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Unlocking Inner Serenity: Exploring The Benefits, Techniques, And Significance Of Meditation With Thom Walters · Mindful You

0:00
Alan Carroll: Hi, everybody, and welcome to the mindful you
0:06
podcast, where we get to meet people, we get to talk to
0:11
people, we get to have people share their experiences of
0:16
mindfulness, and the various paths that you can go in order
0:22
to develop those mindfulness muscles. And in my 50s 60 years
0:31
of experience, I can think of no better tool, then the ability to
0:39
go back to the center, back to the grounding, by closing your
0:44
eyes, and meditating, stilling your mind. And today's guest,
0:53
Tom Walters, has been in the mindfulness meditation, stilling
1:00
the mind business. For a long, long time, he even described
1:06
that his mother, when he was a child, we'll be talking about
1:10
presence and stillness and deep breathing, and meditation. And I
1:15
said, Wow, how lucky to have a mother, a primary programmer of
1:21
your consciousness to be right there at the beginning, talking
1:24
about mindfulness, tools and mindfulness benefits. And today,
1:30
I'm happy to introduce Tom to you. And the podcast was so
1:37
rich, that we just kept on talking. So there's actually
1:42
going to be two Podcast. Today, you're going to be hearing part
1:47
one of the Thomas Walters podcast. And later in the
1:54
future, you will hear part two of the conversation that I had
1:59
with Thomas, that was just wonderful. And I'm happy that we
2:04
get to share him with you. And please welcome Thomas Walters to
2:10
the mindful U podcast. Tom Walters, welcome to the mindful
2:19
U podcast. Alan. The thing that excites me about our
2:24
conversation today, Tom, is that you and I are are integrating a
2:31
conversation into our into our life, and the conversation that
2:37
you are a stand for. And the conversation that I am the stand
2:41
for is the is the absolute importance of taking time out
2:51
every single day, to become still to become quiet. To become
3:04
to discover that there's a space in which there's no agitation,
3:13
smooth like water on a pond in the early morning. Perfect
3:18
reflection, no distortion, and the label that you use. And the
3:26
label that I use is meditation. So Boy, oh, boy, we're going to
3:32
the candy store today, baby. And we're gonna, we're gonna jump
3:35
into meditation so we can inspire other people to take the
3:40
time, whether it's five minutes, whether it's a minute to start
3:44
just getting that routine in, and then discover for yourself,
3:48
the richness of meditation. And I thought, Tom, it would be
3:52
wonderful for you to introduce your spiritual self by taking us
4:00
on a short meditation. So we can feel it in our bodies and see
4:05
what what are you talking about Tom and Alan meditation? What?
4:09
What's that? So just give us a taste of the of the honey.
4:15
Thom Walters: Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for your
4:17
introduction. Thank you for having me on your show. I am
4:20
very excited to be here. To your point. Why don't we just start
4:24
in with a nice, chill, inward journey and to do that?
4:29
Obviously, if your listeners are in the car, don't do this, but
4:32
if anybody's just sitting at their desk or at home, why don't
4:35
we just kind of find a nice, quiet space in our chair with
4:43
our feet flat on the floor and then slowly, just become aware
4:51
of your breath. Nothing special that we have to do right now.
4:58
Just become aware of all the sense stations that come with
5:01
our breath. Reps breathing in, we feel the coolness through our
5:07
nose below our chest rising and falling, perhaps our abdomen as
5:18
well. No need to change anything about your breath, just become
5:26
aware of it. As you're settling into wherever you are, just
5:34
place your hands in your lap or on your thighs. In a moment,
5:42
we're going to take some nice deep breaths. And for us that
5:46
means a nice in through the nose, inhale for four seconds,
5:51
or a count of four. And we're going to hold it for a count of
5:56
seven. And then let it out slowly through our mouth for a
6:00
count of a when we do that together right now in for for
6:04
through our nose hold 234567 and through our mouth
6:29
Unknown: let's take another nice deep breath. If you haven't
6:32
close your eyes, that's definitely an option as well in
6:34
through our nose for a count of four hold
6:45
and slowly let it out
6:54
let's do one last long deep breath or best yet in through
6:57
our nose. Expanding that belly hold after our mouth
7:17
and now let's just bring our attention back to the normal
7:19
tempo of our breath feeling the chair underneath us or feet on
7:29
the floor any thoughts happened to find their way into her mind.
7:36
There's absolutely no reason to get upset. It's what a mind
7:40
does. mind creates thoughts. But if we find out that we have
7:46
wandered, it's as simple as returning our attention back to
7:49
our breath. And all the sensations that are there
8:00
in any sounds that you hear maybe there's some smells nice.
8:13
In a moment, I'm going to count back from five to one as our
8:17
brief meditation ends
8:20
more each one eyes will be open feeling totally refreshed.
8:25
Totally relaxed five or noticing the run the room around you
8:40
three almost there feeling totally relaxed. Totally calm.
8:49
Two and one. When you're ready, you can open your eyes
9:02
Alan Carroll: Thank you, Brother Tom. I was that was very nice.
9:06
Gotcha. Let's, let's talk about the value of doing that
9:17
exercise. Okay, you want me to stop you? I'm gonna close my
9:21
eyes. You want me to breathe and notice my breath and Okay. Yeah.
9:26
Okay. It was pleasant. So, let's talk about Yeah, okay, what's
9:31
the value of brushing your teeth every day? You know, what's the
9:33
value of preventative maintenance here? So what's the
9:36
value of of meditation? What does meditation do that I should
9:41
devote more time of my busy busy schedule to to a lot of space in
9:48
my daily routine. To do this close my eyes feet flat on the
9:52
floor stuff.
9:55
Unknown: Well, that answer could take us days to talk about but I
9:58
will. I will read his dad Just for it, and then anybody that's
10:01
not our peers might just get what's a Reader's Digest. But
10:05
getting to your point. The main benefits that I find for
10:10
meditation practice is, obviously there's a
10:12
physiological, we'll talk about that maybe a little bit later.
10:15
But each day, when we wake up, we think that we are in control
10:21
of our thoughts, we think that we are running our own ship. And
10:24
you know, we're doing all the things that we want. But the
10:27
long and short of it is that if we don't have a meditation
10:30
practice, or if we don't have a practice for turning inwardly,
10:33
then we're not really in control of our day, we're just reacting
10:37
to all the stimulus that's out there. And in 2023, there is a
10:42
lot of stimulus out there, there's societal pressures,
10:45
there's the thoughts well meaning or otherwise of
10:48
caregivers. And so we're not really steering our own ship. So
10:53
we're just kind of reacting not responding, but reacting to all
10:56
the things that happen in our day. And to that point, people
10:59
think, Oh, if a lot of good things happen in my day, it was
11:02
a good day, or if a lot of seemingly challenging things
11:06
happened. It was a rotten day. So people basically think that
11:10
my day is not my day, whatever happens happens. And I'll just
11:14
assess at the end, with a meditation practice, we can and
11:19
do silence the world around us, we kind of put ourselves in a
11:23
cocoon. So all the societal thoughts and pressures and media
11:28
and caregivers, all the people that have thoughts about what we
11:31
should do who we should be, they're just out there. And in
11:34
this cocoon of silence, you have an awareness of what really is
11:39
important to you, not what society wants, not what your
11:44
parents, your boyfriend, girlfriend want. It's what is
11:46
meaningful for you, we turn inwardly as you and I obviously
11:49
know is so important. And we really understand that. With
11:53
that silence, we know what has meaning for us. And then when we
11:57
wake up in the day, and then we kind of guide not kind of we
12:01
guide our day. So if we get cut off in traffic, it's not just a
12:06
reaction that we like, ah, that son of a gun. We're like, Okay,
12:10
I'm safe. I'm fine. Meditation gives us that. That space to
12:16
just be and not just bouncing around like a pinball machine.
12:20
There's another reference for people that are RH. So there's
12:25
the Yeah, exactly. Like pinball. Hmm, well, yeah, remember that?
12:30
Okay, segue closed. But to my point, it gives us the space to
12:34
understand who we are what has meaning for us. And it makes us
12:39
just less reactive, more responsive and less reactive. So
12:42
that's the long and short of it. That's definitely the shorter
12:46
because like I said, we could talk for hours days about all
12:48
the benefits of meditation, but well, I'll stop with that one.
12:54
Alan Carroll: You said, several magic words. And I just want to
13:02
underline some of those magic words. Controlling the thoughts
13:08
that you think the thoughts so so what's this? So why should I
13:16
totally and Deepak Chopra said 65 to 80,000 thoughts pass
13:21
through the screen every day, right? And 95 of those percent
13:26
are the same thoughts you had yesterday. So like nothing new
13:28
is happening here. Right. So in my in my reality, the way that I
13:33
understand it, is that my thoughts, paint the picture. In
13:38
my mind's eye, that's then projected out into the outer
13:42
world. So what I see in my mind's eye, which I painted, all
13:47
of a sudden appears to be the same in the outer world. So most
13:51
people are trying to change the outer world in order to get
13:54
happiness. But if you could change the picture, that you
13:58
paint, by controlling the thoughts, which is the paint the
14:00
thought paint, then you can alter the 35 millimeter, which
14:06
goes right along with the pinball machine, the 35
14:10
millimeter slide, that you take the take the flashlight, and you
14:15
shine it, and it appears projected onto the big screen.
14:19
So let's talk about the importance of managing thoughts,
14:23
which most people aren't even aware of.
14:26
Unknown: That's a great point. And wonderfully put up because I
14:30
agree wholeheartedly. And I love the fact that you made the
14:32
connection, that peace and joy and anything we want has to come
14:38
internally from inward, we can't be looking outwardly because
14:42
inwardly stays the same. It's never going to change. Well, we
14:47
all change, obviously. But that change is something that we
14:50
elicit. And so we can, for one, a better word control that but
14:55
we can't control anything that's outside of us. So one of the
15:00
things to talk about on my show is what I call situational
15:03
neutrality. And it's a fancy way of saying that anything that
15:07
happens is absolutely neutral. And it's our thoughts that
15:12
either paint the reality, just like you said, to the negative
15:16
or the positive. In fact, I don't have many examples right
15:20
now. But the point I'm trying to make is that anything that
15:23
happens to us, if we don't have a practice to kind of sift that
15:30
out and find out what's going to be serving for us, then the
15:33
negativity and this is sounds a little pessimistic, but the
15:36
negativity of the world is going to paint that picture for us.
15:40
Meaning that there is a negativity bias, meaning that if
15:43
we don't do anything in our day, whether it be a meditation,
15:46
practice, exercise, tai chi, whatever, then our caveman
15:51
brain, our reptilian brain is just going to be looking for all
15:54
the things to be aware of things to be to keep us safe, like,
15:59
basically, you wake up and you basically scan the scan your
16:02
environment to say, Okay, what's gonna take me out? I need to be
16:06
worried about that. I need to be worried about that. Oh, man,
16:10
who's that guy? Who's that guy crossing the street? Why is he
16:12
coming towards me, we have all these thoughts that are just
16:16
coming at us that negativity bias. So if you don't have
16:18
anything to do it, that's what our day is going to be like,
16:19
just all these fears, worries that have been instilled in us
16:22
since our caveman days since the reptilian brain. But with a
16:25
meditation practice, we can getting back to that social
16:28
situation neutrality thing, we have that gap between stimulus
16:32
and response for we see something to say, Cool, I don't
16:36
have to jump into fight or flight, I don't have to jump
16:38
into fear. I can be here. And I can see cool. That guy or gal,
16:44
like just a stranger. I'm like, oh, cool, they're smiling. Nice.
16:48
We just become aware of the world around us. And to my
16:51
point, any situation, then we can with that silence with that
16:56
stillness, we can say, here's the situation. And maybe on the
17:00
outside, it looks like a horrible situation with that
17:02
quietness, we say, okay, if I'm gonna, if I have this stillness,
17:06
if I have this silence, I can strip away what my reactive mind
17:10
is saying, and I can look at it like, Okay, I see that there's
17:15
gold to be mined there, there's something to grow from. And we
17:18
can just basically extract the things that are going to help us
17:21
grow, help us learn, help us become more compassionate, and
17:25
better for the people around us. So that inner journey, much to
17:30
what you saw, articularly said, allows us the the thought paint,
17:34
and I love that, by the way. So I paint to totally allow us to
17:39
create a life that is vibrant and just worth living is that
17:44
mean every day is going to be an absolute dream. No. But with a
17:48
meditation practice, we don't get caught up into that, that
17:51
that net of emotional reactivity where it's like, Oh, my God, I
17:55
lost my job, this is the worst thing ever, I'm gonna be under a
17:58
bridge and like, relax, relax, don't buy into that you can
18:03
paint whatever picture you want. And with that, that stillness,
18:06
you know, not to jump into the situations that are gonna just
18:09
just keep that that cataclysmic spiral going. So I hope that
18:13
answered your question.
18:16
Alan Carroll: It's a question that's been asked for 1000s of
18:19
years. So probably will be 4000 more. Because what you're
18:23
talking about is thoughts are things muddied. Alright, just
18:31
like, this coffee cup is the thing that exists within a
18:35
space. So the thought is a metaphysical thing, because you
18:40
can't quite touch it, right? Son of a gun, it's there and exist
18:44
within that space. And to me, if you can distinguish the thing,
18:50
the thought that now appears in the space, and then begin to
18:54
make spaced, more important than the thing and the space behind
18:59
you do that, Tom, do that by creating space, right? Why do
19:04
you create space? Well, you create space by closing your
19:08
eyes, taking that breath and slowing everything down.
19:18
salutely Slow down. And you can't do that drive on a car.
19:28
You can't do that skiing the slopes can't do that talking to
19:30
you. Tom can't do that. Taking your work, can't do it, my eyes
19:32
open. So first of all, close your eyes, that would eliminate
19:39
a huge amount of visual crap that you are seeing that is just
19:46
contaminating things. And you you so one of the magic words is
19:52
is controlling the thoughts through the power of
19:54
observation. So let's talk about this observer witness Part of
20:00
our beingness, which is developed by using what I call
20:06
The Fifth Element of space, or their fire, water and space, by
20:10
practicing and creating space, how do you develop that, that
20:15
have not even developed? But I know you're a movie, a movie
20:18
guy. And so am I, he is just you want your head taken off, listen
20:25
to him. He is just incredible. Right? And so he talks about
20:30
the, the erasing the erasing of the thoughts. And most people
20:38
get stuck on the content of the thought good, bad, right
20:42
thought. We're not talking here about the content of the
20:45
thought. We're talking about your ability to manage thoughts,
20:49
things, neutral thoughts, all the thoughts are neutral.
20:53
They're not good thoughts, bad thoughts, right thought that's
20:56
what did your mother told you. We're talking about neutrality
21:00
here, where everything just is. So let's, let's take take us
21:05
down that that path of neutrality, observation,
21:08
everything just is without judgment. We're
21:11
Unknown: getting back to the very base of our conversation is
21:14
meditation. It kind of segues right into that, because, excuse
21:20
me, when we are meditating. And when you're meditating your
21:26
mind, depending on the day, I mean, I've been meditating for
21:29
over 40 years, so And there's still days that I sit on my
21:33
thank you, but I sit on my cushion. And I'm like, okay,
21:36
cool. What's for lunch today? Okay, dude, back to the breath
21:40
back to the breath. Like, wow, that shows funny last night,
21:44
back to the breath back to the breath. So the mind, even for an
21:47
experienced meditator, it's gonna be it's gonna be active or
21:51
less active, but to your point, seeing thoughts, neutrally is
21:56
what meditation is perfect for. And one of the things, one of
21:59
the greatest lessons that I teach my students is in the, in
22:03
the first couple of weeks of our, of our training is that
22:10
many times that just like I said, you know, you sit down,
22:12
you quiet your mind, you close your eyes, you take those nice,
22:15
deep breaths, and then your mind wanders, and then you bring it
22:18
back to your breath, or your mind or whatever, it's going to
22:20
be for that focus. And many of my new students get so
22:23
frustrated, because they're like, dude, is this what
22:26
meditation is? Like, every two seconds, I have to recognize a
22:29
thought and bring my attention back to my breath. Like, That's
22:32
so frustrating. I'm like, Well, why don't we turn that on its
22:35
head? Why don't you see it as a gift instead of a curse? Because
22:40
before you started learning how to meditate? When did you
22:44
realize that you were having thoughts in the day? And they
22:47
kind of scratch your head for a minute, and they're like, I, I
22:50
never noticed when I have thoughts in the day, they just
22:53
come. Like, exactly, exactly. And to that point, you never
22:58
knew where they're coming from what the purpose was, you're
23:01
just reacting to them with a meditation instead of getting
23:03
frustrated, but always having to bring back your focus. Every
23:06
time that you notice your mind wandering, you should send off
23:09
fireworks, you are noticing your mind you are noticing thoughts.
23:13
And to that point, because of our training because of our
23:16
practice. You're saying this is a thought much like you so
23:19
wonderfully put, it's a thought. It's not negative. It's not
23:22
positive. It's a thought. And because I have this stillness,
23:25
because I have this silence. I can look at it. I'm like, Cool.
23:29
I don't need to react. It's just like, like staring at a painting
23:32
in a museum. You're like, yeah, God, that's beautiful. Yeah.
23:36
Alan Carroll: Good analogy. Staring at painting in the
23:39
museum.
23:39
Unknown: Yes. Yeah. That painting that you painted. Yeah,
23:42
that's a great point.
23:44
Alan Carroll: Judging the painting that you painted. Oh,
23:46
Rocky, bad. Good. I liked that. Put that crap in the painting. I
23:50
guess. I want to know who around here, put that stuff on that
23:54
painting. We got to find that person, baby. And we got to do
23:58
stuff because that person has issues. That's a great analogy.
24:02
I love that one.
24:03
Unknown: No, that's awesome. I love how you brought that alive
24:06
because that's exactly what our mind does, outside of a
24:08
meditation because in meditation, we're like, cool,
24:11
there's a painting. It's got a gold frame and there's a tree,
24:14
there's burnin. We just look at it. But to the untrained persons
24:18
like, just like you said, like, well, who painted that look at
24:21
those brushstrokes are all over the place. Why would you choose
24:24
that color and our mind is just like doing that same thing with
24:26
a thought. I'm like, Whoa. Whereas with meditation
24:30
practice, we just like cool. There's a thought the other day.
24:33
It's funny because one of the as a quick aside the other day, one
24:37
of the things that our meditation practice is good for
24:39
is helping us identify thoughts and fears. I was working on
24:43
something I was about to start something that I'd never done
24:45
before. I don't know if it was a marketing thing or whatever. And
24:48
I had this thought like, huh, God this is this is gonna be
24:52
tough. Are you sure you should tackle that right now? This is
24:54
probably not something you're that good at. And because of my
24:57
awareness, I'm like, hey, oh, look Can you thanks for showing
25:01
up? No, I got this. But I appreciate you're trying to
25:04
trying to dissuade me. So we have that. And that's a somewhat
25:09
whimsical take on how we can have interactions with our
25:13
thoughts how we can week, because we have a meditation
25:16
practice, we can see a thought is a thing and just say, Huh,
25:20
where did that come from? Like, oh, that's fear. That's ego
25:24
trying to get me to a safe spot. Well guess what I'm all set. So
25:28
see you later. That interaction, that understanding of thoughts
25:34
is just so powerful, because what I talked about many times
25:39
on, in my, with my students, and on Zen commuters that we have a
25:44
gap between stimulus and response. And when we don't have
25:47
a practice, it's probably like, you could fit a sheet of paper
25:50
in between that gap between stimulus and response. And we
25:53
just become so reactive, but with anything that we increase
25:57
that gap, so that when something happens, we can it's like, much
26:01
like that painter like that I'm using a movie, we just step back
26:04
and we look at it like, Hmm, what do we want to do here? How
26:09
do I want to respond to I want to respond, maybe I just want to
26:11
react, maybe I just want to go with what I'm feeling. But we
26:14
have that gap to determine what we want to do that gap to create
26:17
our lives. And it's just so powerful, as I'm sure you
26:20
obviously know. You're speaking
26:22
Alan Carroll: to the choir, I'm still using that analogy of the
26:26
museum. And one of the ways that I would describe the benefit of
26:30
meditation is that every time I meditate, I take one step
26:33
further away from the painting. Mm hmm. And every time I close
26:37
my eyes and wake up during the day, I take one step away from
26:41
the pin. And pretty soon the painting, which is the thought
26:43
that had such a gravitational effect on my behavior, because
26:47
my mother told me this to be true. And pretty soon the
26:51
painting is 300 yards down down the road. And so it doesn't
26:55
affect me, I can enjoy the paint, I do a close up of the
26:58
painting, I can frame it, I can do anything I want with the
27:00
painting. But the gravitational effect that the thought has on
27:04
my behavior is now I can choose between the egoic thoughts or
27:10
the loving God thoughts, right? Boy, if I choose a loving God
27:14
thoughts, then you and I are both sons of God. I'm having fun
27:17
on the earth right now entertaining our brothers and
27:20
sisters, on the spiritual benefits of meditation. And
27:24
that's our journey. That's what we do. And so that is that,
27:28
therefore you would always paint the words that you speak. And
27:32
you'd always paint the thoughts that you think you'd have a
27:34
choice. Well, how do you how do you get a choice, you got to get
27:37
a choice between that space you talked about? There's the thing
27:41
of the thought. And then there's the space. Most people have no
27:44
space. Exactly. So take us down the we'll jump into a little bit
27:50
of the Buddhist thing. And the Buddhist talks about disembodied
27:54
states of consciousness and embodied states of
27:57
consciousness, which to me has to do with disembodied means
28:01
you're playing with the thoughts. And embody means
28:03
you're playing with the body. So let's take us down to the
28:07
another benefit of spending your life in the body rather than
28:10
spending your life in the clouds.
28:13
Unknown: Well, one of the things that meditation is beneficial
28:15
for with that with that question is that there are a lot of
28:19
physiological things that happen in our body. We can we'll segue
28:23
into Buddhism for a second in a bit, but just thinking about
28:26
many times people think about meditation as being something
28:30
totally like, Oh, those monks in the Himalayas they they're
28:33
meditators, but Oh, headed
28:35
Alan Carroll: monks. Just
28:36
Unknown: get sent like, hey, there's my brother. Exactly. I
28:41
never thought that my shaving my head would be a choice that will
28:45
serve me later on. Future, people might think, Oh, wow,
28:49
that guy's kind of wise. I'm like, wow, okay. He's got a bald
28:52
head, he must be wise. But getting back to your question is
28:54
that people see have the misperception that meditation is
28:59
something for, for Buddhists, for monks, for clerics, and way
29:04
out there not knowing that, yeah, there could be that
29:07
component. And we have that stillness. We could bring it
29:09
wherever we want. But the very nature of meditation is
29:13
physiological. You know, in the exercise we just did the
29:17
beginning of the of our talk, taking those nice deep breaths.
29:23
When we exactly when we breathe deeply through our diaphragm,
29:27
expanding our belly and contracting, there is a nerve
29:32
that is attached to the diaphragm. It's called the vagus
29:35
nerve. And basically when our body or our brain says, Huh,
29:41
that that stomach that Abner, that bell, whatever you want to
29:45
call it, is expanding and contracting. That signal goes up
29:48
to the brain to say, okay, you know what? We were all fired up
29:52
in that fight or flight response, meaning that our heart
29:55
rate was going our breathing was labored blood was leaving our
29:58
hands and our feet and our fingers has to go to major
30:00
muscles. So we can run or fight that tiger that back in the day
30:04
was there. So that's fight or flight. So if we have a fight or
30:07
flight, then we must have something to counteract that.
30:10
And that's exactly the relaxation response. And kind of
30:14
roundabout when we take those nice deep breaths through our
30:16
abdomen that that vagus nerve is triggered. So the brain says,
30:23
Okay, if he or she is breathing like this, there's no tiger,
30:27
there's no guy with a gun, or Girl with a Gun. It's just, they
30:31
must be in that shell space, so I don't have to be all ramped up
30:34
anymore. Let me fire up the relaxation response. So then the
30:38
heart starts slowing down, that are late, our breathing becomes
30:42
less labored. We get blood back in our fingers and toes. And the
30:47
reason this is so important is that back in the caveman days,
30:51
it was very clear, what was a danger, like, hey, there's a
30:54
tiger right at the mouth of the cave. Oh my god. So now, so then
31:00
that fight or flight ramped up. But as we evolved, we became
31:07
aware or more things we're putting our, in our lives, that
31:12
may be a danger or may not. So the point or the example I
31:17
always get is that, suppose you're at work, and your boss
31:20
zips off and email. Hey, I want to get together today and talk
31:24
about some stuff. Your brain could start saying, Oh, God, oh,
31:30
God, what do they want? Oh, I screw up on that project. Oh,
31:34
man. So that innocuous email then becomes a tiger at your
31:39
cave door. And your stress response just getting ramped up
31:42
and ramped up, right?
31:43
Alan Carroll: Analogies through the tiger, the email becomes the
31:46
tiger at your what door? Was it again?
31:49
Unknown: What's that? The Tiger at the cave? The cave cave door
31:52
at the cave
31:53
Alan Carroll: door? Yeah, that's great. That's exactly what
31:56
happens. Yeah, absolutely.
31:57
Unknown: So. And that's just one example. So if we have if we
32:01
don't have the ability to suss out what is and what isn't, then
32:05
literally everything becomes a stress response, or everything
32:08
becomes an impetus for a stress response. And then we're just
32:11
stressed all the time. And because that stress is happening
32:15
all the time, then we become we have the misperception that that
32:19
is normal, that I'm like, oh, no, I'm not stressed. But your
32:23
body's saying, The hell you aren't. Like, you may have
32:27
normalized this, but no, I'm reacting, like everything you
32:30
see, everything you're feeding me is a danger. So with that
32:34
stress response going all throughout our days, then
32:37
obviously that's going to wreak havoc with our bodies, because
32:40
our the fight or flight is always only supposed to be like,
32:43
run or fight the tiger. And then, okay, cool, ramped down.
32:47
But if it stays ramped up, we just rip through our body like a
32:50
hot knife through butter. So we have the ability, with a
32:53
meditation practice to kind of to find that gap that we're just
32:58
talking about, and just kind of see what is what is real or
33:02
create the perception of what we want to be real, I think, um,
33:05
maybe we'll save that. We'll save that for another talk. But
33:09
so. So obviously, meditation Buddhism been around over 2500
33:15
years. So it's amazing, and not amazing that a practice has
33:19
lasted that long, because there are so many benefits. One of the
33:23
other benefits in relation to your question is that when we
33:27
have a meditation practice, there's just such a calm that
33:32
comes from connection. We are constantly much like I talked
33:36
about earlier, inundated with suicidal thoughts, and one of
33:39
the hugest thoughts is that we are all separate. That you are
33:43
Alan, I am Tom, you were there. I'm here we are two separate
33:47
people just go on about this earth. And the Buddhist belief
33:52
that when we have that meditative practice, when we
33:55
have those moments of stillness, we connect to that oneness that
34:01
we that bubble that I talked about before, when somebody
34:03
says, Oh, there are a billion people on the planet. Now
34:05
there's one entity on this planet. When we have that
34:09
stillness, then we shut out all those things that say, You're
34:12
separate, you're alone. You are, it's just you. And then we feel
34:17
that all life, and it's just so palpable, and it happens many
34:22
times in my meditation, and one of the things I talk about
34:26
whether it be literal, like depression, or loneliness, or
34:30
anxiety, we, when we get in those spaces, we're like, it's
34:34
just me, and it's really tough. I'm just one person and nobody
34:40
knows what I'm going through. And the whole world is out there
34:42
and I'm just suffering. But when we have a meditation practice,
34:46
we realize that there's a connection and that connection.
34:51
It's not tangible, but it's just so wonderful to know that with a
34:56
meditation practice, like regardless of what you're going
34:59
through, whether you quotation your thoughts are not, you're
35:02
not alone. When you have a meditation practice, you just
35:05
feel such connection. And even in the most surreal meditations
35:12
that I've had, when I've thought about, I'm like, I am one guy in
35:16
a park on a bench meditating, and there's an entire universe,
35:21
I am so small. And yet in my meditation, that's the exact
35:26
opposite that I feel. I'm like, I am one grain of sand on a
35:31
beach. But I am absolutely one of the most not just one of but
35:37
just, I am pivotal in this beach, if I didn't exist, this
35:40
beach wouldn't exist. And to that point is when we have that
35:44
meditation practice, like, there's just such a calm, and
35:46
there's just such a joy that comes from knowing like, Man, I
35:52
am part of something really amazing. And because we have
35:55
that practice, we are shielding ourselves from all the things
35:58
say, what are you crazy? You're one guy. And like, so? From
36:05
Buddhist standpoint, obviously, our meditation practice fosters
36:08
compassion, fosters connection, fosters universal love. And to
36:13
be honest, that's theirs doesn't get better than that for me,
36:17
which is why I do what I do. Do you find the same to be the case
36:20
for you?
36:25
Alan Carroll: Buddhism is, of the different religions I've
36:29
tasted, it tastes the sweetest. Because it talks about the
36:35
illusion of separation. So what does that mean? Well, that means
36:40
they asked the question, well, what do you mean, we're
36:42
connected? Somehow? If I don't, that's not my experience. Right?
36:46
And then that gets you into the ego being conversation. So the
36:51
ego is the one that doesn't experience the connection. And
36:53
the being is the one that experiences connecting. Well,
36:56
how do you build the bridge? Between this egoic judgment
37:00
identity and this spiritual being identity? And, and one of
37:05
the greatest teachers that I'd like to talk about now is Mr.
37:09
Moochie. Because I saw on your Instagram, you had a picture of
37:13
him. And I thought that but you had a picture of Musa that's,
37:18
that's a divine person I'm talking to because you don't see
37:22
a lot of people with with pictures of moose Muti on on on
37:25
your, on their Instagram, until you hear him speak. And then you
37:30
hear him speak. You want to picture? Yeah. So how long have
37:38
you listened to Moochie?
37:40
Unknown: relatively recently, in fact, to be honest with you, I
37:43
came across it and just started delving into, into the, the
37:48
thoughts and beliefs of, of, of, of Moochie and what it really
37:53
meant. And it's just, I mean, the thing that's so awesome
37:58
about meditation as well, just as a segue real quickly is that
38:01
Alan Carroll: thank you time, take your time. Take a breath,
38:03
you know. There's no rush here. No. Like the horses calm down.
38:11
Take the breath, settle down.
38:15
Unknown: Just become a student.
38:17
Alan Carroll: Take the big breath. There you go. There you
38:19
go. Okay, get those horses all lined up. You're talking about a
38:24
Divine Being he just he deserves a few seconds of stillness.
38:28
Right.
38:29
Unknown: Right. Exactly. But is it as a as a quick aside, that
38:34
when we have that awareness, when we have that stillness, it
38:37
trend it makes its way into our, our, our daily life? And the
38:42
things that seem just like just like, fleeting by like, oh, oh,
38:47
so when there are things like Moochie, like quotes, like
38:51
anything. It's like we become aware of them because we're
38:55
slower. Like, instead of world going like this, it's like, wow,
39:00
hey, that's neat. Cool. So yeah, to be honest, I recently just
39:05
found out about Moochie. Well, what's your experience been?
39:14
Alan Carroll: He says the same thing again, and again and again
39:16
and again, and he doesn't change the music. Every time you listen
39:20
to the YouTube, it's the same song. Right? It's all new. And
39:26
so it's it's a song of stillness. It's the song of the
39:33
idea that the thoughts are the clouds in the sky. And you are
39:40
not the clouds. The clouds are impermanent, they're passing by
39:44
they're all the things and then you begin to look for blue sky
39:48
and create more blue sky and more blue sky and the the the
39:52
revelation that came to me when I listened to what he had to
39:55
say. He talked about taking In all the thoughts of the future,
40:02
all the thoughts you jump, and just just for a second, just put
40:05
them over to the side. And now take all the thoughts of the
40:10
past memories, experiences, judgments, it's take all those
40:14
thoughts and put them there just for a second, just for a second,
40:16
just one second. And let's just take a look at what's left. And
40:20
then you discover that every thought that you think or see or
40:24
feel is either falls into one or two categories. And when you can
40:29
just for this pretending Of course, we're just pretending
40:33
the the empty space, and he spends 20 minutes to asking
40:37
questions about the empty space. What is the shape of the empty
40:40
space? Well, it doesn't really have a shape. What's the opinion
40:43
of the empty space? Well, it doesn't have an opinion, it's
40:45
just, it's just is when you realize that your your vision
40:49
has been contaminated. And by the thoughts that you're
40:53
thinking that you're not even consciously aware of, until
40:57
until you get that space. And then you realize, oh, it's just
41:00
a painting that I'm painting. Yeah, that is that revelation of
41:05
the distinction that, wait a minute, I can create a blank
41:08
space. In my reality, if I can just manage my thoughts, which
41:14
is where we started our conversation, when I asked you
41:18
the benefit of meditation, and you said, the ability to control
41:22
our thoughts, and our the ability in my world to become a
41:27
a master painter. So you only paint you only paint pictures of
41:33
love and divinity, compassion and love. And so I want to thank
41:37
you for for inspiring our audience today and, and
41:41
inspiring me so that I can feel the energy within me. You know,
41:46
it's like riding the rapids a little faster than the word like
41:50
level five, downhill. Rapids rather than easy. I really
41:55
enjoyed the bouncing the back and forth of our cover our
42:00
conversation, because he's, well, you say the same words you
42:04
use, you have experienced. You've tasted the same stuff.
42:09
And you articulated with words that yeah, I understand those
42:14
words. Those take some time to understand, though, but I
42:17
understand some of those words you're talking about.
42:19
Unknown: Right? Right. But it's been an absolute joy to be
42:24
sharing this time with you as well, because it's, I love
42:27
talking, obviously, with kindred souls. And it was so nice to
42:30
have you on that computer. And I'm so glad that we get to
42:33
continue our conversation as well. Excuse me, and to that
42:36
point, you give me so many things to think about as well.
42:39
And it's funny, because it's the same thing that we're tasting.
42:43
But we're tasting it in two different ways. And that's
42:46
what's so wonderful about meditation is that we get to
42:49
experience things, how we choose to experience them, but with the
42:53
paint the metaphor that we're using so often, but so
42:55
accurately and aptly that life isn't challenging. I mean, yeah,
43:02
there are gonna be times where you're like, Man, this sucks.
43:04
But you know, what, throw a label of suck on it. And that's
43:08
how it's gonna be forever. extract that know that you can
43:11
create anything. And it's just, I have such a gift in my mom. My
43:18
mom taught me how to meditate when I was 18. So, and she was a
43:22
pioneer way before, like, the things that you and I are
43:25
talking about. Now the things that we hear in our circles she
43:29
was talking about in 1982 when I was in high school, and I
43:32
remember just so many times, I'm like, she taught me how to
43:34
meditate. But I mean, she'd say so many things. I'm just like,
43:37
and she wasn't a drinker. I'm like, Have you been drinking?
43:39
I'm like, What the heck are you talking about? And now the very
43:43
things that she used to that had me scratching my head when I was
43:46
a kid, I'm like, Ah, thanks for being patient, Mom, I get it.
43:50
Now. She was planting all these seeds. And the the major seed
43:55
that she planted was that very thing that you create your own
43:59
reality. She's like, you want to change your world, change your
44:02
thoughts change, one thought can create an entire different
44:06
reality. And like I said, when I was younger, I'm like, Wolf, you
44:09
were out there, sister, I don't know for sure. But is the
44:13
greatest gift that she has ever given me. And she's given me
44:15
plenty different things about you know, teaching meditation
44:18
and just different ways of being in the world. But just the
44:21
understanding that you don't have to buy into anybody else's
44:25
reality about what life is you can create your reality for what
44:29
life is. And with a meditation practice, there might be people
44:33
saying, either you're crazy, you're like, Dude, you can't do
44:35
that. Or what about this? What about that? Do you live in a
44:37
under a rock, there's war, there's famine, there's disease.
44:40
I'm like, yeah, it's out there. But it's not in here. I can be
44:45
the best person that I can be. And I can change those things
44:48
either. Literally by deciding to change those things or by
44:52
resonating an energy that is love and kindness and
44:56
compassionate every time I sit down every time you sit down.
44:59
That is it. exactly what we do, we change the energy of the
45:02
world. And that's why for me, meditation is so important
45:06
because I mean, I'm not a, everybody's got their own path.
45:09
But the more people that learn how to create their world that
45:15
come from a place of love and compassion and stillness, like,
45:18
that's how the world changes. Yeah, there are things we can do
45:21
on a, quote, physical level, but it's just as equally powerful,
45:26
if not more so, to be on your cushion. Imagine if the entire
45:31
world meditated for 15 minutes, the world would change, it would
45:35
change. It would become imperceivable, to what the world
45:39
is now. And not that the world now is anything other than
45:42
perfect as well. But there's just a union, there's a
45:45
stillness, and there's just such an energy that is that emanates
45:49
from each of us, when we control our thoughts, control our energy
45:53
control. Our minds just come from a place of love and
45:56
compassion. Oh, isn't
45:59
Alan Carroll: that sweet? Wow, what a nice way to complete our
46:03
first I hope of more podcast.
46:05
Unknown: I would love that as well. You are definitely always
46:07
welcome on Sam computer, for sure. And
46:10
Alan Carroll: so I want to thank you, Tom, Tom Walters for being
46:13
a spark of light, and making the paint of illumination even
46:19
better, and allow the divine light of what we're talking
46:23
about to shine brightly and in people's lives by taking a time
46:28
out each day to create that space of stillness. So thank you
46:32
for being a champion of still thank
46:35
Unknown: you right back for the exact same thing. I love it.
46:37
Like I said, I love it when I get to talk to like kindred
46:40
souls and kindred spirits that are doing the exact same thing.
46:43
So I appreciate this opportunity. I'm glad for all
46:45
the work that you're doing as well. So thank you. All
46:47
Alan Carroll: right. Well, thank you very much, Tom. Until and
46:49
until next time.
46:51
Unknown: Take care, my friend