Latest / Run Mountain Peaks / Road Fitness Translating to Trails with Ryan Fournier

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Road Fitness Translating to Trails with Ryan Fournier · Run Mountain Peaks

0:00
OK, welcome back to another episode of Run Mountain Peaks.
0:03
Today we have another guest on the podcast, Ryan Fournier.
0:08
Ryan is a friend and he is a road and trail crusher.
0:13
Dude is fast. He through hike the AT in 2024
0:18
and came back, has just been ripping around the trails in New
0:21
England ever since he hit a sub 16 five KA 640 Pemi loop, 639
0:29
Pemi loop. He did some gravel bike racing.
0:31
He's done some Rd. stuff. Just a crusher.
0:34
And so it was a great episode. Definitely give it a listen.
0:38
We started out talking about some of the half marathon drama
0:43
over the past few weeks. So we recorded it before the US
0:47
half marathon championships got rectified and those three that
0:51
were left off LED off course. They are are now podium
0:56
finishers and they all got paid and they're all going to compete
1:00
at the world stage. So it's all been rectified.
1:02
I think the US track and field got grilled for the last two
1:06
weeks. So we just did a little bit of
1:07
grilling. Nothing crazy, but we we char.
1:10
Will. Grill them a little bit.
1:13
And then we talked about the Hampton Half Marathon, which
1:16
Ryan was signed up for. He was looking to PR, so we ran
1:20
a 120 half marathon last year. He was looking to go much faster
1:24
this year and they cancelled it for for because there was lots
1:29
of snow on the coast. And so we talked about that.
1:33
He attempted to do it on his own terms and it just didn't work
1:38
out too fast for a treadmill. You got to listen to the story
1:42
to see what happened. But so we didn't get his effort
1:45
in, but we talked about all that stuff and then we went into his
1:48
background. We did some training talk stuff.
1:51
Ryan's a coach, he knows what he's talking about.
1:53
He's into the weeds on all the the training theory stuff.
1:58
And so, yeah, it was a good interview.
2:00
I'll link where you can find Ryan in the episode.
2:04
And yeah, give it a listen. Stay tuned.
2:07
And then after the episode I'm going to do a little bit of
2:10
trail conditions talk because we have the big warm up this
2:14
weekend. I went on on the trails
2:17
yesterday, so I'm going to do a little bit of a trail report.
2:20
We'll talk about the trails being destroyed this weekend and
2:23
then I'm going to do a hot take on trail condition post holing
2:28
messing up trails. So we'll do that at the end.
2:31
And then I actually have a funny story from when I first got into
2:35
hiking that the trail conditions stuff kind of reminded me of.
2:39
So I'll I'll tell that story because it was kind of funny
2:43
looking back. So we'll do that at the end.
2:45
So that's what we have today. And 62nd training tip for you
2:49
guys, tracking your speed workouts just like you would
2:54
track your mileage or look at a Strava chart.
2:58
Everyone loves to see that a Strava chart kind of like a nice
3:01
graph building up into the right.
3:03
But you should also be tracking how fast you're running your
3:07
speed workouts. Whatever structured speed or
3:10
hard efforts you're doing to get ready for a race or to progress
3:14
in your training block, that should be getting faster over
3:17
time. And I think it's one thing that
3:19
people don't track as specifically, I have a have a
3:24
Word document of just all of my speed workouts on there.
3:28
And I can see progress week over week, month over month, year
3:31
over year. And it, it just helps kind of
3:34
like force that progressive overload if I do a speed workout
3:38
two months ago, right? And I'm going to do the exact
3:41
same speed workout today and I'm fitter.
3:46
I am going to be looking to push those paces or that distance or
3:50
whatever it is. I'm going to make sure that I
3:52
progress on top of it. And I think it's just a good way
3:56
to I, I think improve your, your mental fortitude during speed
4:02
workouts and during race efforts.
4:04
If you know that you did X amount when you were a little
4:07
bit less fit, you're going to just dig a little bit deeper and
4:09
it's just going to force you to get better.
4:11
So if you're doing speed workouts, you should be doing
4:14
them and just track them, push it harder over time and and get
4:19
that improvement in your speed 'cause you need it.
4:21
But OK, that was the that was the tip today.
4:24
Hope you enjoy the episode here is Ryan.
4:29
OK, Ryan, what is going on? Not much man.
4:33
Happy to be here in Andrew's apartment with maybe the last
4:37
episode in or only episode. Yeah.
4:41
Have you made anything in here? No, actually, no.
4:43
Maybe like an old private YouTube video.
4:46
But yeah, you may be the first and last person to film a
4:49
podcast here, so Congrats. Yeah, Not saying much, though.
4:53
There might be mold in here. Yeah.
4:56
There, there may be mold in here.
4:57
Andrew may be maybe getting sick.
5:00
Yeah, I don't know. We'll see.
5:02
All right, So we have some half marathon talk that we got to get
5:06
to. So I'm sure a lot of people have
5:08
heard the US world champs or whatever.
5:13
US champs. US Yeah, Half marathon.
5:16
Champs US Half marathon Champs Drama.
5:19
The first three get let off course.
5:22
That's crazy. I yeah, I saw that in my first.
5:27
I mean, that's just heartbreaking for for the top
5:31
three women I know that generally like there is often no
5:37
recourse for like the whoever is hosting the event.
5:40
It's like what, what do you do? Do you give it to the the three
5:43
who came in one 2-3 or do you rectify the situation and say
5:47
no, these three women would have counted 123.
5:50
So it's a. And there's no set, there's no
5:53
do overs or anything. Right?
5:54
Like they? Yeah.
5:55
That's that's the team. Like whoever came in the top
5:58
three on the podium was going to be the team that goes to the
6:01
world champs. So it's like, yeah, I mean, I
6:04
don't know. What do you do?
6:06
Was there so this is my thought, 'cause like in ultras you
6:10
usually it's like you're in the middle of nowhere like you have
6:13
to like be sure about what trail you're on, but no one is loading
6:17
up GPX files to run half marathon.
6:19
So like it was there any? Like has this ever happened
6:22
before? I'm oh, I'm sure it's happened
6:25
more like no doubt. But the, the, I think the issue
6:31
is like you kind of have a convoy for the, the race
6:33
leaders. And that was the whole thing to
6:36
begin with is you have these three cars.
6:39
There's like the, the camera car and there's like a pace car
6:42
generally that just kind of follows them.
6:44
And then you have like the cameras in the back so that
6:46
everyone can watch the race. And then there's like a police
6:49
escort going with it. And I mean, if you're in a race
6:54
and especially 1/2 marathon where like, I'm just thinking
6:57
from their perspective, like the effort level's so high
7:00
redlining, you're pinning it threshold for an hour, that's
7:03
it. That's the race.
7:04
You assume that this lead car is there is gonna go the right
7:07
direction. They're leading me the, the
7:09
right way and from what I understand there was like an
7:12
intersection in the course where like they could have, they could
7:17
have turned the right way and the car went straight.
7:20
It was like a, it wasn't a 180, but maybe like a 90 or 120.
7:25
The car went straight through it.
7:26
They followed the car and yeah, they I think they maybe lost
7:32
like 2 minutes and the fourth place person lost like 20 or 30
7:36
seconds, so. Yeah.
7:38
Dude, it's so crazy, especially when you see like one of the
7:41
posts, I saw some some lady who was winning, I don't know the
7:44
names like very well, but she was like, I'm just trying to go
7:48
back to what it felt like when I was sure that I was going to be
7:51
the United States half marathon champion and going to compete
7:56
for the world's. And now I just that will not
7:57
happen. Was that Jess McLean?
7:59
Did you say? Yeah, I think yeah, yeah, yeah.
8:01
She was just like, I like, Can you imagine?
8:03
You work for however long you put in so much hours, you're
8:07
going to be the like representing the country at the
8:10
world stage, best in the country.
8:12
And then you get some Uber driver took a wrong turn.
8:15
Seriously. Yeah, and.
8:18
It's not funny, actually, I'm laughing, but that's like, it's
8:20
a horrible yeah. You're saying though, like I
8:23
don't think it's on them at all. Like it's, I think it's
8:27
completely on the the race organizers.
8:29
And I know that just reading the kind of articles that came out
8:34
about it, the the Atlanta Track Club, their CEO kind of took
8:40
responsibility for it. But the issue is that USATF said
8:47
there's nothing they can do, which is kind of, yeah, I kind
8:50
of already explained that. But like, there's no recourse
8:53
because they can't tell the three women that finished 123.
8:56
Like, we're not going to give you your prize first.
8:59
I mean, they, yeah, they finished it.
9:01
So I think what they're going to end up having to do is pay
9:04
everyone. And I don't know what happens to
9:07
the positions now, like at the the 1st place woman.
9:10
I I don't know her her name, but she was saying it doesn't feel
9:14
like she won. I know.
9:16
So it's like what? You want the spot.
9:18
I know, but all yeah, so it's like all bad stuff and yeah, the
9:21
everyone is like the US track and field is under so much heat.
9:25
I'm yeah, interesting to see what will happen.
9:27
But yeah, big controversy. And then more locally.
9:31
This is more personal to you. Very personal.
9:33
It was a Hampton right. Hampton Half Marathon cancels.
9:38
Yeah, they cancelled it on, I think it was Wednesday.
9:42
They sent out the cancellation e-mail.
9:44
Yeah, Was it supposed to be on Saturday or Sunday?
9:47
It was supposed to be on Sunday. Yeah.
9:49
So I've run this race the past two years.
9:54
So it's, I don't know, I feel like you kind of get in that
9:58
groove with races sometimes and like, it's just a good test of
10:02
fitness from year to year because the same course every
10:04
time. I was pretty pumped to go back
10:07
this year. I thought I would have, I don't
10:11
know. I I thought I would have been
10:12
like out in the front of the race, which would have been
10:14
cool. And this was like you're, you're
10:16
racing a little bit, so you've been training, you had a.
10:18
Big block. Dedication.
10:20
Yeah, I I took a little break after I ran a 5K.
10:25
Like I actually trained for my local Turkey Trot.
10:27
Let's go in. Merrimack And then I took a
10:31
little break kind of through December.
10:33
I don't really like to train through that anymore.
10:35
I think we were talking about this earlier, but it's just
10:38
your. Holiday sickness, Family Travel
10:42
getting. Sick.
10:43
Yeah. You're traveling a lot and it's
10:45
hard to like, get some traction. So I took a little break and
10:49
then January 1st ish I started, yeah, I started up kind of
10:56
getting back into workouts, training for this.
10:58
So I was super excited. I didn't register until actually
11:05
last Saturday. Yeah.
11:08
So the set like basically a week before I held off.
11:11
Oh, I didn't know that, but you knew you were going to run.
11:13
It I knew I was going to run it. I my concerns were a that it was
11:16
going to get cancelled. It's just been so cold here.
11:18
It's been like the snow's stuck around.
11:23
It hasn't been like a exceptional snow year, but it's
11:25
stuck. Around and so that's why they
11:27
cancelled right just snow. Yeah, we just like, I guess,
11:29
Hampton, the town of Hampton forced them to cancel the event.
11:34
Yeah. OK.
11:35
So the town of Hampton, I didn't know that so but they cancel the
11:38
events and no, no do overs, no make UPS, no money back.
11:43
What do we think about all this? This is what we're talking They.
11:45
Give they give three options, right?
11:47
So the first option virtual, I don't know, I've never done
11:52
that. Like I wasn't into like virtual.
11:54
I didn't even know what that means.
11:55
But apparently you just run it on your own.
11:57
And you just send and submit your file.
12:00
Your file whatever. So I wasn't I mean, I wasn't
12:05
into that. I was going to my first thought
12:09
was I was going to do something solo and just try and make
12:13
something out of it, but I don't think I was ever going to submit
12:16
it virtually. Second option was there's a half
12:20
marathon in 5K called the Margarita half Marathon, and
12:24
that's in May. I, I've never heard of it, but
12:27
it's under the same umbrella of, I think they're called calibrate
12:31
or something. They're, so they were offering
12:35
to transfer your BIP to that race.
12:37
But for me, like I have a ton of stuff already like year after
12:42
the, for the year. So that's not really an option
12:45
and where they want to go there. And the third option was they
12:47
take a portion of your entry fee and they donate it to charity
12:54
in, in like Portsmouth or something.
12:57
I I don't know where. But you don't get it the rest of
13:00
it back. So they donate a little bit and
13:03
then they keep all of your money.
13:05
And so. How is no money back an option?
13:08
Well, not an option. Here's what they said is they
13:13
they need to pay for the bibs, they need to pay for the medals
13:15
and stuff like that. So all that money is already
13:18
spent by the time that the race comes around.
13:22
And like I, I can understand that it makes sense, right?
13:24
Like you're buying all these materials to put on the event
13:28
and like. Yes, some something and
13:31
something about like the waiver are you know that you signed up
13:34
that I'm sure legally they have the right to do so.
13:36
Absolutely, yeah, I know they they do.
13:38
So I, yeah, I know it sucked. I was pretty pumped to go there.
13:46
I love racing Like I, I just, I think it's really fun and I
13:51
just, it's like a good, a good training session, you know,
13:55
it's. Easy.
13:56
It's easier to go harder too when you have other people just
13:58
like. There's some good energy at race
14:01
events generally, especially if there was going to be like
14:04
usually there's at least a couple fast guys.
14:07
I think in 2024 there was a guy who ran like 105 there which is
14:12
smoking fast are. There any was there is there
14:15
prize money? How big of the event is it?
14:17
Because. It's increase in size every
14:20
year. There's no prize money, but
14:22
they'll comp your entry for the next year if you come to the top
14:24
three. OK.
14:25
So that was a little incentive. How much was the entry?
14:29
It was one O 5. One O 5, yeah, yeah.
14:31
So yeah, I mean, bummed that to start the kind of year like
14:40
that. Yeah, I wish they had another
14:42
option like they they could have found like some big private or
14:46
like corporate parking lot at least for like anyone who wants
14:49
to come out. Just let us run around, let
14:51
these people run like they're all riled up, you know?
14:54
Yeah. That's a good idea.
14:57
I ended up sending them an e-mail actually, though, because
15:00
I'd registered like I had specifically waited to make sure
15:03
that they weren't going to cancel.
15:04
It sounds like there's no way 'cause the, the snow bank, I
15:07
mean, it has snowed a lot here. And I figured like, the snow
15:10
banks are already pretty high. We did get that one storm on
15:14
Monday last week. I think that maybe had like it
15:19
was, it was decent size, like 6 to 8 inches, you know, like
15:22
Rhode Island got hammered. But I figured after that they
15:26
didn't cancel it after that. So I was like we're good.
15:31
I sent them an e-mail and luckily they actually refunded
15:35
me. Oh, they did.
15:36
So close my money wasn't spent yet.
15:38
Oh wow. Shout out to Paul from
15:42
Calibrate. I I kind of feel bad now 'cause
15:44
like I do know people that yeah, that are either like ran the
15:48
virtual or like move their thing.
15:50
But yeah, I was able to get the. Refund there.
15:54
Well, you were thinking about it a little bit.
15:56
So they hadn't spent your money yet.
15:57
Yeah, it was still, yeah, in the banks.
16:00
But yeah, all around, I'm sure people were were mad about it.
16:04
So. But tell me you were going to go
16:06
do an effort. Yeah, yeah.
16:09
Kind of like a solo, not virtual, just to like test
16:11
yourself. Yeah, so I had.
16:14
I was talking to Clark Plummer, who?
16:17
Shout out, Yeah, shout out to Clark.
16:19
He and his fiance now. Oh yeah.
16:23
Congrats, Clark. Congrats.
16:27
They, they were going to go run that marathon or half marathon
16:30
too. So they mapped out a course in
16:34
Londonderry. I it was a little too hilly for
16:36
my liking. I think I just wanted to get
16:39
something like super flat and super fast.
16:41
'Cause you were looking to like PR, get a get like a as fast as
16:45
you could. Yeah, I know.
16:46
I was, I was planning on running like in the 111 to 113 range,
16:49
which last year I ran 120. So it would have been like
16:55
significant and pretty fast for me, but.
16:59
And that Hampton course is flat, right?
17:02
Like it's by the coast. Yeah, I know it's super flat.
17:04
The biggest issue there is the wind, 'cause it's coming right
17:07
off the water. But I mean, last year it was
17:10
very, very windy. But yeah, it's, it's like 1, I
17:14
think 100 foot climb. There's only like 180 feet of
17:17
gain in the whole course, which is really, really flat.
17:19
It's it's a a great course if you're looking at like PR or
17:23
anything. And it's cold.
17:24
It's in March, so I kind of, I was maybe going to go do that
17:30
with that course with Clark. And then he sent me a file of
17:35
someone who ran one in Goffstown on, I don't know, it was, it was
17:43
over by it was basically from New Boston to Goffstown.
17:47
OK, yeah. And it was, I was going to say
17:49
the only flat in Goffstown, at least around here, is like if
17:52
you lap Glen Lake kind of or if you go yeah, out towards New
17:56
Boston. I'm.
17:56
Sure. There was like it was like right
17:58
along our river the whole time. So I went out and I kind of on
18:02
Friday I I was going to basically just do like my shake
18:06
out run and I wanted to just like scout the area.
18:09
I think that road might be like a 40 mile an hour Rd.
18:12
I know I bike. It yeah, it's fast.
18:14
And the the camber of the road was kind.
18:19
It was kind of steep at times, so I wasn't too interested.
18:23
So I had like a local route that I was planning on doing in
18:26
Amherst and it was just back and forth in the same Rd.
18:30
So I was going to do, I was going to do 6 back and forth on
18:33
the same road and. Mental strength.
18:37
Yeah, mental strength just grinded out effort, not very
18:40
fun. And my I think the writing was
18:44
on the wall already. Like that mentally for me was
18:47
going to be really hard, but I I was like, I'm just going to do
18:51
it. Like what?
18:52
It doesn't matter at this point. 'Cause you train, you taper like
18:55
you just want. To get ready, I was already
18:57
tapered, so I just wanted to go for it.
18:59
But so I wake up, I'm committed. I wake up at 7:00.
19:04
I take my bicarb at 7:30. So that's how you know you're
19:10
in. You're like, yeah, yeah, I'm in,
19:12
I'm in it. And then I drank double espresso
19:15
like 45 minutes before and I was ready to go.
19:19
But then we had this like, weird.
19:21
I was looking, I was looking at the weather pretty closely.
19:26
It didn't say it was going to snow, but we had this weird like
19:29
like snow squaw that came through and it just made outside
19:33
look treacherous. Kind of it was enough that the
19:36
snow was heavy enough that it like coated the road.
19:39
And so that kind of threw me for a loop And I'm like, Oh my God.
19:42
Like I've run through or I've done most of my workouts on just
19:46
like snowy, slushy, icy roads the whole time.
19:49
And it's just not fun, especially when you're running
19:52
fast. It's really going to run fast.
19:53
So I was at the last moment, I changed it.
19:58
I was like, I'm going to go run on the treadmill.
20:00
It's not going to be real. Don't care.
20:02
You just want the effort. Yeah, yeah.
20:03
You just OK. You're just trying to get out.
20:05
You're shaking, by the way. Yeah, like cracked out on
20:09
caffeine. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
20:11
I was like going crazy just because I wouldn't want to wait.
20:15
I want to wait like I had already done all like all my
20:19
like race prep stuff. So I thought you said it was
20:21
shaking right now. I was like, dude, no, it might
20:23
be dude. This.
20:26
This hit a cord in me but. No, because when I go to do
20:31
workouts and I like it, it's like a big workout.
20:33
I set myself up. If you do buy carb caffeine, I
20:36
literally I'll get there. If I like forget my shoes or
20:38
something. It's like I'm like, Oh my gosh,
20:40
what do I do right now? I couldn't.
20:41
Even move and I don't use caffeine outside of my training.
20:45
Yeah, me neither. So when I use it, it's like I'm
20:49
like, I might be like, I'm ready to go, so I throw all my shit in
20:55
the car. Can I swear on this bug?
20:56
Yeah, OK. Sorry.
20:58
Yeah, go for it. I throw all my shit in the.
21:00
Car and I go to the Y and I'm I have this treadmill I really
21:04
like there the Y Merrimack Nashua Nashua yeah it's like
21:07
facing the the glass so I can like look outside pretend
21:11
you're. Out there, Yeah, I pretend I'm
21:12
out there. And it was still snowing pretty
21:13
hard at this point. So I was like, I made a good
21:16
decision and I hop on the treadmill and put it to 519
21:24
piece. I think it was like 11.3 miles
21:26
an hour, 1%. And I was like, I'm just going
21:29
to do it on here, it'll be OK. And I intentionally said it a
21:34
little faster because I knew it's just easier on the
21:38
treadmill. Yeah, I don't.
21:39
I don't. I don't do too much fast if I'm
21:41
like a flat grade, but I never, I don't know.
21:44
I'm not a treadmill person, so I don't yeah, I don't know how it
21:48
translates. It's it's different.
21:50
It's definitely. Different, and I think I'm not
21:53
too into the treadmill stuff either unless it's like I like
21:57
doing uphill uphill. I should say I do a ton of
21:59
uphill tread, but I just mean like, yeah, like I never have
22:02
done like flat workouts on a tread, right?
22:04
I think I was. Put in that situation a lot this
22:06
year just because of the snow. Yeah, it was tough because I
22:09
mean, we don't have maybe like, I don't know, does Saint E's
22:12
have a track over here? Do they have a track?
22:15
And I run through there a lot, but I don't think they have a
22:17
track now because a lot of the outdoor.
22:19
Tracks here don't get plowed, they just don't like nobody's
22:22
using them. The closest one is down.
22:24
The Barnes Park at Goff Sound, which in the winter I don't
22:27
really go to and then yeah, I don't know, Manchester W might,
22:31
but yeah, that's a bit far from. Me, but so you, so you.
22:35
Anyway, there's no good track nearby.
22:37
Yeah, there's no good. Track.
22:38
So I was relegated to the treadmill and had been running
22:42
on it. So what do they say?
22:43
Is the 1% supposed to equalize everything?
22:46
Yeah. So generally.
22:47
What I do is when I, if it's like I know this treadmill
22:50
pretty well because I've done a lot of workouts on it.
22:52
Yeah, generally what I do is I hop on and whatever my like I do
22:58
my easy runs between like 7730 pace and I know like what my
23:02
heart rate is. So all outside or inside.
23:06
Oh, it's both so. Like I know what it is outside,
23:08
like if I'm running like 715 pace, my heart rate's like 135.
23:12
So I hop on the treadmill and I just increase the grade until I
23:17
get 715 pace around 135 heart rate.
23:21
So I'm like kind of calibrating it so that the efforts like as
23:25
one to one as you can get. It's still different.
23:27
Yeah. So you.
23:28
Keep the speed and then you use the incline to find like where
23:31
it matches up. That's interesting, 'cause I, I
23:33
just go on there and I just like whenever whatever zone I want, I
23:36
want to be and I just get there and just keep it in whatever.
23:38
It's crazy the variation of of oh, it's, it's bad dude.
23:41
It's insane when you start doing that though.
23:43
When? You start calibrating for
23:44
everyone, you're like, this is, yeah, it's not even comparable
23:48
like treadmill, it's way different.
23:50
Some of them you go I'm like up at 2 1/2% and I'm like, this is
23:54
crazy. Yeah, well, I work.
23:55
Out at like the little clubhouse, I have a gym, the Y
23:59
membership, the Planet Fitness, and I like when I travel just
24:02
like, fun. It is crazy.
24:04
Yeah, yeah. Variation.
24:05
So I did that. I'm on my preferred treadmill,
24:10
which is nice and. 10 minutes in, I was.
24:14
Feeling pretty good. I had like a good playlist
24:15
going. Yeah, OK.
24:17
And I was, I was like. Locked into like.
24:20
The the metronome like of of just running like that and the
24:26
treadmill starts decreasing speed like rapidly.
24:30
Is it showing UPS? Like the numbers going down?
24:33
The numbers going down? Really.
24:35
Yeah, so I'm. Watching it, it's.
24:36
Going down and I'm like, oh, I'm like panicking at this point.
24:39
Are you trying to bump it? Back up, I'm just hitting the
24:41
screen. But I had put the screen lock on
24:43
'cause it it like sometimes my sweat will will make it do that.
24:48
But I had the screen lock on. So what's the screen lock It's.
24:51
Like. If it if it's a touch screen.
24:54
Oh, I see. So.
24:55
That your. Sweat doesn't make it go up or
24:58
down or like change any settings you have on when you touch it.
25:00
Yeah. OK OK so I I locked the.
25:03
Screen and everything so I was like it can't be my sweat cause
25:05
the screen's locked so I it overheated it overheated so I.
25:14
Basically. Yeah, I slowed down all the way
25:16
to 0 and locked up and the screen was completely frozen.
25:19
So the screen was. You broke the treadmill.
25:22
I think so. I, I mean, it'll probably be OK.
25:25
Yeah, yeah. But maybe once they get in there
25:28
and and like. Revamp it, but I I So what?
25:31
'D you do, Yeah, I. Hopped the treadmill.
25:33
Oh, you. Went to the next one, yeah and I
25:36
lost like 3 minutes in between just trying to mess with it and
25:39
see what I could do. But at this point, like mentally
25:43
I was just like, something's going on here that I was not
25:46
meant to say so didn't I? Ran a 5K, I got 1.86 miles in
25:53
like 10 minutes and three, three seconds.
25:55
And then I hopped over. I ran a 5K in 16-12 and like I
26:02
was fried after that. I was like, this is I'm, I'm
26:06
confused. Yeah, you're done.
26:07
Yeah. So I think I might have run
26:10
another mile after that. I took like a a break and then I
26:14
was just like, geez. Yeah.
26:17
So you really it's a long, long. Long way of explaining that
26:22
everything went wrong. Yeah yeah yeah.
26:25
Damn. That's crazy though, just like
26:27
automatically came down I guess. If it's over.
26:29
Did it have a warning or anything?
26:30
It didn't have a. Warning, nothing came up.
26:34
I do like after when I was changing my shoes on the
26:39
treadmill that I was on, I sat down on the belt and it was like
26:44
it, it felt like it was burning my butt.
26:46
It was it was just like that. So I don't know, it could be
26:50
that they're just like overdue for service.
26:52
I mean, they're fairly golden and the national wide.
26:55
They did get some new ones actually, but they're like the
26:58
they almost look like, you know what a Woodway treadmill is.
27:01
Woodway No. I don't think so.
27:02
It has like those. I think they're called slatted.
27:06
Oh yeah, it looks like a tank. Yeah, I see.
27:09
Them in the arm or the? Tracks on a tank.
27:11
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so.
27:13
That's what it was. No, that's not what they did.
27:16
Get some. New ones there, so maybe maybe
27:18
those are. Yeah, can handle your speed.
27:21
Yeah, maybe. Yeah, I remember this.
27:22
Mike King told me he had a big workout once, like I think he
27:26
was prepping for maybe Mount Washington or something, but in
27:29
the middle of the workout that his treadmill home just broke.
27:31
It just like came off a hinge or whatever, just broke.
27:34
And he just was like, you know, because honestly, dude, what
27:36
what I'm, you know, sometimes like some of the machines, like
27:39
after 20 minutes or 30, just stops.
27:41
Like it forces a cool down that that will just irritate me.
27:46
He, you know, when I have to restart and boot the whole thing
27:49
up. So yeah, as soon as that
27:50
happened, you were probably like I this mentally, I was sucked
27:54
out. I was.
27:54
Like it doesn't even matter anymore.
27:55
Like if I were to keep running, there's like a 3 minute gap
27:58
there. Yeah, you said who cares.
28:00
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
28:02
That's so funny. Yeah.
28:04
Oh my gosh. You sent in a shrub file.
28:06
Yeah. For your, for your metal.
28:09
And it's just like disjunted. This is from multiple
28:11
treadmills. This is for multiple broke some
28:13
things. You guys did this to me.
28:15
Yeah. Give me my medal.
28:16
You brought me here. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
28:19
Well, that's unfortunate. So are you going to give it
28:22
another go like next weekend or you're you're just moved on from
28:25
the half marathon? Yeah, I think I'm probably moved
28:29
on from like the road stuff, but yeah, I I'm definitely going to
28:34
start. I'm going to start sending some
28:37
segments. I think I'm pretty excited to
28:39
get. It's always fun get back on the
28:40
trails. Yeah, we were just talking about
28:42
that. The there's still enough snow
28:44
down that I think a lot of the the trails are probably going to
28:48
be in pretty good shape. Maybe though we get some rain.
28:51
I don't know, as I was looking at the end of the end of the
28:54
week and it looks like there's some rain on the way.
28:58
So yeah, we'll see how the trails fair.
29:00
Yeah, I went out at the Unkanutis this weekend and it
29:02
was like it was kind of punchy. It was I, I, I went, yeah, I
29:07
went after the the one warm day. But then like.
29:12
It was already felt like. It was like kind of like melting
29:14
a little bit underneath because usually if it if it warms up,
29:16
you pack it down nice. But like my entire foot was just
29:20
like sinking in some places, not like postal and like the whole
29:23
trail was like consolidating. So hopefully, I don't know,
29:27
hopefully we get good trail conditions, but I'm sure up
29:29
north the the trails are much better right now.
29:31
Yeah, yeah, just pack it out. But it's going to be warm after
29:36
the next week. I know, I saw.
29:37
I saw 60s Sixties next week, so that'll be beautiful.
29:41
That'll be good. Get some sun on the skin.
29:43
Yeah. Nice.
29:45
Well, let's talk about some good, let's talk about some more
29:47
fun things for you because you had a you had a crazy year last
29:50
year. You did a lot of efforts and
29:53
this is kind of like maybe we should give you give the people
29:55
a little bit of background. Well, we grew up in the same
29:58
town, so we kind of know each other for a while, but we got
30:01
into running in similar times. I we weren't really like
30:04
chatting or communicating then, but a handful of years ago and
30:08
then you went and hiked AT Yep, came back super fit and you just
30:12
had a crazy year yesterday. So I guess like give us your
30:15
running background. Anything else out of that we
30:18
should know? And then maybe we go into like,
30:19
how was the AT? Yeah, so.
30:22
Running background wise, I. So in high school.
30:27
I ran track but I was a sprinter so not a lot of carryover.
30:33
I did run the 400, which I feel was maybe like has some like
30:38
relevancy. Yeah.
30:39
So I I was, I wasn't good, I wasn't good enough for the 400
30:43
to run like the single event, but I was on the 4 by 14.
30:48
OK now so I the best time I ever threw down the 400 was like I
30:55
was like a 53 to 55 guy so. It wasn't.
30:58
It wasn't good. Enough to get the get the solo
31:00
draw, but I I was on the team that seems.
31:03
Fast though, No, it was. It was.
31:05
It was a decent time, but I was like the first, the first leg.
31:08
We had some really strong guys actually who was on that 4.
31:12
By four team, so it was me. Jacob Myers I'm not.
31:18
I'm killing that. I can't remember.
31:20
No, not. Good.
31:23
So there's the cameras that. I just forget things don't worry
31:25
about are. The two other I mean, our anchor
31:30
leg was really good. O'Brien Jenae.
31:32
OK, who? Who ended up running?
31:33
At UNH, he ran D1 at UNH. Yeah.
31:36
So I think he did the decathlon. Cool.
31:40
Yeah. So shout out, Brian.
31:41
Yeah. Going through with that.
31:42
And then our anchor, like, oh, Jacob Martin, There he is.
31:45
He was one of the fastest people I've ever met in my life,
31:50
really. And like, subtly, you'd never
31:53
know. He really, I mean, none of us
31:56
were really too psyched on being a track practice.
31:58
Like we didn't do a lot, but yeah, so we had a good full by
32:03
four team, but that was extensive.
32:06
My running in in high school, I I mainly was played football and
32:10
basketball. So after that I kind of always
32:15
just liked sports. So I kind of I I kept going and
32:19
I picked up skateboarding right after or basically like high
32:25
school summer just because I needed something to do I like,
32:27
I'm like, I need something to do it because I can't be just like
32:31
sitting down and not have like an outdoor pursuit.
32:34
Yeah, yeah, I. Picked up that.
32:36
Turns out skateboarding is really hard I.
32:39
Skateboarded when I was growing up younger.
32:41
Yeah, very hard. Turns out it's really.
32:43
Really hard and and it hurts, it hurts the pavements hard.
32:48
I did that for like 2 years and. My girlfriend.
32:55
Ingrid, who I'll refer to, she got colored grid, but shout out,
32:59
you know, grid. She introduced me to surfing,
33:03
and that was like my first love. I was like, yeah, it was.
33:07
It was like skateboarding, but it didn't hurt.
33:09
And New England actually has some decent waves, mostly in the
33:13
winter, which is kind of brutal. But where do you go mostly
33:18
Hampton I when I was at UNH though, so like this is now
33:21
college. It was super easy.
33:23
I had like a 30 minute drive to the beach.
33:25
So I would go all the time. Surfed a ton in for like 4
33:31
years. I actually ended up studying
33:33
abroad in Australia and that kind of like launched me into
33:38
like the surf scene. So I got, I got really into it
33:41
for a long time and still go surfing every every now and then
33:45
again when there's good waves. So nice.
33:47
That must have been crazy going to Australia.
33:49
That's like one of the places to do it.
33:50
Oh yeah, no it. Was amazing I had I met a a like
33:55
a good group there that. Like they had a car.
33:59
So that was basically they. Had a car, they were awesome and
34:02
they also could transport. They transported me to like.
34:05
All up and down the the East Coast.
34:07
And that's cool. Yeah, it was.
34:10
It was a really cool experience. But then when I graduated
34:14
college, I moved to Delaware so that Ingrid could go get her
34:20
master's at the University of Delaware.
34:23
So that was kind of tough because I was now an hour and a
34:27
half from the beach and the like.
34:30
Surfing's really finicky, especially on the East Coast,
34:34
because the conditions kind of determine what you can and can't
34:37
do. Yeah, I, I tried it a couple
34:40
times to like make things work, but every time I drove it was
34:46
like the conditions were iffy and I just like kind of got
34:49
burned out of it because it's like you drive an hour, you're
34:51
driving 3 hours round trip. And to not even be able to like
34:54
have a good session is just not, yeah, not worth it.
34:58
So I got into running. I can run anywhere.
35:02
I basically was like. Yeah, I could run anywhere.
35:04
We have, they have some actual decent trails in Delaware.
35:08
Like there's not a lot of a lot of areas to run, but mainly I
35:13
was running on roads and then. Yeah, I kind of just.
35:18
Took off from there. I got super into like training
35:20
theory and stuff like that. I was paying attention to a lot
35:24
of. Like I.
35:27
Don't know, like scientific journals that came out and I got
35:30
I think more into that than the running itself.
35:33
Interesting. Yeah, I was like really reading
35:37
a lot about it and. Yeah, now.
35:42
I'm, I'm training a lot more, a lot more than I was then.
35:47
Yeah, No, it's cool. I.
35:48
Will say you've made and there's this is like something I want to
35:51
talk about. Like I feel like we talk about
35:53
this a lot. I feel like we have similar
35:54
training styles. We're very kind of like by the
35:58
book or not. We're we're trying to get as fit
36:01
as possible. Essentially we we're training
36:03
for like peak performance instead of just like, I don't
36:06
know, like leisurely going on trails all the time or whatever.
36:10
And like, dude, you've gotten so fit over the last, like you're
36:14
just extremely fit now. And like thinking that you only
36:17
started running a handful of years ago.
36:19
Obviously your training, your training is good.
36:22
Like you're doing something very right.
36:27
How much do you think the? AT helped like because you were
36:30
road running in Delaware before and then a couple years ago you
36:33
did the ATI think you were telling me you came back you're
36:36
like, dude, I just feel really fit.
36:37
Do you think that I like, I always am thinking like if you
36:42
want to get into endurance sports and you want to build a
36:44
good base, should I just tell people to go hike the AT?
36:46
Like do you think it like pushed you ahead or really just got you
36:49
into the sport? Like fitness wise?
36:52
Like I don't know. How did the AT transform your
36:54
fitness, your training and like what was that like?
36:57
Well, I think the. First thing is it.
37:00
Is so much. Base that it's like it's I think
37:04
I made-up probably like 3 years worth of training in the context
37:10
that I am right now so like with a full time job and like just I
37:14
don't know like around 8 hours a week like we were I hiked the
37:18
trail with Ingrid and so the pace was a lot like I she was we
37:24
were going at her pace and so it was a lot slower We, we did it
37:28
in five months which is not slow by any means but.
37:33
I think. That sets the like your body
37:37
just becomes so durable and you are spending so much time just,
37:44
I don't know, I guess doing aerobic exercise, Easy, easy.
37:47
Aerobic cannot be understated like.
37:50
It's just a lot of time on feet. So when I came back.
37:56
I kind I mean. Prior or pre AT Ryan I was like
37:59
I really only trained like 4 hours a week and it was very
38:03
inconsistent. Like I wasn't as into it as I am
38:06
now, but I think what it the biggest thing it did was I'm I
38:11
haven't like had any small injuries or even any big
38:15
injuries. Like I think that constant
38:18
stress just transforms your body in a way that toughens it up.
38:23
Yeah, carrying a 20. Pound backpack for five months
38:26
over really brutal terrain. So yeah, I think that's the
38:29
biggest thing it's done for me is just allow me to train the
38:32
way I want to. Yeah.
38:33
Which is cool. No, that's awesome.
38:35
Yeah. Well, so you, you didn't get any
38:37
injuries on, I think I've asked this before, but on the AT no
38:39
injuries like no problems. Yeah, no problems.
38:42
Yeah, I really like the main thing was like my feet.
38:48
But after about a month, that kind of all all went away.
38:52
It was just like the the constant pounding, like I had
38:54
some. Like the bottom my.
38:57
Feet would get these like, I don't know, I don't know.
39:00
It was like under the skin, but like almost like broken blood
39:03
vessels just from the, the constant walking.
39:06
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that went away after a month
39:09
and. Yeah, yeah.
39:12
No, that's awesome. Yeah, I mean.
39:13
If you can, just. Train consistently and just keep
39:16
getting faster. I think it's just, yeah, I think
39:18
just not training is one of the biggest roadblocks for for most
39:22
people is just, yeah, if you can keep training, you're probably
39:24
going to keep getting fitter if you're following some sort of
39:26
structured program. Yeah.
39:28
Yeah. So what year was that?
39:30
What year was the AT20242024? OK.
39:33
And then last year, let me see if I can remember.
39:36
I I had some written down. I didn't do much research
39:39
because I think they can recall them, but yeah, but let me see
39:42
if I can get them. So you did a so you did a DIY50
39:46
Miller from Amherst to Durham. That was, I remember that was
39:49
the winter, right? Then you did the Hampton half
39:52
120 was the next to gravel, overland gravel.
39:56
Was that your next big race? Threw down some the.
40:00
Penny. The penny.
40:01
Yeah, the penny. OK, the penny sub 7 Penny and
40:04
then the overland gravel race with some strong bikers,
40:10
blackouts, strong race for you. Took a took a.
40:13
Wait, was there one other thing? I'm thinking, I don't think so.
40:18
I think that was OK. Oh, oh, the throw down.
40:20
Throw down boots for throw down top 10 and then the blackout
40:24
where you took a wrong turn would have ran much faster.
40:26
But you can have wrong turn. Yeah, on.
40:27
The on the Yeah, I was following the.
40:30
Pacing car. Yeah, I was following the pacing
40:32
car. Blackout and yeah, yeah, yeah.
40:35
And then you're in a sub 165K. Yeah.
40:38
Turkey Trot. Yep.
40:38
So that's just like that's a. Ton of racing, huge year.
40:41
Did you know you were going to race that much going into it?
40:46
No, I had no structure, Yeah. You just were like, picking them
40:49
off or like, I still feel good. Yeah.
40:51
Yeah, I think. I just one from another I was.
40:55
I I. Yeah, Coming off the ATI had
40:57
like a lot of motivation. I felt like I, I just wanted to
41:01
see what I was capable of, sort of.
41:02
Yeah. And so one after another, I, I
41:06
like the motivation. Never really burned out, so I
41:09
just kept kept going after Yeah, which was really fun.
41:11
Nice. Yeah.
41:12
So. The the one the first one the
41:15
Amherst to Durham. Yeah, this was a 50 mile fun run
41:19
for you Rd. run. You did a sub 9 minute pace
41:21
right? What was the total time for
41:23
that? I ended it was.
41:24
Six 48648, I think it yeah it was 830 pace was like the
41:30
running and then like elapsed was 840.
41:33
OK. So yeah, it was.
41:36
Do you want to? Talk about this.
41:37
Passion project because this is not a race, folks.
41:41
So the back story is in like 2017, we're just messing around
41:47
in my friend Brock's neighborhood and it's I don't, I
41:52
won't I won't dox's neighborhood, but I.
41:55
Just learned what doxing is. It's basically.
41:58
It's basically just a one mile circle and so I was like.
42:04
Guys, I'm going to. Run around this as fast as I can
42:06
time in my mile and I I don't know what the I wish I knew what
42:10
the time was, but I remember they they timed me and I looked
42:14
at my time and I was like, I could run from here to you in a.
42:20
Like I could I? Could do it.
42:21
And they were telling me like, dude, there's no way.
42:24
There's no way. And the time I thought it was 37
42:26
miles, OK. So.
42:30
But you. Were just like I'm wicked fast
42:31
right now like I ran one mile guys I can do and it like didn't
42:35
I was. Like that didn't hurt that bad.
42:36
Like this times 37, oh OK, that bad.
42:39
But I never run over. I mean, I probably had never run
42:42
over 2 miles of my life at that point.
42:44
I was wow. I didn't.
42:45
Know that I was just being. Arrogant and stupid, Yeah.
42:48
Oh, this was. Back in the day, yeah, way back
42:50
in the day. So.
42:53
I was like, I'll, I'll never. Have to do that so now that I
42:56
had come off the ATI had all this base I was like I put in I
43:00
put together a block and I it went well I I ran I think I had
43:06
like 350 mile a weeks which for me was like a lot yeah and I.
43:11
Went. And ran I, I put this together
43:15
on like AI had like a spreadsheet and everything and
43:18
Angry came out and was like my crew.
43:20
So she met me four times across the effort.
43:24
I had a friend come out and pace me too, Joe Aikman, who known
43:29
for a really long time. And yeah, it went way better
43:33
than I could have expected. I didn't hurt at all during it
43:37
and didn't have any issues so that's crazy your.
43:41
First ultra, that is not the typical experience for your
43:43
first ultra. Yeah, and straight.
43:45
Roads too, The whole yeah. That was the one thing I was
43:48
like, damn, you really want to do this whole thing on roads?
43:51
Yeah, that's awesome. That's a really, that's like a
43:53
super strong effort. Yeah.
43:55
I was really proud of myself. After it I I couldn't believe
43:58
how. How much it didn't?
44:02
Hurt and I don't think that's I don't think that's normal to I
44:06
mean for maybe coming off the AT is is like where that comes
44:11
from. But I think for most people,
44:13
that's probably. Not their first experience, no,
44:16
I think. I definitely think not.
44:19
Did you pace it good, do you think?
44:20
Yeah, I think so. I didn't really fade that fade
44:24
too much. I think that by the end of it I
44:26
was running like 845 pace and I started around like 8:15 so.
44:31
You had like. A very controlled fade, yeah,
44:33
Yeah, no. That's good.
44:35
That's crazy. And so you bounce back quick
44:36
too, like I'm sure I'm assuming. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
44:39
It was like a week. After I I did a little biking, I
44:43
just got in swift in my basement.
44:44
So I was I was pretty excited to like get it.
44:46
I was like, I can't wait to just ride my bike in the basement.
44:48
Yeah yeah, yeah. So I.
44:49
Did that for a week. And then I bounced back and
44:53
started training for the Hampton Half.
44:56
And I think I was talking to you after, and you don't know this,
45:01
but this is this is good. My goal initially was to run 125
45:08
at that, at that race. And I think you were, you'd may
45:12
have been like debating it at one point, Like you were like
45:14
looking around for some races. And I think you told me you were
45:17
like, yeah, I was maybe planning to go there.
45:19
If I go there, I'm going to try and run 120.
45:22
Yeah. And I heard that.
45:24
And I was like, dude, I have to. Oh.
45:27
OK, let's go because you had I. Mean you've already like run so
45:33
many races or like ultra races. Yeah, I was like a few ultras.
45:37
I was. Like I'm going to try.
45:38
And I'm going to try and see where my fitness is compared to
45:41
Andrew because I clearly like you wouldn't have said that if
45:43
you didn't know you were you had like a chance of going for it.
45:46
So I was like, yeah, I'm going to go after it.
45:48
I'm going to see if I can run 120.
45:50
Let's go. And that kind of.
45:55
I'm happy I did. Because clearly I was capable of
45:57
it. But like, had you not said that,
45:59
and had I not been like a little crazy in my head, I wouldn't
46:02
have gone for it. You heard it here, folks.
46:05
No, that's awesome. Yeah.
46:06
I forget what I wanted to do just to, like, get more road
46:10
running. Like that was just something I
46:11
hadn't been doing a lot of. And I was really, I mean, still
46:14
like, I'm trying to get faster on the roads and just speed and
46:16
not like only do trails. I forget what came up.
46:21
Yeah, I didn't end up doing that, but but yeah, that was
46:24
definitely something on my radar.
46:25
And now I'm a little bit like, I'd be more interested in seeing
46:28
what I can do in the 5K, like 1/2 marathon.
46:30
Marathon doesn't sound as fun. No, but yeah, maybe one day.
46:35
Yeah, Yeah, maybe. Not though, yeah, maybe not.
46:39
Just stick this. Trail history of this.
46:41
Of this race, past years, it's been fine, but like, apparently
46:44
it's been cancelled all over the place just 'cause, I mean, a
46:48
race in March and yeah, and New Hampshire's not good.
46:51
But still, though, they should have backup plans.
46:53
Don't take my money. Yeah.
46:54
So. So Andrew motivated me to go for
46:56
1:20. That's grand. 120 and like 19
46:59
seconds, so I barely missed it. Yeah. close.
47:02
Yeah. Close enough.
47:05
And then, yeah. Then sub 7 Pemi yeah, when it's
47:08
the. The Pemi after that, and really,
47:13
I think I, yeah, I dove into trails running on the local
47:17
mountains we have here. So like the Ankaninix, I don't
47:21
know if we call them mountains or hills, but yeah, yeah, small.
47:24
Mountains. Yeah, small mountains, yeah.
47:26
Really punchy and. Like really, I think good
47:29
training for like the the whites and yeah, there's like a lot of.
47:35
A lot of like technical. Climbs there like white dot.
47:37
I don't know, I feel like they they translate well.
47:40
So I, I did that for about 3 months.
47:44
I was kind of mixing that with Rd. training.
47:46
So I would go, I would go to the Young's like probably one to two
47:51
times per week and then the rest was Rhodes.
47:53
In hindsight, probably could have used a lot more like just
47:56
training Bert. Like I averaged like 5 to 6000
47:59
feet and then went straight into the Penny.
48:05
Ran it on July 4th, which. I was already up there.
48:09
Anyway, and I kind of. I don't know, I just.
48:14
Didn't have a lot of opportunities, like I had a lot
48:16
of weekends booked that that summer, so I took advantage of
48:20
being up there and ran it. It went pretty good.
48:26
What was it final time? 6 I think it was 630. 939, yeah.
48:30
Yeah. So well under seven.
48:31
Yeah, yeah. And.
48:35
I definitely. Suffered a lot in the in the
48:38
back half of the effort. So you went.
48:40
Counterclockwise. Yeah, Yep.
48:41
Counterclockwise crew. Yeah, yeah.
48:44
Started. I made like a ton of like
48:47
errors. I started at like 4:00 AM and
48:49
didn't. I remember you telling me that.
48:51
I started at 4:00 AM. Because we were up there with
48:54
friends, yeah. Oreo and his.
48:57
Girlfriend, we were meeting them up there and yeah, I just didn't
49:00
want to like ruin everyone's plans.
49:01
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like, I'm going to start
49:03
early and just get it done with and then maybe I'll be like able
49:07
to rally and have a good day. Yeah.
49:10
So I started at 4:00 AM, but I didn't bring a headlamp.
49:13
And so the first hour and I think the the sun rose at like
49:17
5-15, maybe the first hour 15, I was, it was just like pitch
49:23
black and the trees I remember. I I could.
49:28
See that? There was light, but it just
49:29
wasn't hitting the trail. Yeah.
49:31
So that was super frustrating and I was ticking myself for
49:35
that, but. It seems like a no brainer.
49:39
Go out in the middle of the night, bring a light.
49:41
This is like some AT talk like I'm sure on the AT lot of people
49:45
like because when you spend a lot of time in the woods at
49:48
night, you do realize that you don't need a light a lot of the
49:51
times. Like if there's if it's clear
49:53
skies and you get a little bit of moonlight and you just wait a
49:57
little bit, your eyes do adjust. Definitely.
49:58
Yeah, but not for running fast, like for an effort.
50:02
You know what I mean? No, I was I.
50:03
Rolled my ankles a lot and I was tripping over myself but.
50:09
Once I got on top. Of Bond Cliff.
50:12
I was it. It turned into like a really
50:14
nice day. Yeah, I could see like it was
50:17
completely clear shortly after that, I think running the Ridge
50:23
between that and and N twin or no, yeah, South Twin, yeah.
50:30
It just turned into a rainforest.
50:32
So the the whole day it was just like full of mud.
50:36
And I I know for at least the Garfield Ridge, like it's always
50:39
like that, so it doesn't really matter.
50:41
But like all the rocks were wet and I was just slipped in.
50:44
I the whole time coming down the Osteo trail too, I was, I just
50:50
kept like slipping in the mud and like falling and at that
50:52
point I was cramping up really bad too.
50:54
So every time I felt it was like something else would would go
50:57
off. But yeah, it looking back on it,
51:01
I was it was awesome. Yeah, now it's a good I.
51:04
Remember, because you didn't like you, you start up more as a
51:07
Roadrunner. You've done a lot of roads, but
51:09
this is like one of your first first big trail efforts.
51:11
Yep, like that's still an awesome like top 10
51:14
counterclockwise. Yeah, I was just that is no
51:17
joke. Used to be talk saying.
51:18
Because then after it, it was like, I feel like everyone, Oh
51:22
no, you got kicked. Out.
51:23
Oh, big time, really, I think. It went to like 15 David
51:26
Sinclair. For sure, Clair, there was Matt.
51:29
Chorney, Matt. Chorney he didn't want.
51:30
Counter clockwise, yeah, OK. And then?
51:33
The other one was Brian Brennan. OK, don't know his name.
51:37
But. But there was two other people
51:39
that that ran it that year or last year and yeah, yeah.
51:43
So it. Happened.
51:43
Still a great time though, got a lot of attention.
51:45
Yeah, yeah. But yeah, I'd, I'll definitely
51:48
go back at some point. I would love to get that under,
51:51
under 6 hours. Yeah, yeah, maybe not this year,
51:54
but well, Lincoln Woods Rd. Closure probably can't unless
51:57
you get it in early. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
52:01
And then and then end of your end of the year.
52:03
So you did the the throw down the white spur, but then a sub
52:06
165K that is legit. That is fast.
52:10
Yeah, short course. Though, Yeah, yeah, don't.
52:12
Tell the people that we'll lead. We're going to lead off with
52:15
some 165K and don't talk about the course, yeah.
52:20
Just local 5K. It was the Merrimack Turkey
52:24
Trot. So I grew up in Merrimack.
52:26
Like literally right down the road from it.
52:27
Fellow Merrimack. Ian yeah, right down the road
52:30
from it. I ran the race when I was like
52:32
12. Really.
52:33
Yeah. Wow.
52:35
My mom has a picture of. It and we were looking every
52:37
right before like the night before we were looking
52:39
everywhere for the results yeah couldn't wanted to see what my
52:42
time couldn't find it yeah I couldn't find it that's.
52:45
Funny. And yeah, I came in second.
52:49
I the the kitten first. I think he runs for like
52:53
Connecticut College or something like that you'd sent.
52:55
Me his profile, I just looked at it quick.
52:57
I don't. I don't remember his name but.
53:00
Yeah. Yeah, he out kicked me in the
53:02
end. Yeah, out kicked you so, so fast
53:04
so. Yeah, yeah.
53:06
When you're just redlining, there's nothing you can do to go
53:08
fast. You're like, yeah, that's a
53:10
funny. So that course it it wasn't, it
53:13
wasn't exactly the course that we did, but I remember in cross
53:16
in middle school, I did a year and a half across country.
53:19
Oh really? Yeah.
53:20
This was this was actually like the the only running that I had
53:23
done until after college. It was like training for
53:26
basketball. I remember like Austin, France
53:28
and in Big Joe Joe Collaborate we're like we just do, we do it
53:32
to get in shape. I was like, I got to do it.
53:33
Yeah, so I did. I did.
53:34
The cross country had actually like a decent year, like had a
53:37
good time with the 7th grade. But I remember to start like it
53:41
was tryouts or whatever it was the first practice or tryouts
53:44
you did a couple miles. I don't know how the distance
53:48
was, but it was like an all out time trial.
53:50
You go down to the stoplights and then you run back up to the
53:54
middle school and you finish up at the fields at the top of the
53:57
thing. And I remember getting out of
54:00
the stoplight, turning around like I didn't know pacing or
54:02
anything. Like I was just getting into
54:03
running and it's just Matt Brewster ahead of me and, and I
54:07
see him up in the distance. He was in 8th grade.
54:09
He was a year older, so he was faster.
54:11
And I'm like running, trying to catch up to him.
54:13
And I see like up he stopped for a little bit.
54:15
I was like, oh man. I so I was like, I am not
54:18
stopping. I will go slower, but I will not
54:20
stop. And I would like kind of get up
54:22
to him then he turn around, look back and he would start going
54:24
again. So we did this a few times, but
54:26
I'm trucking. I will I'm going slower, but I
54:28
will not stop. I will not allow myself to stop.
54:31
I get up to the top of the thing.
54:33
He had won, and I get up and I just throw up everything I'd
54:36
eaten all day. And the coach, Mr. Babin, had to
54:39
call my mom and be like, he he needs, like, salty.
54:43
Mr. Babin was the coach. Yeah.
54:46
So I get up and yeah, that was my first time trial at the
54:49
middle school and I just vomited everywhere.
54:51
Beautiful. And then at the end of like the
54:53
next like 3 races, the whole team would always be like,
54:55
Andrew, you OK? Are you going to vomit?
54:57
Do you need crackers? And like, guys, it was one time,
55:00
but I was going hard. But so maybe I I kind of want to
55:03
do that trot one day. Yeah, man, my trot.
55:05
It's a It's a good. Course, like it starts I mean
55:08
the bad part about it is you finish on that like it's a
55:10
slight uphill yeah, but it's it's like some good rolling
55:13
hills. So it's like a true, like a
55:16
true, like 5K road. Yeah, yeah.
55:20
Road course, Yeah, like about 100 feet a.
55:21
Gain. I think so, yeah.
55:23
Nice. Now that's sweet.
55:24
Yeah, I want to, I don't know, maybe this spring I'll like time
55:27
trial of 5K on track or something.
55:30
Track would be great. Yeah, yeah, probably.
55:32
Probably just do it to get the fastest time, you know, Feel
55:34
good, Absolutely. But yeah, I haven't been on the
55:37
track in a while. I need to need to get on there.
55:39
Working towards it though. We're getting closer.
55:41
We're getting closer to flat track work.
55:43
Let's go. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
55:46
I want to talk some training stuff too.
55:48
I know we touched on it Like give us like your training
55:51
philosophy kind of like how you train.
55:53
I know you still do a lot of roads.
55:55
What do you think about when you're when you are just trying
55:58
to get faster? Like what are the main points
56:00
you think? This is a bit.
56:03
This is a broad. Topic No pressure the.
56:08
Like all of everything I do really is just to optimize
56:12
velocity. So like I just think about.
56:16
Everything I do. Needs to be so I'm getting
56:19
faster and that's like kind of the short term view and then
56:23
like long term just continue developing aerobically so.
56:30
In training what? That looks like is.
56:32
I mean a lot of this too. I've taken from Swap podcast
56:37
David Roach and and Megan, which I mean, they're just like the
56:39
the best resource. Yeah, I love this.
56:42
Yeah, I love. Listening to them, I think,
56:44
yeah, they're like top notch on top of everything.
56:47
I remember I think after the half marathon in the office last
56:51
year, you had said something like, I was like, oh, what did
56:54
you eat? And you were like, I think I
56:56
ate. You were like, I was doing 90 or
56:58
100 cars an hour. I was eating sis beta fuel,
57:01
this, this, and then something else.
57:02
I was like, dude, you're a David Roche guy for sure.
57:05
I had the, I had the stack. Going like, but like I didn't
57:10
know anything coming off the AT in terms of like fueling.
57:14
I had used like, I used Martin like way back when, which I had
57:19
gotten mainly from like following Gustav Eden, Kristen
57:23
Blumen felt like those those triathletes.
57:25
So but yeah, I think the Martin gels, they're just like hard to
57:31
get down after a while. Yeah, I don't think they're.
57:33
Pleasant at all? Yeah, I, I.
57:35
I heard, I heard about those gels from David and Megan Roach,
57:39
and I was just like, these are way better.
57:41
Yeah. So I've been using those.
57:43
Yeah, those goes. Down good.
57:44
I had them on the watch to dodge which you paced me at that.
57:47
Yeah yeah, shout out. Yeah, huge help there.
57:49
But yeah, I like the yeah, the sys ones are good.
57:53
And then the other one I like the precision.
57:56
Anything like that texture is good that you just kind of like
57:59
the the Morton it's. Like.
58:00
Chewy. Yeah, almost.
58:02
Yeah, I do like their. Drink mixes.
58:04
But from a training perspective, to go back to the original
58:07
question, I think it's just like a lot of strides always doing.
58:14
I out like every week I have a workout, it's usually Tuesday,
58:18
sometimes it's Wednesday and then.
58:22
On Saturdays. When I'm doing like roadblocks,
58:26
it'll be a like longer run with some like work in it.
58:31
So that'll be like my second work out of the week.
58:34
And then if I'm doing trails, that'll be like depending on how
58:38
close I am, it's just like a longer run.
58:41
But I'm pretty, I'm still very low volume, I would say compared
58:44
to like the level that I'm running at now.
58:48
And like the people that I would or am competing with, I average
58:53
like probably 7 hours a week and then.
58:58
But I'm trying to get that up. This year definitely realizing
59:02
like that I just need more, more aerobic volume just to continue
59:06
to improve. So but yeah, definitely fast on
59:10
the roads, getting faster on the trails.
59:14
And I think the the most interesting part being front or
59:19
being in New England right now is.
59:23
New England has some. Interesting terrain that's
59:25
really challenging for. Like.
59:29
Making Rd. training work for the, for the White Mountains.
59:34
And that's like a, it's an interesting equation.
59:36
Like I think it for, if you're out West, like it's almost 1 to
59:41
1, like you can just go straight from being really fast in the
59:45
roads and you're flying up hills, flying downhills.
59:48
But I really, I last year I, I really struggled making that,
59:52
that connection cause the, the technicality of the, of the
59:56
terrain. Like you're taking big steps,
59:58
you're taking small steps and you're just, it's not like
1:00:02
running economy out the window. It it it's almost.
1:00:06
Like not it's like not running. I think this is like I think for
1:00:09
a while. I train like.
1:00:12
It, you know, I went through when I first got into the sport,
1:00:15
I was, I had some overuse injuries that I would always be
1:00:17
working through. And then when I started training
1:00:19
seriously, I had, I had big issues and then I hadn't had
1:00:21
those issues, but I've had like the ankle that I'm dealing with.
1:00:25
I've had a few things and I it's kind of like basically steered
1:00:29
me away from just like trying to get Rd. volume up or like
1:00:32
mileage volume. And I've cross trained a ton, a
1:00:35
ton of stairs, a ton of bike like pulling sleds backwards,
1:00:39
elliptical, like I cross trained a ton and it's worked very well
1:00:43
for me. And I think if people like saw,
1:00:45
especially I was training like a year or two ago, they would be
1:00:48
like, this guy can't even run like whatever.
1:00:50
But in the White Mountains, it actually works because like you,
1:00:53
what you're saying is like you don't even need that good of
1:00:56
running economy most of the time because it's just like jumping
1:00:59
down to different objects or stepping up most of the time.
1:01:03
So it's like a different way to to train.
1:01:05
And obviously fitness, the fitter you are, the E that the
1:01:08
the better off you're going to be.
1:01:10
But it definitely is very specific, Yeah.
1:01:13
Yeah, I think that's that's where I got.
1:01:17
That's where I had the most. Challenges like I at Blackout, I
1:01:22
was very comfortable running out those ski hills.
1:01:24
Ski hills. Yeah, it.
1:01:25
Was just like this. I mean I was running.
1:01:29
Like I think I, I had like a a 6 minute gap on those on like the
1:01:34
whole course, which was, I mean I felt like I was flying the
1:01:38
whole time. And.
1:01:40
Yeah you go to the whites and it's like I feel like running a
1:01:43
a 7 minute gap in the whites is insane yes like no, it is even
1:01:48
on the boots spur climb like David Sinclair's gap was like
1:01:50
626 yeah so it's. Best in the world?
1:01:54
Best. Yeah.
1:01:55
And. So it's a whole different.
1:01:57
Whole different equation. And I, I mean, it's, it's cool
1:02:00
because I'm really interested in that equation.
1:02:02
Like I'm like, I'm like doing all these different things to
1:02:05
try and make it work. Like you got like I'm on the on
1:02:08
the stair climber now with like a like a weighted vest sometimes
1:02:11
doing that stuff. And I'm excited this year
1:02:15
because I think I, I started to figure it out towards the end of
1:02:18
last year. But yeah, this year I think I
1:02:22
think it'll go, it'll go a lot better.
1:02:24
Let's go. Yeah.
1:02:25
Yeah, No, that's awesome. Yeah, I know.
1:02:27
I love, I love trend of the whites.
1:02:28
Yeah. And some super fast people just
1:02:29
come out here and just don't like running on rocks like this.
1:02:32
And they're just like, they just don't, you know, they can't run
1:02:35
fast out here, which is I just hide in the mountains.
1:02:39
You get less elites out here. But yeah, Yeah.
1:02:43
No, it is true. No, I I love, Yeah, I love
1:02:46
running out in the white. So it's awesome.
1:02:48
Yeah. Do you have any, what are your
1:02:51
kind of efforts you thinking about this year?
1:02:54
Well. So I know the one big.
1:02:56
One Yeah, so we. Got I'm going to go to search
1:03:03
series Canon yeah in June that's.
1:03:08
I don't have anything before. That there is a couple things
1:03:11
that I'm looking at and I really wanted to get a 50K effort
1:03:15
because I'm going to grindstone in September.
1:03:16
Yeah, so I I just wanted to get a longer effort in, but I have a
1:03:21
couple weddings similar to you last year.
1:03:23
Like I have all these like little that are popping up like
1:03:27
weekends. So I think that becomes really
1:03:29
challenge. I don't want to burn myself out
1:03:31
and be trying to train for these and like trying to bring my
1:03:35
best, but also having to travel to weddings and like do all this
1:03:39
other stuff. So I might just keep it local
1:03:42
for the next couple months and do a like some up pills.
1:03:47
I know we got I think the white the throwdowns, did they start
1:03:52
in May? I think may last.
1:03:53
Year the first one was May yeah, I'm hoping so I'll.
1:03:56
Definitely do those this year. That's that's for sure.
1:03:58
I'm going to try and get in all of those.
1:04:00
And then so Cirque series Canon will be my first race.
1:04:06
Then I have. The Overland, Not the bike race
1:04:08
this year, but the run run. So last year I did the bike race
1:04:11
was super fun, but I'll definitely be better suited to
1:04:15
the the run race and that that's super.
1:04:19
That's good because it's 15 miles and I think like 2500 feet
1:04:24
of climbing. So it's exactly half of
1:04:26
grindstone. OK, perfect.
1:04:28
Which? Is like a nice.
1:04:30
I think I'm going to. I'll be able to feel out the
1:04:32
effort really well there. I don't think Grindstone has too
1:04:35
many long climbs. It's probably more like.
1:04:39
I think there's like 1. Main climb and then the rest of
1:04:42
it's like some punchy sections. Yeah, I don't know, It'll be
1:04:47
it'll be a good test of effort. And then Grindstone September is
1:04:50
the one that I'm trying to really show up for.
1:04:52
And yeah, we'll see how that goes, right?
1:04:56
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It'll be it'll be interesting,
1:04:59
but I'd love to. I don't know.
1:05:02
I think it it's the top three get a spot into CCC.
1:05:05
Yeah, I think so. Or.
1:05:06
Is it C? Yeah.
1:05:07
OCC for the 50K? Yeah.
1:05:09
So snag your bib boy, that would be sweet.
1:05:12
I don't know if I'm on that level of fitness with like, it
1:05:17
doesn't seem like some crate, like it doesn't seem like
1:05:20
they're getting like the top elites at at Grindstone.
1:05:23
There are some very, very fast guys that go there.
1:05:26
I think Dan Kurtz went there one year.
1:05:29
It depends on the year. Right, it depends on the year.
1:05:31
So we'll see who shows up. Could get smoked.
1:05:34
I could be running with the leaders.
1:05:36
So yeah, yeah, we'll see. Fine, let's find.
1:05:39
Excited to find out. Yeah, definitely excited to
1:05:41
find. Out.
1:05:42
Nobody needs to talk it up. We don't we don't need anyone
1:05:44
crazy entering this little race this year.
1:05:46
Yeah, you know, I. Just want to get my get my bib
1:05:49
to OCC. Yeah, OK, yeah, just let me get
1:05:52
it now. That'll be sweet.
1:05:53
Yeah, Yeah. No, no, I think you have.
1:05:55
I think you definitely have a good chance.
1:05:57
I mean, you're really fit. Keep at it, keep getting faster.
1:06:01
Yeah, that's the plan. What what time is it right now?
1:06:06
I don't want to take your whole it's 6. 10 I don't know.
1:06:10
I don't care though. No, Yeah, I was going to say.
1:06:12
There's a few more topics that I want to talk about.
1:06:14
Like I, I was telling Ryan like Ryan's going to come on
1:06:17
definitely more in the future just cause nearby talking the
1:06:20
same stuff. But we were, we got into a
1:06:22
little texting conversation about food the other day.
1:06:26
So I want to talk about the food, like how you think about
1:06:29
it, 'cause this is something that like I go back and forth on
1:06:33
a little bit. Obviously, I mean it depends
1:06:36
where you are in your training, what kind of volume.
1:06:38
But like eating enough food is always the most important
1:06:41
aspect. But then we were talking about
1:06:43
like Whole Foods versus processed foods and how that
1:06:47
like effects, you know, how you look at it in your training and
1:06:51
the way that I kind of really look at it, like I really try to
1:06:54
eat clean and healthy, like a lot of the meals, like the main,
1:06:58
you know, outside of my running, but there are sometimes where I
1:07:01
it's like I can't eat enough fruit, vegetables, Whole Foods
1:07:05
to satisfy me. And I we just binge out a little
1:07:08
bit, right. So like and you were saying that
1:07:10
like you think processed food is like if you are.
1:07:13
Training. Hard throw a little bit of that
1:07:15
in. It's not going to kill you.
1:07:16
Like just make sure you're getting your calories and you're
1:07:19
saying what coaches like process or eat.
1:07:22
What was it saying? You texted me.
1:07:23
Oh. Eat, eat well.
1:07:25
Eat, eat well. So.
1:07:26
Eating. Overeating.
1:07:27
Well, yeah, eating. Just that's Connor Mance, it's
1:07:32
Ed Isestone. So Connor Mance and Clayton
1:07:34
Young's coach are obviously the the two best marathoners we
1:07:38
have. And basically all that means is
1:07:41
eat whatever you want and then eat well.
1:07:46
So I I kind of just. I think the way I structure.
1:07:51
It I have three meals that I eat every day that are homemade.
1:07:55
They're good meals, like they're not like processed or anything.
1:08:00
And then I have snacks, which they're I mean, I don't know,
1:08:05
it's very varied from day-to-day.
1:08:08
I would say. I mean, I eat a lot of fruit,
1:08:10
but, yeah, around trading and stuff like that, it's just
1:08:15
whenever I'm like hungry or craving something, I, I give in
1:08:19
every time. Yeah.
1:08:20
Yeah, yeah. That's just how it goes.
1:08:21
Yeah, 'cause it's just the more, the more you can eat and the
1:08:25
more you can train, yeah, sort of thing.
1:08:27
I mean, there's guys like Christian Blumenfeld who are
1:08:30
walking around with bottles of Coke.
1:08:32
Yeah. And he's in a very extreme
1:08:33
example. Yeah.
1:08:34
I don't think he's relatable to even us 'cause he's training
1:08:37
like 40 hours a week. Yeah, but well, I think.
1:08:41
Yeah, that's the thing, like the training intensity because like
1:08:43
for me, I, the way that I think of like when I can eat junk food
1:08:47
an hour before the run, during a run and like an hour and after
1:08:51
the run go crazy. Like you need to be fueled and
1:08:54
you need to restore glycogen. Like that's just like sugary
1:08:57
stuff. So like treats, you know,
1:08:59
whatever I'm like pretty lenient on.
1:09:01
And then outside of that, yeah, like my meals all like Whole
1:09:04
Foods, fruit, vegetables, like just beet, potatoes, rice, like
1:09:08
that kind of thing. But I do eat like a lot of
1:09:10
carbs. But I think when I step up my
1:09:13
training, and this is like the big thing too, because I think
1:09:15
there was a lot of like, just eat whatever, eat a ton only if
1:09:20
you're eating a lot, just make sure you're training a lot
1:09:23
because I think there are a lot of people that will go for like,
1:09:25
you know, whatever run. And then they just eat like 1
1:09:28
doughnut and then they just like that's all the calories they
1:09:30
burn. It's like, all right, wait, it's
1:09:32
you need to be exercising a ton. Yeah, I think there's.
1:09:38
There's definitely like a threshold to where, I don't
1:09:42
know, like generally I feel like if you're training less than
1:09:46
five hours a week, you probably don't need to be like
1:09:50
aggressively eating. I agree.
1:09:52
I agree because like, that's a normal.
1:09:55
Amount of exercise for anyone like you're, you're on five days
1:09:59
and like, even if they're like walks or something like that,
1:10:02
like you're not like just eat what you want.
1:10:05
But at the same time, like once you step up and you're training
1:10:09
like 78910 hours a week, I find that it yeah, it's just really
1:10:14
hard to get in the calories you need to sustain yourself without
1:10:18
eating processed foods. So I would say my approach is
1:10:24
definitely around trainings like pre run.
1:10:27
I think my my fuel is usually either Oreos or fig newtons.
1:10:32
Love. Oreos.
1:10:33
I get out. I get out.
1:10:34
Of I train, I train in the afternoon, so I when I get out
1:10:37
of work, I eat either 4 Oreos or 4 Fig Newtons and an Arizona
1:10:42
iced tea and I'll just like drink that before I run or yeah.
1:10:46
And then after I don't really prioritize like anything except
1:10:51
I usually just eat dinner after. Yeah, dinner.
1:10:53
But sometimes I'll have a protein shake, stuff like that.
1:10:58
But then sometimes, like I was telling you this, I'll eat like
1:11:02
10 cookies after after dinner or something like that.
1:11:06
Like I'll just, my mom will make like banana bread bites or
1:11:11
something or something like that, and I'll just eat 10 of
1:11:13
them. Yeah.
1:11:14
And I just take that as like I've been under fueling the days
1:11:18
before. Yeah.
1:11:19
And my body is just making up for it when you have that
1:11:22
craving. That's that is actually what it
1:11:24
is, I think. I think so too.
1:11:26
Yeah, there's a little. Bit of self-control, which I
1:11:28
think both of us probably sure I struggle with for sure like so
1:11:31
if I have a bag so they just need to eat the whole thing.
1:11:33
Oh yeah. But yeah, I think that is like
1:11:34
your body. The one thing too that when I'm
1:11:37
doing bigger volume or especially when I do double S
1:11:40
like I love double SI. Don't know if you do double SA
1:11:42
lot. I love double SI.
1:11:43
Can't right now because of. My schedule, but you don't go in
1:11:46
the morning. If I was able to, I I probably
1:11:48
would. Yeah, do.
1:11:49
When I have when I'm doing big volume and I have like a double
1:11:52
that I need, you know, I have to run another hour in the evening,
1:11:55
it feels like I'm just 4 hours just eating, snacking to make
1:11:59
sure I have enough fuel to not bonk during the the double.
1:12:02
No, I can imagine it really is just like, you just got to eat
1:12:05
more than you than you think you need.
1:12:08
And yeah, as if if if you're bonking during runs or if you're
1:12:11
having like extreme cravings, you're probably just like not
1:12:14
eating enough. So yeah, focus on full Whole
1:12:18
Foods. And then after that, just like
1:12:19
make sure you're definitely eating enough.
1:12:21
Yeah. Yeah.
1:12:23
It's interesting you don't like double s, though.
1:12:24
I feel like for me, double s, easiest way to build volume.
1:12:28
Well, yeah. I I do, I do think double s are
1:12:33
like a definitely good thing. Yeah, it would be preferable to
1:12:35
me. It's just like right now with
1:12:37
the way everything lines up, like I just, I don't know.
1:12:40
I just do all my training in the afternoon.
1:12:42
I think if I was working like less and I wasn't, I don't know.
1:12:50
I like life circumstances. I would probably split things up
1:12:54
a little more, yeah, 'cause I think that I would get, I would
1:12:56
be able to get more volume. But yeah, right now it's just
1:13:00
easier to do all my training in like 1 block in the afternoon.
1:13:03
Yeah. So.
1:13:04
And your training's been good? Yeah.
1:13:06
No, I think, I mean, I'm still getting better, so yeah.
1:13:10
If you're getting faster, not getting hurt, stay on that path.
1:13:15
That's like this is the hard part too is cause.
1:13:18
You always I we're definitely in this sport is just you always
1:13:21
need to do more and I think that's if you're trying to do
1:13:25
anything, you always are going to think I.
1:13:27
I need to do more. Yeah, but.
1:13:31
A lot of times it's. Really, just like staying the
1:13:33
course is the challenge, not doing too much and overcooking
1:13:38
yourself too early is is more valuable in the in the long run.
1:13:42
Yeah, avoiding periods. Of downtime, yeah, like, yeah,
1:13:45
for whether that be burnout, injury, whatever it is, yeah.
1:13:49
No, I do agree. I feel like the harder, the
1:13:51
harder parts of training for me or just like making sure you're
1:13:55
getting good sleep so you can maintain, like making sure
1:13:58
you're like not carrying too much stress from other things.
1:14:02
Like you really are just like making sure that every week I
1:14:04
can put in solid training. Solid training, solid training.
1:14:07
Yeah, yeah. Sleep's a big part of it too,
1:14:10
yeah. Do you track your sleep?
1:14:12
I just started tracking my sleep.
1:14:14
Really. You just started.
1:14:15
Yeah, yeah, I just started. No, I, I.
1:14:17
I've been tracking it for a bit, but I last year my old watch
1:14:21
broke and I got Phoenix. So like I get sleep scores every
1:14:26
night which I've been wearing it's bed and previously I hadn't
1:14:29
just because it it would tell me how long I sleep and not like
1:14:32
the quality of it. Yeah.
1:14:36
Yeah, it's been. Interesting to look at that I've
1:14:39
been getting all the. Data.
1:14:40
Yeah, not all the. Data.
1:14:41
I love the data. I can't get enough.
1:14:43
See, I I for AI, just for a long time, I didn't want to see the
1:14:46
data because I don't want to know like if I was just having
1:14:49
bad sleeps and like I didn't want it to play like, oh, I
1:14:52
didn't sleep good. So I can't get the run in the
1:14:54
one day I can get a long run or a workout or whatever, that kind
1:14:57
of thing. But I'm leaning into the data.
1:15:00
So we'll see. I'm just trying to trying to get
1:15:02
it better, but it is it is kind of crazy.
1:15:04
Yeah. I tend to get like pretty good
1:15:08
sleep scores, but there's like periods.
1:15:11
I noticed that like no matter what I do, I'm just like, I
1:15:14
don't know, it's like 75. Yeah, yeah.
1:15:17
Yeah, but it is what it is. Yeah.
1:15:19
That's like 11 big element. I'm trying to.
1:15:21
I'm trying to improve here, get better sleep, get better
1:15:24
training. Yeah.
1:15:26
But yeah, I mean, anything else? Did we miss any highlights?
1:15:29
Like I said, you're going to be back on so we can just talk
1:15:31
about things. But that was like a good
1:15:33
background. If you don't know Ryan, get to
1:15:36
know him because dude's coming. Yeah, I'm on.
1:15:39
Yeah, how can people? Find you and you're and you do
1:15:41
coaching. Oh yeah, yeah.
1:15:43
Yeah, So yeah, I do. I do coaching.
1:15:45
I don't have like a website or anything up.
1:15:47
I'm on Strava. So yeah, my name Ryan Fournier.
1:15:50
I did get Instagram back. So I've been off social media
1:15:53
for four years or so. Yeah.
1:15:57
And I'm getting back on now because I'm realizing that it's
1:16:00
just hard to stay in the loop with everything if you're just
1:16:04
don't exist. And also, yeah, it's, it's been
1:16:10
a positive and a negative. It's a scary world.
1:16:14
Out there, Ryan, we both came back this year and it's a scary
1:16:17
world out here. We both struggle.
1:16:19
With it too and it's like I'm addicted to social media.
1:16:25
I love social media, but at the same time I need to stop.
1:16:30
So I keep it on my laptop now, which has helped a lot.
1:16:34
But I'm on, I'm on Instagram. It's I don't even know what my
1:16:37
handle is. OK, we'll throw that down.
1:16:39
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
1:16:43
That's that's pretty much it. Nice.
1:16:46
Yeah. Well.
1:16:46
Thanks for coming on. It's good chat.
1:16:48
The people will see you again soon.
1:16:50
Yeah, we got to get out soon. We our weekends have lined up.
1:16:52
You've been travelling? Yeah.
1:16:55
And yeah, now that I'm I'm done Rd. training for a bit, can
1:16:59
probably get back out. We can suck them back to the.
1:17:00
Trails in their mouths. Nice.
1:17:03
All right. Well, until then, thanks, guys.
1:17:06
Yeah, thanks for having me. On See you but who's OK and.
1:17:11
Ending this episode with a trip report.
1:17:15
So I did the Tri pyramids yesterday March 6th and the
1:17:20
trail conditions were not great. This week in the White
1:17:24
Mountains, it's been pretty warm.
1:17:26
And so there were a lot of reports of like, you need your
1:17:28
snowshoes, Everyone should wear snowshoes.
1:17:31
And Friday was actually a colder day.
1:17:33
So the trail was firm the whole way.
1:17:35
I actually didn't even bring snowshoes because it was very
1:17:38
firm. It was going to be cold, below
1:17:39
freezing, but, and so I didn't do much postal.
1:17:42
And if you step off the trail, you just postal immediately if
1:17:45
you're wearing snowshoes or not. But on trail, no postaling, very
1:17:49
firm. But the trail was extremely
1:17:51
bumpy. Like there must have been a
1:17:53
bunch of people in spikes or whatever.
1:17:55
That kind of churned. Up the trail before it got cold
1:17:58
and then it froze really bumpy. So it's kind of like annoying
1:18:02
and but honestly I was pleased with it.
1:18:05
I, I think it's better than wearing snow shoes.
1:18:07
I I think the conditions were still good, but those were the.
1:18:10
Conditions. On the tripyramids going up that
1:18:13
steep section, very steep, very icy, and then in between the
1:18:18
peaks, it actually wasn't drifted too much.
1:18:20
Usually that section, it's very windy up there always and the
1:18:25
drifts are pretty deep, but there were no deep drifts and so
1:18:29
like I didn't even need there's just a couple inches of fresh
1:18:31
powder on the trail when I went out there.
1:18:33
So even up top there was only a couple inches.
1:18:35
So it was fine. There was actually one I did I I
1:18:38
post over a couple times, like real deep up to the crotch, the
1:18:41
full leg, one of those postals or like when you step off the
1:18:45
trail and one of them was in not like a spruce trap, but like
1:18:48
kind of like a mini spruce post hole thing.
1:18:52
And I, I hit it and it gave me flashbacks to a few years ago.
1:18:57
I remember doing the exact same thing in the exact same location
1:19:01
at this one trap. So this guy, I don't know how
1:19:03
many people this person's been taken.
1:19:05
This tree's been taken when the snow gets deep.
1:19:08
But be careful for that. If you if you went out this
1:19:11
weekend, you just saw a massive Andrew sized post hole.
1:19:16
So those are the trail conditions pretty good.
1:19:18
This I mean, the trip report is just going to be useless because
1:19:21
this weekend it's going to be in the 50s for a couple days.
1:19:24
A lot of weekend traffic it's going to get destroyed anyway.
1:19:28
So we'll see what stands at the end of the weekend.
1:19:31
But the one thing I wanted to talk about my hot take when it
1:19:34
comes to trail conditions, a lot of people get frustrated when
1:19:38
trails get very post hold, which I am on board with.
1:19:41
I don't like when trails get all post hold.
1:19:43
It's just it makes it makes it slower going.
1:19:47
I think some people. Overdo it a lot.
1:19:51
Like, you know, there are some people that will wear if there's
1:19:53
an, if there's a dusting, everyone should wear their
1:19:56
snowshoes. And I am not one of those
1:19:58
people. Like if if there's a few inches
1:20:00
if you're not postponing the middle of the trail every step.
1:20:04
You don't, you don't really need to wear snowshoes.
1:20:07
Even if there's some drifts up top, even if it gets a little, I
1:20:10
think you know, a couple postals on trails is fine.
1:20:13
It's not going to. It's not the end of the world,
1:20:17
but some people. Really hate.
1:20:18
Postaling. And so there's this big push for
1:20:20
always wearing snowshoes, which I get, but.
1:20:23
I think if. You complain about postholes
1:20:27
right? If you complain about post
1:20:29
holes, I should also never see you butt sledding down a
1:20:33
mountain because I think butt sledders, the people that are
1:20:37
yippee butt sledding down the mountain and 18% grade, they
1:20:41
mess up the trail just as bad as post holes.
1:20:44
If you like, there are some sections in the whites where
1:20:46
it's just in ice luge all winter because people from the get go
1:20:51
are butt sledding down. And maybe the bad devil on my
1:20:55
shoulder just puts this picture on my head of somebody's yelling
1:20:58
at somebody for a postal. But then also just like Yippy
1:21:01
tongue out, sliding down, butt slutting and maybe this.
1:21:06
Is a. This is a.
1:21:07
Bad and I'm not trying to hate because honestly, I I I won't
1:21:11
you know this. I guess this is me complaining
1:21:13
about the butt slutting ice luges, but I I actually don't
1:21:16
care. Like if it's ice lugey, if it's
1:21:19
post holy, whatever. Like it is, it is what it is.
1:21:23
Like I'm cool with whatever trails if you're going to
1:21:25
complain about some of the Mainer stuff, major minor stuff
1:21:27
out there like that. It's like in the summer the the
1:21:32
trails are way more messed up just from all the rocks and rock
1:21:35
slabs and a little bit of water. Like a little bit of water.
1:21:38
On steep rocks is worse than ice luges and then all the technical
1:21:42
rocks on the trail are probably worse than post holes.
1:21:45
So I trail, I'm good with which whatever trail conditions come
1:21:49
and especially like I'm kind of like a I'm more of a fair
1:21:53
weather hiker almost in some instances, if I know trail
1:21:56
conditions aren't good, I'll stay South or I'll do Rd. stuff
1:22:00
or I'll do inside. Like I do really pick pick my
1:22:02
conditions good. So like whatever view.
1:22:05
Will do to. Trails, unless it's like
1:22:06
horrible, like just absolute catastrophe, someone destroys an
1:22:10
entire trail. It's just being stupid.
1:22:13
You know, I, I don't complain too much about it, but I just
1:22:15
think if you're going to complain about one thing, don't
1:22:18
do the other thing. Like if you're going to be a
1:22:19
trail steward, don't leave any trash on the trails.
1:22:22
You leave a perfect snowshoe track all the time.
1:22:26
Don't break any branches, don't do don't step on any Moss, that
1:22:30
kind of thing. So I was kind of a hot take.
1:22:34
I want to get off off my chest. Basically.
1:22:36
I was going up to dry pyramids and it's just I you, I couldn't
1:22:39
even stay on the trail. You had to just like body off to
1:22:42
the trail because the ice was so bad.
1:22:43
I didn't have crampons but and it always kind of gets like
1:22:46
that. But yeah, ice losing is is is
1:22:50
messes up the trail. Butt sledding messes up the
1:22:52
trails just like post only does. So that was my hot take and it
1:22:57
made me remember one time. This is when I was getting into
1:23:00
hiking. I went out with two buddies.
1:23:03
One of them is into hiking. Is and was into.
1:23:08
Hiking a ton, a lot of 4K experience, and then one of them
1:23:11
wasn't. We went out there in whiteface
1:23:13
and pass a Conaway one day and I think two of us had snowshoes
1:23:18
and one of us didn't. And I don't know if it had just
1:23:21
snowed a lot. I don't know the whole I don't
1:23:23
remember. This is a few.
1:23:24
This was when I was just getting into hiking, so don't hold this
1:23:27
against me. But we go to the white face
1:23:29
Ambassador Conway loop and we get up to white face and the
1:23:32
trail was like fine. It was kind of like iffy.
1:23:35
You could put on snowshoes, but you didn't need it wasn't like
1:23:37
post holing because I think it had just snowed a bunch.
1:23:40
But in between the peaks we get down off of white face and and
1:23:45
we just start destroying the trail.
1:23:47
Like this is like what I'm talking about when people are
1:23:49
just assholes that are just destroying a trail.
1:23:52
We we were those people that day and.
1:23:55
We had two of us had the snowshoes on her back, which was
1:23:57
like weird, but probably for like a half a mile.
1:24:01
We didn't put them on and we just cooked this trail like
1:24:05
really bad and not proud of it. Not proud of it, but we, we, we.
1:24:09
We go through 1/2 mile. I'm like.
1:24:11
Guys, we need to put these on. So we put them on and then we
1:24:14
kind of try to clean up the person behind us.
1:24:16
And then we go about maybe a quarter mile more and we run
1:24:20
into some lady and very nice. And I think that I maybe my mom
1:24:24
had known her or something. So I kind of like, I think I
1:24:26
knew who it was in a certain sense, but.
1:24:29
We chatted. We were.
1:24:30
Good and she was very nice and I remember at the end of the hike
1:24:35
we get down and my muddy texted me was like you got to go look
1:24:38
at this trip report and that Lady, that Lady put a trip
1:24:42
report and she said something snap snarky, like not even
1:24:46
snarky, like actually no, probably was just factual, but
1:24:49
like Oh my gosh, a couple of people destroyed this trail from
1:24:52
whiteface or whatever. It's so bad.
1:24:54
It's horrible. But luckily 3 like superhero
1:24:59
strong men came through with snowshoes and hopefully they
1:25:02
flattened, you know, a lot of it out.
1:25:05
She had something along those lines, but she did not realize
1:25:09
that we were the people that messed that trail up.
1:25:15
And I remember reading that trail for in my tail I just
1:25:18
tucked with two legs. I was kind of embarrassed but
1:25:20
kind of just died laughing like. Because I don't know I.
1:25:24
Was probably hard to tell like if you know it was so bad when I
1:25:27
was like snowshoe didn't fix it. But no, we basically destroyed a
1:25:31
trail for a little bit, put on snowshoes, made it OK, and then
1:25:35
got all the credit for for breaking the trail.
1:25:38
So. That was a story that I
1:25:40
remembered. I would not do that nowadays.
1:25:43
Nowadays I'm pretty, I mean, with my Dion's I I bring, you
1:25:45
know, if there's a chance of post soling, like I just bring
1:25:48
them because they are fairly light and and I'll just put them
1:25:51
on because it is really easier to just put on some snowshoes.
1:25:54
But I that's, that's my thoughts on the on the trails of snowshoe
1:25:58
conditions. We'll see what the end of this
1:26:00
week holds like even this weekend.
1:26:03
Like if you post sole a trail like I don't know, there's no
1:26:05
saving the trail right now. It is.
1:26:08
What it is. So that was my thoughts.
1:26:11
That was the end of the episode. Hope you enjoyed the episode the
1:26:15
the stories. Oh, and actually one quick thing
1:26:17
at the end. I I.
1:26:20
I'm. On social media now I'm back on
1:26:23
social media at the podcast, YouTube, and I've made an
1:26:26
account for everything and we're just going to start posting some
1:26:29
of the stuff to get more outreach.
1:26:31
So if you're not following me on these platforms, consider going
1:26:36
going and following me. I now I don't I hope I don't
1:26:38
push too much. I'm going to probably start
1:26:40
pushing some of the stuff less than you guys, but I don't ask
1:26:44
for much. I don't see the whole like and
1:26:46
subscribe all the time, all this stuff.
1:26:48
But if you have platforms and you see me on Spotify and Apple,
1:26:54
obviously the podcast, YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok
1:26:59
threads, LinkedIn sub stack that oh wait, I'm not on LinkedIn sub
1:27:05
stack. Go give me a follow.
1:27:08
I have no followers on most of them.
1:27:10
I posted 3 TikTok videos and got dead 0 views, which I I don't
1:27:14
even know if that's possible. That is like impressively hard
1:27:17
to do. Go give me a follow there.
1:27:20
I appreciate the support even if you don't.
1:27:22
I don't even care. But if you're interested in any
1:27:24
of the things, go check it out because I like when I hear that
1:27:28
at least people are reading or listening or, or they like the
1:27:32
videos or whatever. That's the biggest thing.
1:27:34
But yeah, consider following the stuff.
1:27:36
I really appreciate you guys, everyone, the nice comments, all
1:27:38
the stuff. We are, we're in it and we're
1:27:41
going to seize the day of social media and just use it to talk
1:27:46
about running trail running all things Northeast.
1:27:49
So that's all I got for you guys today.
1:27:52
We'll see you next time. Peace.