Speaker 1: pastors and Leadership conferences coming up, and pastors and leaders
- 18:22Speaker 1: come from all over the world to be a part
- 18:24Speaker 1: of this meeting. They learned everything about organization, infrastructure, staffing, development, budgety,
- 18:30Speaker 1: maintaining because in many ways. In order to run a
- 18:34Speaker 1: church with any staff at all, you have to have
- 18:36Speaker 1: some business acumen. Even if it's just to acquire property
- 18:39Speaker 1: or to build low income housing, there's a business acumen
- 18:42Speaker 1: that needs to be there. What is new about this
- 18:44Speaker 1: year is that we also include classes for entrepreneurs. So
- 18:49Speaker 1: if you enjoyed so and you want to really build
- 18:51Speaker 1: on the information that was provided, you might want to
- 18:55Speaker 1: consider coming out April seventeenth, And it's gonna be April
- 18:58Speaker 1: seventeen eight. In nineteen, it's going to be in Dallas, Texas.
- 19:03Speaker 1: They can go to pastors and leaders dot org and
- 19:06Speaker 1: get more information about it. And one quick thing I
- 19:09Speaker 1: want to say, I think you're based in Atlanta. Is
- 19:11Speaker 1: that right? Well, Atlanta is well familiar with Women Are
- 19:15Speaker 1: Loose and I did it there for years and years
- 19:18Speaker 1: and years, filling up the Georgia nomen, so forth and
- 19:20Speaker 1: so on. This time, I'm going to do something new
- 19:23Speaker 1: in October that has never been done before. I'm doing
- 19:26Speaker 1: a master class for Women Are Loose. It's going to
- 19:29Speaker 1: be in Dallas. I'm only taking a small amount of women.
- 19:33Speaker 1: It will not be a stadium sized crowd. It's gonna
- 19:36Speaker 1: be October eighteenth through the twentieth. I'm building and bringing
- 19:40Speaker 1: me and many of my friends who are masters at
- 19:43Speaker 1: what they do. It's gonna be amazing. So whether you're evangelist, pastor, entrepreneur, businesswoman,
- 19:49Speaker 1: a career woman, professional woman, got more hats than you
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- 19:59Speaker 1: October eight between it and they can go to a
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- 20:11Speaker 1: thank you for sharing that, but more importantly, thank you
- 20:13Speaker 1: for writing that book. You know. The thing about it
- 20:17Speaker 1: is that I've always been a fan of what you
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- 20:23Speaker 1: me a jaded book reader and then read a book
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- 20:57Speaker 1: thank you for coming on my show. I'm a fan,
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