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The Power of Presence: Discovering Your Inner Self Through Mindfulness and Breathwork With Herb Avritt · Mindful You

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Alan Carroll: Our next guest on the mindful you podcast. I met a
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while back at an event called embracing the woo woo meaning
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that spiritual dimension of consciousness, that metaphysical
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dimension of consciousness beyond the ego, identity. And
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Herb was a spiritual coach, he described himself as a spiritual
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coach and entrepreneur. He has faced traumatic brain injuries,
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has gone through a healing and has journey down the mindfulness
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path. And now has tapped into that mindfulness, dimension of
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consciousness. And he also has gone down the path of
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psychedelic integration using medicines in order to achieve
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that stability. And that mental equilibrium and emotional,
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emotional balance and calm. It is with great pleasure, then
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that I introduce you to herb Hey, our vet, our next guest, on
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the mindful you, podcast. Welcome, welcome, herb to the
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mindful you podcast.
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Herb Avritt: Thank you. It's a pleasure to be here. Thank you
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for inviting me, I'm really excited to be out letting other
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people know what's going on, and, and helping them get back
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in contact with life.
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Alan Carroll: Absolutely, absolutely. And we were talking
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a little a little earlier about experiences of mindfulness. And
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I like to have an understanding if we had to define from your
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point of view of mindfulness, presence, emptiness, beingness,
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whatever word you want to use to describe that, that space of the
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headspace in from your experience, how would you define
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mindfulness and presence?
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Unknown: Well, it was, when you first went on your first read
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the like, the pre questions like, what is mindfulness is
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like, well, that's just being really present with yourself
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that is, and then and then I read the more questions like it
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was all of the terms that I use to define mindfulness, you have
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the question of what is that. And it's really weird, because a
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lot of those terms are part of what's called the woowoo. World,
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the, the the spiritual world, the world, that's not the
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reality that most people see the going to work the driving the
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taking care of the kids and taking care of the house. And
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that that kind of reality is what most people think of, of
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as, as what's real as what's reality is. And mindfulness is
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is more of figuring out you in that space. So instead of
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becoming part of that space, you you mindfully, go into your
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space while you're in those other space. So mindfulness is
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getting in touch with the machine that your spirit is
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riding around in, and paying attention to your vehicle. And,
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and being with your vehicle while you are also driving it
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around in life, in your day to day. So while you are taking
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care of your kids while you are doing your yard work, you can
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also be paying attention to you to your vehicle to how you're
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breathing to how you're moving to what your body is telling
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you. At the same time as you're doing all of these other things.
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And that brings, that brings you back into life in a different
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way. So instead of like life happening to you and around you,
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you become a part of it. And there is there is that spirit,
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it's not spirituality it is you just get more in touch with your
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spirit, you get more in touch with life, you start to
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understand that there is more than just what you're doing
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there is the being doing it as well.
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Alan Carroll: Right, there's the there's the doing this and then
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there's the the being behind the dewiness which is the intention,
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what's the intention of the being and and and when you talk
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about, you know, how do you get to that being quality not caught
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into doing this, which is the manipulation of the things but
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get into the being space in which you're sort of the all you
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talked about pay attention. And boy that's left that's it. good
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one to have a little conversation about. What does
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pay attention for me means wake up. And wake up means observer
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and witness, whatever is going on rather than, rather than you
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are the movie you're watching while you're watching the movie.
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So from my perspective, so that's why I worded that way,
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how do you word it your way
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Unknown: I understand the analogies you're using. Most
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people, when they start talking about mindfulness, they think
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they need to sit still to be quiet, to get rid of all of the
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distractions before they can get into that space. And as you in
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for most people, when they start getting into mindfulness, that
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is a lot easier. But there are like walking meditations, there
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are moving meditations. And as you start to grow into that,
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then that mindfulness and that meditation and that connection
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to life can start to be with you at all the time. Now, that that
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also takes paying attention is also a focus. It's like what
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you're focusing on. So sometimes you're focusing outside of your
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body on the task at hand. And if you can bring that observer in
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that you're talking about that that paying attention, then you
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can focus on you focusing on the task at hand. And that changes,
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that changes pretty much everything about what you're
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doing. And it can, again, we were talking about when we
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started about how I drive and how I started noticing that I
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was driving through postcards, and just seeing this amazing
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beauty all of the time. And that that happens more in a
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mindfulness state because you bring the observer along,
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there's a lot of times where when I actually see these
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beautiful things, I consciously go, Hey, God, this is really
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pretty, I know that you're always seeing everything all the
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time. But come check it out from this perspective, knowing that I
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see you, I consciously invite you in to share this beauty of
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you with you. And as I do that, you know that the observer
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becomes me, I become the observer, but I also become that
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which is being looked at as well. So it's one of the few
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times that that I can see myself as beautiful as I see everything
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else. Because that's one of the hard parts for me is because I
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know how flawed I am, I know how messed up I am, you know, I have
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brain damage, I hurt my head. And it kind of took my life
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apart. And so that made me feel bad about myself. And so it's
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hard for me to see the beautifulness of me that I can
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see everywhere else. So when I can get in that state of
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mindfulness and see the beauty and starting got inviting God
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into witness through me, that is that is when I can start feeling
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that beauty with inside me I can start feeling that worthiness
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inside me. And that is one of the things that sometimes brings
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tears to my eyes, because not only am I loving what I'm
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seeing, I am also feeling that love for myself as well. And so
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mindfulness is getting in that state where, where as you're
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looking out and seeing and doing, then you can also be in
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that same beautiful state. It's like when people go to a museum
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and they see amazing work of art for the first time and it brings
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them to tears. Well, mindfulness can can make that you can see
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that everywhere. It doesn't have to be something that somebody
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does, it can be what is here and what God created and what you
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see in just everyday moments,
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Alan Carroll: hears of joy, tears of bliss is part of that.
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That mindfulness, stillness, place of beingness in which you
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begin to manage the thoughts better, because you can you can
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observe the thoughts now. And the thoughts are painting the
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narrative and if you can change the thoughts that you think you
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put you change the narrative, and all of a sudden, what you
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said is exactly the love and the end divinity in which we are is
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then available to express it through us. And in one of the
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Course of Miracles they talk about, God cannot do for us what
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God cannot do through us and through us means you. You you
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see the beauty all around all around you. And that leads into,
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you know, if someone was interested in mindfulness, which
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you and I are certainly, you know, what are some of the
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benefits of mindfulness? And you you just listed a whole bunch of
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them be like, All right.
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Unknown: Yeah, that that joyful state, that sense of tears, that
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sense of love, that's, that's our normal state. That's, that's
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should be where we are. And all of the stuff that we have the
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society that's going on the, the halfing, to get a job, those are
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all distracting us from that. So mindfulness is a way to get
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underneath that distraction and get back to who we are that that
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what we are that sense of peace and joy. And if you can start to
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get there, then then the falseness of the or the
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falseness of the distraction can start to fall away. And you can
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start to touch that, that beautiful inner part of you. And
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so that, you know, it's not, it's not that you have to go
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find that it's like, you have to start peeling away the
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distractions, because that is what you are. Because once you
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find that, once it's like, holy cow, what was that, like? That
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was you, okay, that wasn't something that happened to you,
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that was you got rid of enough of the stuff around you to say,
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hey, that what was that, that's the inner you, that's there all
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of the time. And you just built this shell and you in society
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has all of these rules and things to basically distract us
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from that, so that we can interact with each other. But,
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but once you start peeling that away, and you can find that
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within, then if you get really good, you know, and it takes
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some people years, years and years, sometimes their whole
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life, to be able to really tap into that. And you know, I can
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do it, sometimes I can't hold on to that space. Because there are
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like said, there's a lot of distractions, and some of them
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seem really awesome. But when you can get rid of those
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distractions and drop into that space, it can be pretty, pretty
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incredible and overwhelming.
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Alan Carroll: And when you drop into that space, her I would, I
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would describe that space as a spiritual spiritual space, a
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space beyond a metaphysical, spiritual, not non judgmental,
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being, everything just is kind of space. And you'd also
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describe yourself as a spiritual coach, is that meaning that you
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take people into that space? When you coach them,
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Unknown: I talk about it, I help them get there. But a lot of
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times, it's something that people have to find themselves.
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And there's a lot of ways there's a lot of entry points to
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start getting to it. There's there's breathwork there's
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there's different actual mindful tech techniques, like MBSR. And
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and I don't remember necessarily all of that what the acronyms
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mean. But I know it's it's mindful. There's lots of
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mindfulness practice practices. And so there's a lot of entry
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points to get to it. But the thing is, is a lot of people
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then start thinking the entry points are, are what that is. So
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people go oh, man, I was doing this breath work. And I felt
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this amazing thing. Instead of saying, Hey, I used breath work
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to do to get through the distractions to find myself,
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they say it's the breath work that did it. No, you are the
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medicine that is what you are. And the breath work is just a
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key that unlocks the door that might or cracks open that window
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to give you a brief glimpse of, of who you are inside of that.
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Alan Carroll: So this is I want to make sure I got that one. So
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the breath work, the conscious breathing, you're saying that.
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So that's the outer manifestation of some inner
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awareness behind it.
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Unknown: Um, more it's, it's, um, it's like opening the window
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or opening the key. It's, it's a practice that you can do to
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navigate through through the distractions and bring yourself
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to a quiet place and catch a glimpse of who you are. So okay,
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the breath work isn't isn't the isn't the thing that's making
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you feel that way. Just like wow, that's a I haven't tried to
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put it this way before. So he's trying to come up with an
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analogy.
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Alan Carroll: I love analogies to I understand the good analogy
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is really
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Unknown: pretty close to the experience the ocean, you get in
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a car, and the car, the car is how you get there. But you're
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driving the car, you're going there, the car isn't taking you
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there, you're taking the car there. And once you get there,
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you get to be the experience. So the breath work is like a car
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that you get into to go visit yourself. Or how does that does
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that sound? Perfect. That sounds like a great analogy.
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Alan Carroll: I like the breath work is is what I noticed is
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that I can't focus on the breathing and be thinking at the
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same time. And it shifts the attention from a disembodied
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from from from the disembodied state of those illusion of those
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thoughts, those distractions, and it shifts it into my body.
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And that becomes embodied, embodied. And that becomes
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grounded and centered and anchored, and all the thoughts
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begin to fade away. And you mentioned the word
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Unknown: body, the mindfulness that because a lot of the
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breathing techniques is is like you feel in your body, can you
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feel your chest rising? Can you feel? Can you feel the moisture
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on your nose as you breathe out? And can you feel it slightly
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dry? As you breathe in? Can you feel the air twirling in your
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sinuses? Can you feel it going down your your esophagus and,
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and as you get into these sensations, and you really get
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into this, what that is, is first takes you into your body,
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and then as your mind clears, then that also fades away, and
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you become the breath. And then after you become the breath,
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then that also fades away. And then you're just kind of left
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there with yourself. And if you can stand that, if you can, if
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you can sit in that space, which the first couple times you do it
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is it's almost agonizing, it's almost painful. And you will do
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anything to get out of that space. Because it it just is
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you're not people aren't ready necessarily to be able to sit in
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that kind of beauty. Because it is because then when they come
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back, it's like what did I lose. So there was this time where,
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where I snowboard, I hurt my body a lot, I had problems with
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my feet. And there was this one time I got a foot massage, I was
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like my foot felt great. It was like finally it stopped hurting.
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And then when the massage was over, like for the next two
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weeks, it was so much more obvious how much my feet hurt,
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but I didn't go back and get another foot massage, because it
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was just so painful, that it was easier to get used to the pain,
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then to get out of it and then go back into it. So a lot of
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times when when pupils first start getting into this
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mindfulness, they find this amazing spot that's just so
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overwhelming. And then when they have to step back into their
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life, it's it's, it's more painful, it's more distracting,
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it's like, I want that. But I have to deal with this. So I
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don't want to see that again. Because coming back from that is
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so traumatic and uncomfortable. So and you know, when when you
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and I first got together, I'm also a psychedelic integration
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coach. And so psychedelics off, oftentimes will put people into
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that, like really, really deeply into that space. And so then
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when they come back out of it, and they have to go back to
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life, it's like, all of that as possible. All of that is there.
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Now I have to deal with all of this crap. Again, I want to go
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back there. And so there's this destabilization, which is why
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again, the integration is, so I'm important in the pre
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coaching so that, you know that that could possibly happen. But
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so that's why, you know, mindfulness, and a lot of these
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techniques, you actually start teaching them, if you're a good
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coach, you start teaching the people this before they go into
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that space. And there's a lot of times where people can get into
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that space without the psychedelics without the
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entheogens without the medicine, because you know, we are the
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medicine, that's just an accelerated and accelerated way
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to get there. And so, you know, if you can get there through the
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breathwork, through the yoga through the mindfulness
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practices, through getting into nature, and getting in touch
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with that kind of life and do it slowly, then you can build your
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tolerance for yourself for that joyfulness. And as you move into
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it slowly and back out and slowly and back out, then you
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can become that more often. You bet. Now, now with psychedelics,
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there's a lot of people who have been doing the breathwork and
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have been been doing this for a long time. And then the
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psychedelic is just like an extension of that and it helps
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them go deeper and understand more. But where I came out, it
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was through desperation with the head injury, my life was falling
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apart. Everything was like just crashing around me. And so I
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needed that reconnection with life. And so that acceleration,
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though, does come with a cost because you get thrown into it,
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and then you get taken out of it. But that does a reset, and
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hey, I know that's possible. Now I can feel again, I can be alive
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again, I can get in touch with with that which I am again,
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because all of this damage, all of this pain took me away from
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that. So getting back in touch with that then gives you the
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space to start working back towards there more naturally, by
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doing your own work. There is no getting away from the work you
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do. You just can't get away from the work a lot of people right
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now. You're smoking, you're cured, your depression, or your
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anxiety. And you know, that's that's not true, you have your
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you have as you get to see it, and you get a space that, Hey, I
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saw that. And now I can start working towards that and start
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moving towards that. So you know, some people can do this
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one time and have this amazing experience reconnection and then
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go for it. But a lot of people, you know, you still have to go
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back and and do the work, you still have to realize that you
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are that spirit inside, and then start trying to contact that
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intentionally, mindfully. Right? Exactly going forward in exactly
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actually make those changes in your life. Because if you're
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living a life, that that causes you to get into that state of
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anxiety and depression, and you you go do these experiences, but
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then you don't change anything, when you get back, well not,
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then that experience just becomes a memory and then it
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becomes a faint memory and everything that was going wrong
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is still going wrong. And those distractions pile up and cover
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you up again. So you have to do the work to get right to get
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through that to take that away so that you can then make the
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changes to get in contact with yourself more often.
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Alan Carroll: And when you do you have do you have a practice
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yourself? If you do on a daily basis?
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Unknown: Um, daily basis? No, I have been trying for years to
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set myself up a daily practice. And I talked about this brain
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damage that I have quite a lot, it makes things really
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interesting for me, there is so much that I see there's so much
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where I'm in contact a lot with myself that how to say this,
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that that it's not necessary, for me quite the same way. But
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then when I start to get out of balance, I do have to step back
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into my practices. And yeah, so I have been challenged in very
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interesting ways. And unfortunately, I think I did
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that to myself. Because so I've been out a lot of these tools
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and techniques since I was a teenager. So 30 or 40 years. And
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And at one point when things were going really well. And I
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thought I had control of it. I basically challenged God is
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like, Hey, God, I'm ready. I think I'm ready for the next
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step. I want to start, you know, and God picked up Mount Hood,
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and hit me over the head with it, and shattered all of my
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practices. So I was I was doing so much things, right. I was
23:57
doing the breathing, I was making my decisions based on
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love. It's like, okay, these are the decisions I have to make.
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What is the most loving decision, it's like, it might
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not necessarily be the most loving for me, but for the
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overall whatever is happening, what decision would be based in
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love. And I was doing the meditations and then I got hit
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in the head really hard. And my business fell apart. I stopped
24:24
being able to do paperwork, I stopped being able to talk on
24:27
the phone, meditation when I would go into a meditation I
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would come out of it in a rage instead of in a peaceful place.
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I would like get quiet and and just like freak out. And and so
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that that is my path now. So getting back from that I'm
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learning so much more how to talk to other people about it.
24:55
So I challenged God to make me useful, and he smacked me upside
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of the head. It is like, Okay, you thought you got it from a
25:02
place of ease. Well try it from this, this, this place where
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you're messed up, you feel like you're broken. And now Now go do
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that now figure out how to help people. And that's kind of where
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I am now. So there's a lot of stuff. There's a lot of these
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practices that I have to sneak up on now. Because if I hit them
25:23
head on, if I was like, I'm going to go here, and I'm going
25:25
to do this like I used to do. It doesn't work for me. But at the
25:31
same time, I can also see where I was in other people's like,
25:36
Hey, I was here at this point, and you can go around it this
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way, oh, hey, I was here at this point. And you can move this way
25:46
and get through it. So it makes me a better coach. But at the
25:50
same time, a lot of the practices that I had aren't as
25:54
effective, so I have to sneak up on it. So that's, this is what
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I'm talking about driving. So when I'm out driving, and I
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start looking at the beauty in the postcards and I start
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putting myself in that space, I have to like, be distracted on
26:07
the outside to be able to get focused on the inside. And a lot
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of people have to be cut all of those distractions out and get
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to the middle, I have to be distracted to kind of get into
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it now. So it's this weird place of, of Wow, how to say it's like
26:31
the guru on the mountain. So they're like these, there's
26:35
these comics, like the Wizard of it of the guy up on the
26:39
mountain, and these people climb up to the mountain and ask him a
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question. And he gives them just like this really simple answer.
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And their mind is blown. And they go down and they live. And
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that guy is up on the mountain. Because he knows how messed up
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all of this stuff is down here and he doesn't fit in that down
26:59
there anymore. And that and that's kind of me, you know,
27:01
fitting into normal life doesn't mean so well anymore. So I'm
27:05
like, I'm like Yoda in the swamp. Yoda got his butt kicked
27:08
went to Degas. And Luke had to go drag him out of the swamp,
27:13
Obi Wan got his butt kicked, went to live on a desert planet
27:17
under a rock. And again, Luke Skywalker had to go find him and
27:21
drag his brother, but and then they helped him, they help the
27:26
warrior go fight that battle. So I'm not the warrior out front
27:31
anymore. I'm not the guy who's leading the charge. I'm kind of
27:35
sitting back. And it's like, the warriors come to me. And it's
27:38
like, Hey, cool, he used the Force. Hey, cool, here's how you
27:42
do this. But that guy out front, being able to be in that space
27:47
leading the charge against the those forces, that's not
27:51
necessarily me in them anymore. So I like can sit back and I can
27:55
help guide people who are still in that fight, as I pretty much
28:00
sit back and work on repairing the damage of getting my own
28:05
butt kicked in that fight.
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Alan Carroll: Yeah, based on your own experiences, you have
28:12
compassion for other people who are on that suffering path. And
28:19
if you can reduce the suffering of others, through your sharing
28:23
of your experiences, seems like a wonderful way to pass the
28:28
time.
28:30
Unknown: Yeah, somebody once asked me how I want to be
28:33
remembered. And and it was, it's actually something that I had
28:39
thought of before, not necessarily how I wanted to be
28:41
remembered, but how I kind of go through life. And to me, I got
28:47
to the point where everything is God. And so you are an
28:51
individualized aspect of God, God had to you know, God is
28:56
everything. How does God experience the universe? How
28:59
does God see what he's done? Well, he separates himself lower
29:04
and lower and lower until he can forget who he is. So I'm a
29:09
little tiny piece of God who has forgotten he is God. But the
29:15
amazing thing about humans and you know, it says it's in the
29:17
Bible we are created in His image. We are little tiny
29:21
fractals of God who have forgotten the the wholeness so
29:26
that we can then experience His creation and show him himself so
29:32
we know so for instance, I know I'm God but I'm not God. But
29:38
knowing I'm god, I can look around and and experience that
29:41
and then relay what he is back to him. And so that's also what
29:46
you are. So in. So we are children of God. So I know that
29:53
your God and that we are going to be sharing experiences in the
29:57
ultimate at the end. So If we ever if there is an afterlife is
30:02
there if there is this ultimate, then when we get together, I
30:05
want to be known as I saw you as God. And I tried to make God's
30:10
experience while interacting with me as positive and as
30:16
healthy as possible. So when I see people, when I meet people,
30:19
when I talk with people like this is a little being of God,
30:22
how can I make God's experience here better at this time? Now,
30:27
am I always successful with that? No, I still get mad, I
30:31
still lose my temper. You know, sometimes when people don't know
30:34
their God, they're inconsiderate, I get caught up
30:37
in the reality of the moment. So you know, I am not perfect. And
30:42
while I say I am God, I am not God. And I cannot. I cannot be
30:49
that all of the time. And also we are here to experience we are
30:53
here to get frustrated and angry and mad and all of that, because
30:58
that's also part of this experience is not just the
31:01
worship, it's not just the seeing how beautiful it is, it's
31:05
also to have this life to have this experience to to be all of
31:10
these things to get my head knocked into have all of these
31:13
problems, and then to find a way to overcome it. But if in that
31:17
when I can find these times where I can, I can be in this
31:21
space, to recognize the divinity and others. And for those
31:26
moments, try and make that person's journey just a little
31:30
bit better, a little bit more comfortable to know that I see
31:34
God in you. And as God is looking back at me to say, Hey,
31:39
I see you I know you're there. And I love you, and I wish the
31:43
best for you. And, you know, because that really is, to me,
31:48
one of the one of the most kindest things that I can do is
31:52
to try and make the experience not not for other humans, but
31:56
for all of these other little beings of God. And that is that
32:00
is what we all are.
32:03
Alan Carroll: What beautiful ways of saying it her very, very
32:07
nice. The you have that? The oneness, how do you you the idea
32:15
is if there's no judgment, it's all oneness. We're all God and,
32:19
and I liked the way you have worded it. It was very, very
32:22
nice. And now we're going to be
32:25
Unknown: gone years yearly to come up with that. And it
32:29
actually kind of started as a joke. And the question that got
32:33
me, that got me there is is there a place where nothing
32:38
exists? Because we use that word a lot. And oh, what goes faster
32:43
than the speed of light? Nothing what's greater than God?
32:46
Nothing. So there's like, is, is there a place where nothing
32:51
exists? And but I, I told you, my wife and I would drive a lot.
32:58
And so as I'm driving, it's like I am driving, I can't, there's
33:01
not a lot else I could do. So I would go into these thought
33:04
processes. So I wouldn't be driving around thinking about
33:07
this. And I got to the point where if nothing exists, there
33:11
can only be one thing that does exist. And it doesn't matter how
33:15
big it is, or how small it is, from the point of view of
33:18
nothing, there's only one thing that exists, because if there's
33:22
two things, if there's nothing between them, then they exist in
33:25
the same space. But if there if there are two things, well, then
33:29
nothing knows that their space, the distance and time that it
33:32
takes to get between the two of them. And it'll draw a circle
33:35
around it, make it one thing and then move away from it at the
33:39
speed of light to make it a single point. And so there can
33:44
only be and I don't know that this is true. This was just my
33:48
this is just the way I was thinking. And so then the joke
33:50
goes something like this. So if my wife and I are driving
33:53
around, and I am contemplating nothing, and she asked me what
33:57
I'm thinking about, and I say nothing. Am I telling her the
34:00
truth?
34:06
Alan Carroll: And that's nothing,
34:07
Unknown: right? Right? Because I'm thinking about nothing. But
34:11
but in the way I'm thinking about nothing, it's something
34:14
and so, with the with the nothing and the one thing that
34:18
exists, the one thing that exists has to come from nothing.
34:23
And that so the way I describe it is that the one thing that
34:29
exists is the body of God, the physicality of everything is the
34:36
body of God, and the nothing from which it arose, is the
34:40
Spirit of God. So what is greater than, than the universe
34:45
or what is faster than what is faster than light? Nothing? Yes,
34:48
it is. It moves away from everything faster, to keep
34:52
everything at the single point what is greater than God?
34:55
Nothing because God the physicality of God came from the
35:00
The Grand spirit of nothing. So nothing is the Spirit of God
35:03
it's eternal is the ocean upon which the first words I am were
35:08
spoken, which created everything. And so the one thing
35:14
that exists is everything. And that's part of what we are, we
35:20
are part of that everything, we are part of that one thing that
35:25
exists, we are an incredibly, incredibly tiny part of that
35:29
floating on an incredibly tiny planet floating on a really
35:33
small sun. If you think about the size of the suns in a
35:37
relatively small galaxy, in this ginormous thing of nothing. So
35:43
it took a long time for God to get away from himself enough to
35:49
be able to then start experiencing the grandness of of
35:54
the everything that he is.
35:58
Alan Carroll: I hear you, I hear you describe, describe sampling
36:04
that is nothing? And how do you describe nothing with something
36:09
and you can't describe nothing with something. But you can
36:15
start to create images. Right that what that one you created
36:20
with the hands in one hand here and one hand here, there's an
36:24
empty space there that you that you created. And so how do you
36:30
create those empty spaces consciously. And then the way
36:35
that a way of doing it is, is our mindfulness techniques,
36:40
which which he raised to some things, and when you can erase
36:44
to some things, then then you're left with nothing's, and like I
36:48
call that space you, which is the fifth element, the fifth
36:51
element is space. So you're in you're embedding the fifth
36:54
element in the physical world, by creating those gaps or pauses
36:59
between the somethings. And you become more spacious when you do
37:05
that.
37:06
Unknown: And nothing is also incredibly, incredibly small. So
37:11
they, they tried to find a smallest particle of matter,
37:15
right. So what they did is they took an electron, and if you
37:18
look at a at a atom, it's a proton and an electron floating
37:23
around it. And when they tried to look at it, it's mostly empty
37:27
space. So then what they did is they took the smallest thing,
37:29
they took the electron, and they broke it. And they found even
37:33
tinier particles. And even within that, it was mostly empty
37:38
space. And when they broke up, even this particles of that, it
37:42
was still smaller particles with mostly nothing. And it was so
37:50
more space. So even with all of the stuff that we actually see,
37:55
or we think we see, it is mostly made up of nothing. Again, the
38:00
particles that create it are so small, and the space between
38:05
it's so big, like the distance between the neutron and the
38:10
electron in an atom is greater than the distance between the
38:13
Sun and the Earth and the outer planet. So it's like, there's
38:17
there's so much space in everything. It's mostly made up
38:22
of nothing. And it's just these weird viewpoints that we have
38:25
that make it something. So how does God know the every thing
38:30
because that nothingness between everything is also God, but at
38:35
the same time, he's moving away from everything. And so there's
38:38
only the one thing and it's just this really weird way my brain
38:42
works that comes out that so this happened
38:46
Alan Carroll: after herb did this happen after your accident
38:49
that you had this breakthrough in consciousness? Are is, is you
38:53
know, medicines that do it? Um,
38:57
Unknown: that's a difficult question for me. So when I had
39:02
my brain scan, it came back as a series of traumatic brain
39:05
injuries. So the final accident was the straw that broke the
39:09
camel's back. But if you think about that analogy, if you added
39:13
one more straw to the candle that broke its back. That candle
39:17
was way overweight and he was hurt and he was in pain. He was
39:21
he was done. I had fallen out of trees. When before I was five. I
39:28
remember my I remember this when I was running across a
39:32
playground and I ran behind a swing set and got hit by
39:36
somebody swinging went flying smacked. The head had to be
39:39
taken to the hospital. I've fallen off Have I fallen off the
39:43
old slides. You know, when when we were kids. We had these big
39:45
huge tall metal slides. And I fell on out of slides. I got hit
39:50
in the head with a baseball bat. I got hit in the head with a
39:52
baseball and this was all before I was eight years old because I
39:55
left California to Oregon when I was eight years old. In those
40:00
those five or six I just listed there were all before I was
40:03
eight. When I got into where I in the Oregon, it's like I
40:08
played all sports. I played basketball, baseball, football.
40:13
Again, bad hops got hit in the head with baseballs, footballs,
40:18
I knocked myself out a couple of times. And then I got into
40:21
college, and I started playing or I started snowboarding. And
40:26
the first time I went snowboarding, I came home with a
40:28
concussion and whiplash. And I was so messed up, I couldn't get
40:32
out of bed for a week, I had to like pull myself to the edge and
40:35
then like roll out because I couldn't sit up because of all
40:38
and I was so hurt that I bought all of my gear, my snowboard, my
40:42
boots, my bindings, everything before I went up again. And it
40:45
was probably six or seven years before I bought a helmet. And
40:48
then once I got a helmet, I still concussed myself like two
40:51
or three times snowboarding. So it wasn't it wasn't a single
40:57
incident. So I talked about how I was into a lot of this stuff
41:01
since I was a teenager. So I was open to Reiki at 16. I started
41:06
doing the Merkava meditation in my early 20s, I did healing
41:11
touch, I did the bars, you know, I ran the gamut. Because I had,
41:16
I had superpowers when I was when I was a kid. I had an
41:21
ability to touch heal people, I, when I would start a
41:26
conversation with somebody, and then something would click and I
41:29
would start caring on both sides of the conversation. And I would
41:32
start talking about stuff that happened to them while they were
41:34
when they were children and, and how they could work through
41:37
issues with their parents. And then when I was and I didn't do
41:41
that intentionally, just kind of would take me over sometimes.
41:44
And my wife who I was dating at the time, she was around me the
41:50
most had happened to her the most. And it would make her cry
41:52
sometimes of how accurate and thorough what I was talking
41:57
about was, and it really kind of scared both of us. So I put that
42:02
away. I still have it, I can still do it. But I've put so
42:06
many locks on it. That is really difficult for me to bring that
42:11
out intentionally. And sometimes it's painful now. And so I put
42:16
that away. And then I started exploring, what what was that?
42:21
What was I doing? And so I went, I would go look at this kind of
42:26
modality and people and I would start learning about that and
42:30
say, and that someone would say, oh, yeah, this is all you need
42:33
this is it. And it's like, well, that doesn't explain what I did.
42:36
And so if you're saying this is all there is, then then you
42:39
can't be correct, because that doesn't explain what I did. And
42:42
I would like walk away from that, and then move to the next
42:45
thing. And then that same thing would happen is like, Oh, well,
42:48
this is all that you need. This is all there is I was like, No,
42:50
that doesn't explain me. So I would leave that and go to the
42:54
next thing. And after doing that for about 20 years, I got into a
42:59
conversation like this. And I realized this, like, you know
43:01
what, I took the truth of that I took the truth of this, I took
43:04
the truth of that. And I kind of made a grander narrative for
43:09
myself that that kind of contains all of this. And I
43:12
still in all of that never necessarily found out what it
43:16
was that I did or what I was. And then as I did start to get
43:22
close to that, then the straw that broke the camel's back. And
43:25
it was a really, it was a really bad hit. I was going down the
43:29
mountain as fast as I could. It was at the end of the day, I was
43:32
tired. And I did what's called high side I was on my toe edge,
43:36
I hit a bump, my heels rolled back, I caught the back edge.
43:40
And then I'm flying through the air down a really steep hill,
43:44
looking at the clouds. Actually, I actually have a story written
43:48
about oh, looking at the clouds, watching them peacefully drifts
43:53
through the sky. And thinking to myself, Wow, this is really
43:58
going to hurt when I hit the ground who really, really long
44:03
time to consider that. And it's like I also thought there's the
44:07
stories about how drunk people are the only people who survive
44:10
a crash and it's because they're all limp and they don't tense
44:13
up. So it's like, okay, can I just relax. So when this when I
44:16
do finally hit, I can come in. And I remember okay, just relax,
44:23
breathe, relax, and then pain. I hurt my shoulder, I hurt my hip.
44:31
I started seeing a chiropractor and an acupuncturist for that.
44:36
And during that my business started falling apart. I stopped
44:42
being able to do a lot of simple tasks. But I was more concerned
44:46
with the body damage and I didn't really consider how badly
44:50
I had hurt my head. And this was before all of the concussion
44:54
protocols and all of the stuff that that people talk about now.
44:58
So it wasn't The first time I hit my head, but it was
45:01
definitely God telling me to slow down. And I'm still, I'm
45:07
still recovering from that. But in that recovery, you know, I've
45:13
had to start talking to people. And I talk this way, I've always
45:18
been this way, you can go back to the people that I was with in
45:21
high school, and they will tell you this strange stories of
45:24
herb. When I worked at Intel, they call them herb isms,
45:27
because I would, there would be conversations, and I would come
45:31
in with these weird points of view. So I was always kind of
45:35
like this. But that last hit, took me out, slowed me down,
45:40
brought my life down to where I pretty much only have three or
45:43
four had three or four people in my life that I talked to, which
45:46
was my wife, and my children. And then, and then as I started
45:50
to come back to life to come back out of this, then people
45:54
started saying, hey, the stuff that you're talking about is
45:57
different. And I need to hear more of that. Or, hey, you know,
46:02
you're talking about this, and I tried to implement that. And
46:04
wow, it did amazing stuff for me. So these baling wire, and
46:09
string and duct tape that I have holding myself together, people
46:13
see that and can take these little things that I'm doing and
46:17
can like, apply them to their life, and they like, boom, take
46:21
off, and it's like, wow, I didn't know this was possible.
46:23
And it's like, sometimes that almost kind of makes me feel
46:26
bad, because it's like, I wish I wish I could, these things that
46:30
I was doing helped me that much. But it feels like they're just
46:35
barely holding me together. But as people, you know, take these
46:40
things, then they're if they're not as broken as I am,
46:43
everybody's broken, but not everybody's as broken as I am,
46:46
they're able to take these little strings and baling wire
46:50
and tips that are holding me together and use it to
46:53
accelerate their life. And so I'm I'm now trying to be more
46:59
sharing of this, bring this out more, I'm doing these podcasts,
47:03
I've become a coach. So I went through a coaching certification
47:08
program called being true to you, I started to do that as
47:12
part of my own healing after a psychedelic journey. And I fell
47:18
in love with the community, it so many people more understand
47:23
what I talk about. And they're looking for tools like this to
47:28
help their clients. And so I tend to be more of a really good
47:32
resource for these people. And I bring something to the table
47:38
that I still don't necessarily know what it is because like I
47:41
said, for me, it's duct tape and string and little bits holding
47:45
me together. But for them, it's like tools that they may have
47:49
forgotten or they don't remember, they don't know the
47:51
full depth of how they work. And because I've gone through so
47:55
many of these experiences that I'm able to somehow convey this
48:01
to them, even though it feels to me like I'm barely holding it
48:04
together, they see these things as like, Wow, that's amazing.
48:07
Let's show that to people. And I'm able to help people that
48:11
way. So it makes me kind of feel better about about, about how,
48:17
how messed up I am. But not because, again, I get to help
48:24
other people come more into their spirituality into their
48:29
life and to see life as what it could be.
48:34
Alan Carroll: instead. Yeah, you talked about being God and you
48:41
know, God can't be messed up. So the ego can be messed up. But
48:44
the God God can't be messed up. You're where God so you have to
48:48
sort of laugh at the thoughts of ya messed up, right? That's
48:51
That's funny, right?
48:52
Unknown: That's actually one of the one of the funny things I
48:54
say is like, the only thing that's not perfect in this
48:57
entire universe is my understanding of perfection. God
49:02
doesn't mean there isn't a single atom out of place in the
49:07
entire universe. So how come I feel so out of place? So the
49:12
only thing that's not perfect, is my understanding of what
49:16
perfection is.
49:17
Alan Carroll: That's beautiful. That's very, very clear. That
49:21
that's a postcard. Herb, you want to put that when a post is
49:24
not done. When you take pictures of postcards. You can put words
49:27
in that postcard. Yeah, go ahead and say it one more time for the
49:31
audience. They say that one more time for the audience. And then
49:34
we're never going to complete.
49:36
Unknown: Okay, so, you know, everything in the universe is
49:40
absolutely perfect. Everything is exactly where it's supposed
49:43
to be. There is not an atom out of place. God doesn't make
49:46
mistakes. So the only thing that isn't perfect in all of the
49:50
universe, is my understanding of what perfection is.
49:57
Alan Carroll: And understanding is made up of the thoughts that
49:59
you that you think and if you can begin to erase the thoughts,
50:03
you return to that mindful space of nothingness. Well, Herb, it's
50:08
been a joy talking to work. Go ahead, finish it up.
50:11
Unknown: Okay. And even that flawed perfection that that,
50:14
that the flawed perception of what perfection is, that's also
50:19
intentional, because it then allows me to show up and bring
50:26
these ideas to other people who think that stuff is broken. So,
50:31
yep, yep. So you can,
50:33
Alan Carroll: you can make that connection and create that
50:36
common ground, which makes them more trusting and more open to
50:39
hear the the wisdom, the urbanism that you really are,
50:44
you are, you are sharing your you've, you've traveled
50:50
somewhere, you have experienced something, and you're not coming
50:54
back on the trail, looking at other people who are on the
50:57
trail. And you're saying, Hey, I've been up the trail aways, if
51:01
you do this, this and this, it will accelerate you up the
51:04
trail. And so that is a that is like a metaphysician that a
51:08
teacher, I want to I want to thank you for being on the
51:12
mindful you podcast. Also, if people want to connect with you,
51:17
we'll have all your social media in the notes, is there is there
51:23
something happening that you would like them to connect with
51:25
you or ways to connect to you what's the best way to connect
51:28
with you.
51:30
Unknown: Now, probably the best way right now would be on my
51:32
Facebook page. And you know, I have the free gift, which is a
51:36
call with me. So a half an hour or an hour usually ends up going
51:40
a lot longer, because I have a weird sense of time. So unless
51:43
something is after the end of it, I just keep talking or
51:47
listening, whichever is more appropriate at the time. So you
51:50
know, set up a call with me, or hook up with me on Facebook,
51:54
follow me on Facebook. And and let me know you're there. And
51:59
we'll we'll keep going.
52:01
Alan Carroll: Excellent, excellent. Herb, it's, it's, you
52:05
are a traveler on the path. I love those things that you
52:10
shared with with the audience. And also I liked it because I
52:15
have I understand the nothings into some things. And so I It's
52:20
nice to meet somebody who you can pass the football to, and
52:24
they'll be able to catch the football and pass it back again.
52:27
So I sense a real partnership and in our in our journey
52:31
together. And I just know that there's, there's more, there's
52:36
more for you to say. So I'd like to invite you back at some time
52:39
in the future just to continue our conversation, because it
52:42
really does make a difference.
52:45
Unknown: I'd love to be here. And while it is great to be able
52:48
to play catch with someone who knows what they're doing. It's
52:52
also really awesome to teach people to start playing catch so
52:55
that you have more people to play with in the future. And so
52:59
I'm absolutely good. Starting to is to help people learn how to
53:02
start playing that game of catch.
53:05
Alan Carroll: Beautifully said I love it. Well let's let's
53:07
continue the game then. Thank you very much. Thank you again