Latest / Project You 2.2 / Carrie & Kelsey Hammack - The A Isn’t Worth Your Anxiety: Releasing Perfection to Actually Live

Transcript

Carrie & Kelsey Hammack - The A Isn’t Worth Your Anxiety: Releasing Perfection to Actually Live · Project You 2.2

0:20
SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Project U Two Po.
0:23
SPEAKER_01: I am Carrie Helmer, and on this podcast, we dive deep into mindset, growth, and finding your spark again.
0:32
SPEAKER_01: I have spent over 30 years as a teacher helping students navigate challenges, expectations, and the pressures of growing up.
0:41
SPEAKER_01: I've walked alongside people in transitions, loss, and self-discovery.
0:46
SPEAKER_01: And now I help adults and teens reconnect with themselves, release pressure and live more fully.
0:54
SPEAKER_01: This show is for anyone who's ever felt like they are performing instead of living, striving instead of enjoying, or chasing perfection at the cost of their peace.
1:10
SPEAKER_01: Today I am excited to bring you a conversation with someone I met on a retreat in Europe, someone who embodies reflection, depth, and emotional awareness in a way that will inspire you to pause, rethink, and reconnect with yourself.
1:30
SPEAKER_01: Let's get started.
1:43
SPEAKER_01: But inside you were exhausted trying to hold it all up.
1:48
SPEAKER_01: Straight A's, doing everything right, being the good one, the one teachers love, the ones parents don't have to worry about.
1:58
SPEAKER_01: But what if the very thing that made you successful is also the thing stealing your peace?
2:06
SPEAKER_01: That is exactly what we are talking about today.
2:09
SPEAKER_01: And the A in this episode doesn't just stand for grades, it also stands for anxiety.
2:18
SPEAKER_01: Because so often the pursuit of perfection, the drive to earn that A is a heavy burden.
2:25
SPEAKER_01: Kelsey Hammock is 24, and honestly, she's one of the most emotionally aware and mature 24-year-olds I have ever met.
2:34
SPEAKER_01: She loves journaling, writing letters, really sitting with her thoughts and understanding herself at a level I didn't even begin to tap into until much later in life.
2:45
SPEAKER_01: She works in elementary classrooms.
2:47
SPEAKER_01: She's an American sign language interpreter.
2:50
SPEAKER_01: And somewhere on our trip to Europe, she got a tattoo.
2:55
SPEAKER_01: But more importantly, she started shedding a version of herself, the perfectionist, the one who did everything right, but didn't always feel free.
3:05
SPEAKER_01: And what this part has shaped her perspective is real life.
3:10
SPEAKER_01: Kelsey lost her dad several years ago.
3:13
SPEAKER_01: And when you walk through something like that, especially at a young age, it has a way of shifting what actually matters and how you choose to live.
3:22
SPEAKER_01: This conversation is for the high-achieving student, the people-pleasing adult, and every parent raising a kid in a world that tells them their worth is a grade, a score, or a perfectly curated life.
3:39
SPEAKER_01: Let's get into it.
3:40
SPEAKER_01: Welcome, Kelsey.
3:42
SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
3:44
SPEAKER_00: Even just listening to that intro, I'm like, oh my gosh, that's gonna hit all of these pieces.
3:48
SPEAKER_00: I'm so excited to get into this.
3:51
SPEAKER_01: So nice to have you to reconnect.
3:52
SPEAKER_01: All right, Kelsey, we want to get to know you a little bit better.
3:55
SPEAKER_01: So in my classroom, I used to put students in the hot seat.
3:58
SPEAKER_01: We're gonna put you in the hot seat.
3:59
SPEAKER_01: So no overthinking these, no trying to get the perfect answer.
4:03
SPEAKER_01: Just the first thing that comes to mind.
4:06
SPEAKER_01: Ready for this?
4:07
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
4:08
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
4:08
SPEAKER_01: If you could give your younger perfectionist self one piece of advice, what would it be?
4:14
SPEAKER_00: It would be encouraging her to release that pressure and be able to step out and recognize the accomplishments that she had made thus far.
4:26
SPEAKER_00: That just really encouraging an acceptance to where I was releasing that stressors almost for no reason.
4:35
SPEAKER_01: I think that's so important.
4:36
SPEAKER_01: Even as adults, when we are overachievers, we set goals and we get there and we don't take time to celebrate.
4:44
SPEAKER_01: Instead, we like find something else that's wrong.
4:46
SPEAKER_01: And what's our next goal?
4:47
SPEAKER_01: And we're just so driven.
4:49
SPEAKER_01: So good advice for all of us.
4:51
SPEAKER_01: Okay, number two, what's the biggest thing you've discovered about yourself through journaling?
4:55
SPEAKER_01: Because you're a big journaler.
4:57
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I believe I'm currently on journal number 43 or 44 since eighth grade, just going nonstop.
5:06
SPEAKER_00: And through that, I learned to have a relationship of with myself.
5:11
SPEAKER_00: I learned how to label and identify my feelings, and that has truly helped me become such a self-aware person.
5:19
SPEAKER_00: But the other beauty to the journaling, not only what I've learned, but by having that recorded evidence, you can look back to an event and think through it through a different lens.
5:31
SPEAKER_00: But I have the receipts of my eighth grade self, like my eighth grade brain, my ninth grade brain, seeing some of these things.
5:37
SPEAKER_00: And it can be a tough time to get through and reread where I was.
5:42
SPEAKER_00: But there's such a beauty in having that frozen in time account of your life circumstances.
5:49
SPEAKER_01: I love that you have them all the way back from eighth grade.
5:52
SPEAKER_01: When I taught high school, my students would always love it.
5:56
SPEAKER_01: When they they had an, I think it was an eighth-grade English teacher who had them write a letter to themselves and then they delivered it to them.
6:04
SPEAKER_01: They saved it for four years.
6:05
SPEAKER_01: And so their senior year, they would get these letters and they loved it.
6:09
SPEAKER_01: They couldn't wait to like dig into the T who they were dating, who they liked, what they were into.
6:14
SPEAKER_01: And so do you have that record yourself for all of those days, all of those years?
6:20
SPEAKER_01: How fun! A little fun to travel back in time sometimes.
6:24
SPEAKER_01: Okay, the tattoo in Europe.
6:27
SPEAKER_01: Was that impulsive, or did you like deeply think that through and want that?
6:32
SPEAKER_00: I feel like it was a good blend.
6:34
SPEAKER_00: The intention of four-leaf clovers is really near and dear to my heart of just growing up with such a presence of finding them between my mom and I, that I knew that I wanted that, but it was a little spontaneous to just decide I'm gonna do this.
6:50
SPEAKER_00: I know that not everyone in my life, if I'm like, grandma, I got a tattoo.
6:54
SPEAKER_00: I have not.
6:54
SPEAKER_00: But if I did, like there's not going to be that welcome acceptance from everyone, but that was almost that first step of accepting that this is what I want, and I can put my wishes and needs above what I think others are going to perceive me as.
7:15
SPEAKER_01: So healthy.
7:16
SPEAKER_01: Yes, and I remember the stories about you and your mom and the clover.
7:20
SPEAKER_01: So I love that that it has some deep meaning with it.
7:23
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
7:23
SPEAKER_01: All right, how about one word your younger perfectionist self lived by, and then one word you live by now?
7:31
SPEAKER_00: In my younger years, and I have these like in a bunch of my diary entries.
7:37
SPEAKER_00: It's B equals failure.
7:39
SPEAKER_00: It that was truly my brain and my mindset.
7:43
SPEAKER_00: It was perfect.
7:44
SPEAKER_00: A nine 92 is like on the edge, a 90s.
7:48
SPEAKER_00: This a B is failure.
7:50
SPEAKER_00: And where that was kind of my mantra back then, it has shifted into my mindset now is to release that grading and the numbers more towards excitement, acceptance, and just ready to go and give it your all.
8:12
SPEAKER_00: So it's it might be my past was um quantitative and now it's qualitative.
8:24
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
8:25
SPEAKER_01: Nice job.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: I want to talk about that actually a little bit more later.
8:29
SPEAKER_01: What's one thing?
8:30
SPEAKER_01: You've been on a fitness journey.
8:31
SPEAKER_01: So what's one thing about your body or your fitness that you're learning to appreciate or maybe challenge?
8:38
SPEAKER_00: I feel like a lot of disciplines in life end up bleeding together.
8:42
SPEAKER_00: And through fitness, in my years of trying and not and not following through, what has really shown in the last year has just been consistency.
8:56
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't have to be perfection, it doesn't have to be hitting all the levels, but if you're hitting enough, it becomes a sustainable change.
9:03
SPEAKER_00: And that's something I never had in my life prior until I showed up in gratitude and love.
9:10
SPEAKER_00: And that's really when results happened.
9:14
SPEAKER_01: And isn't that true with so much in life that showing up with consistency is the key?
9:22
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
9:23
SPEAKER_00: It's really opened up my eyes to even just how I live my daily life because the gym is a part, it's an hour, hour and a half a day.
9:32
SPEAKER_00: But for the rest of my day, my life, those same mentalities still hold true.
9:41
SPEAKER_01: Kelsey, I remember when we were on our retreat and you said something to me when we you were one of the girls I just connected with so much.
9:53
SPEAKER_01: And we had a few little conversations just one-on-one.
9:56
SPEAKER_01: And you said, I got straight A's in high school, but I sacrificed so much peace for the pressure.
10:05
SPEAKER_01: So take us back to that version of you.
10:08
SPEAKER_01: Like, what did a perfect student look like and how did that pressure affect you?
10:14
SPEAKER_00: I really made my honestly middle school and then high school self.
10:20
SPEAKER_00: My identity was straight A's.
10:24
SPEAKER_00: And I would just be nervous about Tesby over analytical on everything I was doing.
10:33
SPEAKER_00: I was in the honors classes, I saw that opportunity of feedback of a number as my worth.
10:41
SPEAKER_00: And so any obviously, all of my classes had to be straight A's because that's what you could get, so that's what you have to get.
10:49
SPEAKER_00: And I had this black and white scale.
10:51
SPEAKER_00: I do find, and I look back to see a lot of my mindsets, I hadn't yet developed um whatever psychological philosophy of later years through your stages, you become more grayscale understanding ethics and morals in this.
11:08
SPEAKER_00: I lived my life very much in the black and white of it's an A or you did it wrong.
11:14
SPEAKER_00: It's this or that.
11:15
SPEAKER_00: It was very, if 100 is the potential of what you can get, that's what I should be getting.
11:22
SPEAKER_00: If not, I'm doing it wrong.
11:23
SPEAKER_00: And through that, I lived my school days in nerves and then my nights and evenings, and just I lived by the gradebook.
11:35
SPEAKER_00: When you got your login to see on pinnacle.com, that was where I was going every day.
11:39
SPEAKER_00: I was writing, I have pages in my diaries about okay, well, if I get 11 out of 12 on this test, then this is how this ratios to this, this, this, this, this, this.
11:48
SPEAKER_00: And I was just reviewing it to try to find anything to bring me back to my past.
11:54
SPEAKER_00: And one of my quotes was, if I get a C on this, I'll hate myself until I implode.
11:59
SPEAKER_00: Like, hello.
12:00
SPEAKER_00: Just some of the ways that a teenage brain can really latch onto one thing.
12:06
SPEAKER_00: It was proving my worth, and I didn't know how to do that only, other than by grades.
12:13
SPEAKER_00: Where do you think that pressure came from?
12:16
SPEAKER_00: That's a good question.
12:17
SPEAKER_00: I it did not come from my parents, it came from me.
12:22
SPEAKER_00: And the childhood that I had was amazing.
12:25
SPEAKER_00: My parents were very supportive, and I think I turned that into oh, I have all these things, so I have to prove perfection.
12:35
SPEAKER_00: There's no excuse not to.
12:37
SPEAKER_00: And there would be times where I'm just beyond stress, in tears, in my moments, and my mom's trying to coax me through it, saying, like, Kelsey, it's okay.
12:47
SPEAKER_00: I got C's in school.
12:50
SPEAKER_00: I like, we're not, it's not this, it's not the end all.
12:53
SPEAKER_00: And I remember just like that internal roll your eyes because your mom's telling you something you're not listening to.
12:58
SPEAKER_00: Um but it just came from myself because I would find avenues of where I would go 100%, and that was in my grades where I didn't want to have, I wasn't ready to have that attempt of something, maybe have that consistency and not show up as perfect, or I was scared to fail.
13:22
SPEAKER_00: One of the categories that I knew I could succeed in was my grade.
13:26
SPEAKER_00: So that was just my end all be all.
13:28
SPEAKER_01: It goes back to that journal entry that you saw back then, how B equals failure.
13:34
SPEAKER_01: And it's almost it becomes, I think, this habitual pattern where that's your identity.
13:40
SPEAKER_01: And I saw that so many times during my teaching, and especially in high-achieving girls, because they were the ones who didn't break the rules, they didn't fall apart, they like held it together outwardly, anyways, and then they performed beautifully.
13:59
SPEAKER_01: And you love those students, but then you also see that internally they're the ones who are managing anxiety, they have so much pressure, and usually it's self-induced.
14:12
SPEAKER_01: And I I think some of that is birth order.
14:16
SPEAKER_01: I've studied so much about birth order and being a firstborn and then an only child, it's like firstborn on steroids.
14:22
SPEAKER_01: So, but it's a constant feeling of don't mess up.
14:27
SPEAKER_01: And the dangerous part is, I think, is that the world rewards us for that.
14:33
SPEAKER_00: Yes, that is something that you see time and time again, and the way the classic classroom structure is, some of sometimes those students then just go unnoticed.
14:47
SPEAKER_00: And one thing that I've loved being in my classroom this year, I'm in fourth grade with an amazing teacher, and she really emphasizes sitting there looking pretty, looking like you're paying attention, is not gonna give you the stickers.
15:02
SPEAKER_00: It's not gonna bring you there.
15:04
SPEAKER_00: I want you to be raising your hand and be wrong.
15:06
SPEAKER_00: I want to embrace that because you should be included and not so fearful of raising your hand and having the wrong answer.
15:14
SPEAKER_00: We want to foster learning, not just foster complacency.
15:19
SPEAKER_01: I agree with that, and I think accolades to that teacher because I remember as a new teacher wanting my students to just sit there and to be well behaved because I was dealing with the content and dealing with delivery, and I it was hard to deal with the classroom management.
15:34
SPEAKER_01: And you wanted, you know, when a principal came in to observe you, you wanted all the students to get it right because you felt like it was a reflection of you.
15:42
SPEAKER_01: But the more experienced you become as a teacher, the more you crave that, the realness.
15:46
SPEAKER_01: You want students to, I loved it when students would get up to the board and I would have them.
15:50
SPEAKER_01: And I don't care if you make a mistake, I want you to make a mistake because I want everyone else to see those.
15:55
SPEAKER_01: And that's where the true learning happens.
15:58
SPEAKER_01: So I love that.
16:00
SPEAKER_01: As a teacher, I loved it when students earned A's because, and even as a parent with my three boys, like I loved it when they earned A's.
16:08
SPEAKER_01: But I will also say this that I quickly learned that the grade isn't just it's not the important thing.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: And that took me into my adulthood when I was on the opposite end of it.
16:21
SPEAKER_01: So I remember one time a parent called me, and this was several years into my teaching career, and she was arguing with me about giving her son a B plus for the end of the trimester.
16:35
SPEAKER_01: And she was trying to convince me to change it to an A for college purposes.
16:39
SPEAKER_01: And I was always understanding and I tried to help my students in every way, but I just couldn't justify just changing the grade because the parent had asked me and they hadn't earned that.
16:50
SPEAKER_01: But yet, that caused a very unhappy parent and even a little bit of a rift between the relationship with me and that student.
16:58
SPEAKER_01: And then I remember students crying, like you had mentioned earlier, if they got a 93% on a test and they were devastated because they wanted to score higher.
17:06
SPEAKER_01: And it was so interesting to watch that pressure that we put on ourselves, and it's it isn't helpful.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: And as a teacher, I loved, I love those students that you were just talking about who worked hard, who asked questions, who were engaged, and they were really putting in the effort.
17:22
SPEAKER_01: And those were the students who were really learning, and they weren't doing it for the grade, but for life.
17:27
SPEAKER_01: And and I think when you do that, then that grade comes naturally.
17:31
SPEAKER_01: So I'm curious, Kelsey, if you ever felt that pressure growing up, or maybe even now in a different way, where you're either fully engaged or not fully engaged because you're so obsessively just chasing perfection, but not soaking up the experience.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: That's a good self-audit.
17:51
SPEAKER_00: I feel like in the natural times in my life where it was very much the grade equals my worth in high school, I learned a little bit to go for it, but not put the shaming pressure on myself in college and as well in my master's.
18:12
SPEAKER_00: Now that I'm living at a point that no one's handing me a grade book of what I'm currently showing up as, that has allowed myself to really just trust where I'm at and do that self-reflective work on my own.
18:28
SPEAKER_00: See what results I am getting if uh in whatever senses, whether that's my career, whether that is in the gym, whether that's just anything in life, I feel like it helps me stay more in tune with the current moment and how I'm presenting myself and what I'm learning from it, versus it used to be block out the lesson so I can focus on what to get right, teaching to the test, learning from the test because it wasn't even the teachers that were doing it, it was just that pressure on myself and the best thing that I did for my very first semester in college because my high school I had a 4.0 all through my years, and I was also thinking like, okay, so I do want to get straight A's, but I'm not gonna like hate myself through it in the way that I did in high school, and I had a two-credit beginner honors thes, what a thesis looks like, of course.
19:31
SPEAKER_00: And I got an A- and that was on my first transcript, and I was like, this is actually so freeing because now I can't get a 4.0, so now I don't have to stress about getting a 4.0.
19:41
SPEAKER_00: So I can still strive for my A's, but on its own, that was that next step that I almost needed to release that obsession over perfection.
19:54
SPEAKER_01: When did you realize that perfectionism wasn't serving you?
19:59
SPEAKER_01: Was it that point that and you started letting go?
20:02
SPEAKER_00: It was it was a process of really learning how to let that go and unprogram everything that I had just tunneled myself into.
20:12
SPEAKER_00: But as you said in my intro, that in my past when I was in high school, my dad was diagnosed with cancer, and then it was a pretty fast progression by the point that he passed away.
20:26
SPEAKER_00: And this was my senior year, so I had gone through my black and white, everything.
20:31
SPEAKER_00: It's A's are failure.
20:32
SPEAKER_00: This is this and this and this and this.
20:34
SPEAKER_00: And it was in my senior year, it was about March, April, May was the timeline, and he had gotten the diagnosis.
20:45
SPEAKER_00: It was a week of things just like didn't look right.
20:48
SPEAKER_00: I didn't know what I was looking for, but something just didn't seem like I could rationalize it.
20:54
SPEAKER_00: And I had asked my mom, oh, by the way, what what stage is it?
20:59
SPEAKER_00: And she had told me it was stage four.
21:01
SPEAKER_00: And so as an 18 does that night I go into Google.
21:05
SPEAKER_00: Google is not the place for me to go and really learn my first steps of things, and so that next day of school, I was just in this state of fight or flight.
21:16
SPEAKER_00: I was not engaged, anything was just in one ear, out the other.
21:20
SPEAKER_00: I was just tunneling in my brain.
21:22
SPEAKER_00: And my last class was philosophy, and we'd watched something also existential in that class.
21:28
SPEAKER_00: So by that point where the bell rang, and I was on my way to go home, I was just in this well of tears.
21:37
SPEAKER_00: I was kind of on the brink of that breakdown.
21:40
SPEAKER_00: And my friend and I then go into the cafeteria, which is kind of just the hodgepodge of everyone, going to their bus lines, going and packing up their lockers.
21:49
SPEAKER_00: And I'm in this moment of having a full on breakdown saying, Oh my gosh, he has cancer, stage four, he's not gonna make it.
21:57
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
21:58
SPEAKER_00: And it was this pounding moment of nothing matters.
22:00
SPEAKER_00: I've been putting so much energy and sacrificing my peace for something that is so minute.
22:11
SPEAKER_00: And meanwhile, my friend, as what high school role is, she's like, um, you're crying.
22:18
SPEAKER_00: Let's go to the bathroom.
22:19
SPEAKER_00: I was like, it doesn't even matter.
22:20
SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't, this doesn't matter.
22:22
SPEAKER_00: Nothing matters.
22:23
SPEAKER_00: I don't care that I'm crying.
22:24
SPEAKER_00: I don't care that people are watching me.
22:25
SPEAKER_00: It was the most freeing moment that something's like that.
22:27
SPEAKER_00: It was nothing matters.
22:30
SPEAKER_00: The failed test, the this, that, like literally nothing feels as emotionally heavy than when it does in that moment.
22:37
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't need to be this large bite or flight anxiety inducing anything in your body if that's not gonna serve you.
22:46
SPEAKER_00: So that was almost this renewed day that I was able to go home, realize, okay, so it is what it is.
22:55
SPEAKER_00: This is the most important piece of my life is soaking up the time that I have with my dad.
23:00
SPEAKER_00: And it's never a pretty story the way that cancer ends up happening and really just taking over.
23:10
SPEAKER_00: But being able to regain myself was such an important piece and really helps me continue on to who I am, have that self-reflection, become self-aware, and be able to take hold of how I want to live my life, not how I want to show up for others to think of me as.
23:36
SPEAKER_01: But what a key pivotal moment in your life to a whole new way of approaching the expectations, the perfectionism, and just for your growth.
23:49
SPEAKER_01: And I think that shift is so valuable for us to learn from without having to go through the grief that you did with losing your dad, and that you just learn that energy when it does come from pressure, you have this tight feeling and the energy from your confidence instead, when you flip that, just expand your life so much.
24:16
SPEAKER_01: I think when you are like you stop putting that perfection on a pedestal, how you said, like, okay, I didn't get that A, I so now I there's nothing to strive for.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: It's impossible for me to get a four-point.
24:28
SPEAKER_01: I think you become a little bit more productive and a little bit more at peace.
24:32
SPEAKER_01: And that's the paradox that I think is hard for people to understand.
24:36
SPEAKER_00: Yes, it really just helped flip me onto such a different path because there was that feeling of nothing matters.
24:43
SPEAKER_00: You can literally just swipe it off.
24:45
SPEAKER_00: And the next freeing aspect is it released the fear of embarrassment, the way that high schoolers are so in their mind about, oh my gosh, that's embarrassing.
24:54
SPEAKER_00: Oh, the common um phrasing was always, oh, I hate myself, this and that, I'm so stupid.
25:00
SPEAKER_00: And those are almost just abrasive now when I hear, like, oh, what do you mean you hate yourself?
25:06
SPEAKER_00: That became such an intentional switch when I would something embarrassing would happen.
25:10
SPEAKER_00: It was me verbally saying, I love myself, and just adding in more padding of positive affirmations really just changed who I was in my life, but it became this next free piece that nothing matters in a good way.
25:27
SPEAKER_00: Embarrassment's a construct.
25:29
SPEAKER_00: I love myself.
25:30
SPEAKER_00: I'm not hating myself through these things.
25:32
SPEAKER_00: I'm powering myself up and seeing what I can do with that energy.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: Beautiful.
25:39
SPEAKER_01: I think in middle school and high school, I don't think so much as in college, but there was, there is this um, this feeling of superiority, like, hey, what'd you get on the test?
25:51
SPEAKER_01: And then there's that embarrassment of not wanting to say, and the the classifying and the stacking of you know, up of yourself against other people, because it's just so talked about that it's so important to kids who do well, and then the embarrassment factor for the other kids.
26:08
SPEAKER_01: So in my classroom, I want to break this down very simply for anybody to understand.
26:14
SPEAKER_01: So if you imagine two students, student A, so this is the Kelsey, middle school, high school, you almost were driven by fear because you had to get an A, because B equals failure, and then your nervous system is in stress mode the whole time, every time before a test, before a quiz, and then and waiting for those grades and checking your grade book constantly.
26:37
SPEAKER_01: And then there's student B, who is who you've become, who you are driven more by growth, actual real growth, with that philosophy of I want to learn, I want to improve, I want to do my best.
26:51
SPEAKER_01: But then I think your nervous system becomes a little bit more open and allows you to engage more.
26:57
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
26:58
SPEAKER_00: And really just looking back, I'm not remembering the specifics of the grades, I'm remembering the content.
27:05
SPEAKER_00: So that was so important in my college years as I'm learning the building steps of my career and how to interpret 101.
27:17
SPEAKER_00: That like I took my American Sign Language classes, and then you take interpreting classes, and the first two to three years you're doing it through school, it's really rough.
27:28
SPEAKER_00: It's you watch these physics, and it's kind of just that like almost that humiliation ritual of like, okay, so now I have to watch myself for 20 minutes and you're kind of failing, but it's embracing that quote unquote failure, and you identify each of these things of what you can do better.
27:47
SPEAKER_00: And it's really crazy how you approach it because I did have those student A's in my class that were, oh my gosh, this and this and this, and now it's another thing, and this, and I'm so bad at this, and I'm this, this, this.
28:00
SPEAKER_00: And it's coming from that negative mindset that they've been harping on themselves, versus taking it, taking that piece of criticism and knowing how to better address it in the future, having that open up.
28:12
SPEAKER_00: So I became the student that I was putting my hand up to go first, because let's get it while I have this energy rather than sitting back and letting it faster into anxiety or worry.
28:24
SPEAKER_01: As I worked with students and continue to work with students, I see that their brain just doesn't process as well when they're in that chronic stress mode because that anxiety blocks creativity, it creates, it blocks your memory and problem solving, and they just like want to get it right and they want to memorize it instead of really because they're just chasing perfection.
28:47
SPEAKER_01: And so it's so fun to see when students and even adults flip that and they truly engage more and they're asking questions, and they like you, you journaled, you reflect, and those are skills are so important that no grade can measure.
29:05
SPEAKER_01: And it's that self-awareness, the emotional regulation, your internal confidence building, and those are the skills, not the algebra skills, but those are the skills that you need to carry you through life.
29:19
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think there is such a beauty in embracing that I don't even feel like it is failure, but being able to do that self-audit, to be self-aware on how you're reacting, where that's coming from.
29:35
SPEAKER_00: It's being able to accept either what didn't come to fruition or ways that you want to improve because so many people are closed off on it, are very deflective, and are not ready to open up to see where they could improve.
29:53
SPEAKER_00: So they're feeling very stagnant.
29:55
SPEAKER_00: It's that closed mind versus that growth mindset.
29:58
SPEAKER_01: And it takes intentional work.
30:00
SPEAKER_01: So for parents listening, if your child is getting good grades, but they're constantly overwhelmed, anxious, afraid to fail, I think this is your signal.
30:11
SPEAKER_01: Don't push harder.
30:12
SPEAKER_01: We know what happens there, but just to get curious, maybe, and maybe even introduce some things like the journaling that Kelsey has done, the reflection, or just some open conversations.
30:23
SPEAKER_01: Because I think when I what I see in Kelsey is what happens when a young person just learns how to understand themselves and not just perform for the world.
30:33
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's the goal and not raising a perfect student.
30:37
SPEAKER_01: It's raising a self-aware, resilient human, which is I'm so proud of you because I feel like that's what you have done and that's where you are now.
30:46
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
30:47
SPEAKER_00: In some of the things that are on paper, a lot of the resume looks like it's those perfect pieces, but that's less of what I resonate with.
30:56
SPEAKER_00: It's not the labels, it's not that quantitative data, like I was saying, used to be my mindset.
31:02
SPEAKER_00: It's the quality, it's how am I feeling?
31:05
SPEAKER_00: And when I was living this way of having these quote-unquote successes, I wasn't feeling that.
31:11
SPEAKER_00: So really embracing your emotions and that qualitative data that is so just vital because if you have all of these things but you're bogged down by your mindset, you're not really going to enjoy the experience.
31:26
SPEAKER_01: I will say that I was head of the math department.
31:29
SPEAKER_01: And so over the years, I looked over several resumes as we prepare to interview new math teachers coming in.
31:36
SPEAKER_01: And one of the pieces was they had to submit their undergraduate grades.
31:41
SPEAKER_01: And I would always look at those.
31:43
SPEAKER_01: And they do paint a part of a story.
31:46
SPEAKER_01: And if you saw someone with all A's, it did kind of raise a red flag for me.
31:52
SPEAKER_01: Even though I was very much like you and wanted all A's, I had some B's.
31:55
SPEAKER_01: I didn't, it wasn't quite the four, but in my master's degrees, I had all four points.
32:00
SPEAKER_01: And what when you look at that, it raises some flags like, wait a minute, they're either maybe boring, or maybe they're so tightly wound that they don't work well with other people.
32:10
SPEAKER_01: So when you saw some B's in there, even some C's, you're like, okay, maybe they also, you know, they struggled, they're real, and they, you know, learn from that.
32:22
SPEAKER_01: And so it is interesting because you see that, like the anxiousness that comes from that, and letting go of that perfection is, I think, what helps us actually be more successful.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: So, what would you say for someone listening right now, maybe a high school student, even a college student, who knows they have those high expectations for themselves, but they also they're anxious and they want to let go, but they're scared to because that's their identity and they're scared to let go of that perfection because they they think that's what they need to do to be successful.
32:59
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I would say as a blanket statement, take the class because I there were many times where I'd look at the courses and I played it safe because I wanted to get my A's.
33:12
SPEAKER_00: So I did not that I had a love and passion for calculus, but I didn't go up into the taking the more math classes because oh my gosh, what if I gotta be in calculus?
33:21
SPEAKER_00: No, thank you.
33:22
SPEAKER_00: Um, I am now on Duolingo to learn Spanish because I didn't take Spanish in high school because I was scared that that would be too much work on my load and I get a B.
33:32
SPEAKER_00: So finding those ways that you're restricting yourself if there's actually the course that you want to take, and you're fearful out of it, so you're not taking that action, take that action and swap it towards there's like a challenge out there where you're trying to collect rejections.
33:52
SPEAKER_00: And that was another little baby step that I took of collecting rejections and that being the worst thing that happens if someone tells me no, that may feel frightening in that moment, but that lets you have the sense of freedom that is kind of the same way of nothing matters, it's okay.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: The worst thing that someone says is no, no one died over this, and that as a mantra really just freed me up.
34:20
SPEAKER_00: So it's allowing yourself to take that next step and center yourself in your feelings, not your accomplishments.
34:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm so glad you brought that up because it triggered something to you said to take the class, even if it's not going to get an you think maybe I'm not gonna get an A.
34:39
SPEAKER_01: So maybe you took calculus, maybe take calc two, calc three, who cares?
34:43
SPEAKER_01: And it was something that I really preached to my pre-calculus students because they had heard that AP calculus was so hard.
34:51
SPEAKER_01: And I said, it is.
34:52
SPEAKER_01: I remember taking calculus for the first time and it felt like a foreign language.
34:56
SPEAKER_01: I said, but if you take it now, you have all school year to learn in high school versus going to college and having one semester and learning at an accelerated level.
35:06
SPEAKER_01: Who cares if you don't get an A?
35:08
SPEAKER_01: Get the experience.
35:09
SPEAKER_01: And so maybe it's not taking AP calculus for everybody, but do things that maybe you're not gonna perform at the highest level, but it's okay because you're getting the experience.
35:22
SPEAKER_01: So I love that you said that.
35:24
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
35:25
SPEAKER_00: Another quote that came up when I within this last year in the fitness journey that I've been on, where I used to go pedal to the metal, 100% showing up for everything, and then I'd then crash and take time off.
35:41
SPEAKER_00: And that was always the pattern that I found myself in.
35:44
SPEAKER_00: But there was a concept that you want to be aiming for B plus or even B minus work.
35:51
SPEAKER_00: If you can just be consistent enough to go, it doesn't have to be that perfection that you're hitting the highest weights of all the reps of every single thing.
36:02
SPEAKER_00: As long as you're showing up, it doesn't have to be perfect, you're still making that growth.
36:06
SPEAKER_00: And to me, that was really this aha mo.
36:09
SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, a B minus is gonna be celebrated.
36:12
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
36:13
SPEAKER_00: It's also almost that piece where there were some students, and I never understood how they were doing it, but they didn't do something or they had half done their homework, but it's already late, so I'm just gonna let it be a zero because it's not really that done.
36:27
SPEAKER_00: Turn it in, get the 55%, and that's going to help you get somewhere versus being so scared that you're not even trying.
36:36
SPEAKER_00: You're failing yourself just by doing that.
36:39
SPEAKER_01: Very reflective.
36:41
SPEAKER_01: And I think that is true with so many things outside of life.
36:44
SPEAKER_01: If you're on a weight loss journey, you might get to your goal weight, but then you start not really celebrating because then you start picking up on like stretch marks or the loose skin, or I have a client that I'm coaching, and you know, she rated one of her wheels of life that we looked at as a two when we started.
37:04
SPEAKER_01: And then she rated it after some time of working together as a six or a seven.
37:10
SPEAKER_01: And she didn't celebrate because she said, Oh, I still have so far to go.
37:13
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, wait a minute.
37:15
SPEAKER_01: You started at a two, and now you're rating yourself as a six or a seven.
37:19
SPEAKER_01: Like that's huge growth.
37:21
SPEAKER_01: And so I think it's so important, and sometimes we don't see that in ourselves, and so it's important to maybe you need someone else to point it out to you.
37:29
SPEAKER_01: But growth is growth, and you might not be to that A yet.
37:32
SPEAKER_01: You might never get to that A, but you're growing.
37:35
SPEAKER_01: Talk to me about Europe because I think I watched you go through that week and saw a lot of things and thoughts that were unlocked and ideas that maybe you'd been holding on to reserve.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: So can you share a little bit of maybe it's Europe, maybe it's a different trip or a different time when you took some action to unlock stuff that had been built up and you just saw it released a little bit.
38:04
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think there's something really magical about a retreat space where there's other people uh surrounding you that are also looking for that up level, that are really invested in your success.
38:18
SPEAKER_00: And that was the perfect place to not only put my journal thoughts out there, but get to talk with people and recognize oh, some of these feelings were really self-limiting.
38:30
SPEAKER_00: Seeing and what made sense in my brain then couldn't even be rationalized.
38:36
SPEAKER_00: It was an overarching fear of perception of others.
38:41
SPEAKER_00: So between that and then the fear of failure, even in my career, where it was that on paper I have these successes, but I still feel like I'm in that lack of energy.
38:51
SPEAKER_00: By being able to work through some of these things, when I got back, it was just opportunities left and right, and it has continued to be so by just putting myself out there and becoming the student again rather than pretending that, oh, I have the certification, so I know everything that I'm doing.
39:10
SPEAKER_00: You're always a student in so many regards for life, but by embracing that energy and coming into a space of wanting to learn and to embrace your failures to switch it, you're really just improving at each next level.
39:27
SPEAKER_00: And for that retreat that gave me the quote unquote permission to do what I want to get the tattoo, to decide yes, I do want to move, to make decisions that I had the vision for, not out of explaining the reasons why to others.
39:51
SPEAKER_01: That is freeing in itself.
39:52
SPEAKER_01: And so let's go back.
39:54
SPEAKER_01: You just said you moved, so yes, now you've moved to Austin, right?
39:59
SPEAKER_00: That is in my mind, I have.
40:02
SPEAKER_00: I have the least secured and all of that.
40:04
SPEAKER_00: So I'm ending this year out with the best bang that I can and taking my time in Missouri, and then I will be starting and making those next jumps and ready to accept of what comes into fruition, what doesn't work out like I thought, and get to really up-level into who I want to be and who I see I'm not showing up as at the current time.
40:29
SPEAKER_01: And sometimes I think good growth does come from pushing outside of your comfort zone.
40:34
SPEAKER_01: And other times you don't have to put your whole turn your life upside down and move across the country to do that.
40:42
SPEAKER_01: But you're even doing intentional things right now with you're pursuing some interpreting services for recording media content.
40:50
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's huge.
40:52
SPEAKER_01: So tell us a little bit more about that vision and why it's so exciting for you.
40:57
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
40:58
SPEAKER_00: So as a whole, a lot of my growth has come from podcasts.
41:03
SPEAKER_00: Just getting to plug into so many resources that has always been the backbone of continuing to encourage me and reflect further, come up with habits and mindsets versus where I be in a book as soon as I close the book, those thoughts are kind of starting to fade.
41:21
SPEAKER_00: Whereas podcasts I've just really embraced and can dedicate as helping me to be who I am today.
41:29
SPEAKER_00: And I had already made the decision, yes, I am going to be moving to Austin.
41:34
SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, this is this is kind of crazy.
41:36
SPEAKER_00: I don't know how to explain this to people because I have a good life here, but I have the vision and I don't need to explain those to other people.
41:42
SPEAKER_00: I can just walk through it confidently and take that step.
41:46
SPEAKER_00: And it kind of clicked towards me where there's a lot of opportunity there, both in an amazing deaf community, but also a lot of those podcasting content creating spaces.
42:00
SPEAKER_00: And in the deaf community, there is such an amazing group within there, and many videos and a lot of information, but sometimes those realms don't bridge.
42:15
SPEAKER_00: So the podcasting space, as much as I've gained from that, would I really spend as much time in learn as much by pulling up transcripts in a second language?
42:26
SPEAKER_00: That opportunity to produce content in their first language really is such an exciting drive for me.
42:37
SPEAKER_00: And it's something that has not yet come to the full of the fruition, does not have steps one through 50 planned out yet, but it's almost that test to take what I've learned and be ready to fail, be ready to get those rejections so I can gain knowledge and those successes that I can see and really be in tune with my feelings for how to poise myself forward of who I want to be and who I want this venture to what I want it to become and just who I'll be as that future higher self, Kelsey.
43:22
SPEAKER_01: It's interesting to listen to you because you said steps one through 50.
43:28
SPEAKER_01: Now, most people with a plan aren't gonna have plans one through 50.
43:33
SPEAKER_01: They might have five or ten steps, but because you come from that perfectionist background, it was one through 50.
43:40
SPEAKER_01: But I love what you said.
43:41
SPEAKER_01: You're ready to take the leap, even though you don't have one through 50 figured out, and you are ready to learn by failing.
43:49
SPEAKER_01: Because as long as you keep getting up and not quitting, you're not gonna fail.
43:55
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's such a great example for listeners because growth.
44:00
SPEAKER_01: Growth isn't just this internal thing because if you wait for steps one to fifty to be ready, you'll never get there.
44:07
SPEAKER_01: So by you releasing some of that perfectionism and really understanding yourself and wanting that growth, I think it gives you clarity.
44:18
SPEAKER_01: And maybe you're not feeling super clear right now, but on the other side, you're gonna have so much clarity.
44:23
SPEAKER_01: And you know what else?
44:24
SPEAKER_01: You'll have gained so much courage.
44:27
SPEAKER_01: And by just stepping into those new opportunities and taking those risks and creating something that's so meaningful, I had an uncle who was hearing impaired.
44:35
SPEAKER_01: Do you have, is there like a person or where does this passion come from for you?
44:41
SPEAKER_00: I started learning American Sign Language in high school.
44:47
SPEAKER_00: And in middle school, I became friends with a girl and her parents were deaf.
44:52
SPEAKER_00: So uh known as Coda's children of deaf adults.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: We went to the mall and her mom's chaperoning, and I couldn't communicate that I remembered thank you and sorry.
45:03
SPEAKER_00: And that just felt so limiting on my end because truly, in what American Science Language provides for deaf people, the barrier becomes that other people don't know the language.
45:19
SPEAKER_00: It's not a disability and it's not that impairment, it's a language barrier between what the hearing world expects people to meet at.
45:33
SPEAKER_00: So, within that, the role of someone that knows American Sign Language, an interpreter, is to really advocate for that equal access, that equal opportunity.
45:44
SPEAKER_00: So, anyone listening to this, one of the best things you can do is learn even your finger spelling, if you see any events, to be able to tap in and just learn your basics because that then allows you to provide that access and tap into a whole community.
46:02
SPEAKER_00: So there's there's a vision of what can be worked with in it.
46:06
SPEAKER_00: So I really pride myself on having just gone deep diving in my high school career with my Coda friend and her parents.
46:18
SPEAKER_00: They truly help me become fluent.
46:20
SPEAKER_00: And it wasn't just an ASL one and ASL2 class in high school, it became my livelihood.
46:27
SPEAKER_01: Okay, I'm gonna um apologize for my ignorance because to me, and I need you I need some guidance here.
46:36
SPEAKER_01: To me, I thought saying deaf was maybe not the politically correct way that they would rather be called hearing impaired, but you just pointed out that it's not an impairment and that it is like a second language, which really had was a light bulb moment for me because it really was okay when I went to Germany and I couldn't converse and the frustration, and and then I knew a little bit because I'd taken a couple of years in college of German and and how freeing it was to have a few words to make it through.
47:09
SPEAKER_01: So, talk to me about the whole classification.
47:12
SPEAKER_01: What's appropriate?
47:13
SPEAKER_01: What date a little here for me?
47:15
SPEAKER_01: Educate me.
47:16
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
47:17
SPEAKER_00: So just as you think, where like, okay, what are the right ways?
47:23
SPEAKER_00: There has been a progression through culture and different terminology of what seemed to be right at the times.
47:29
SPEAKER_00: And these days it's deaf and hard of hearing.
47:33
SPEAKER_00: So the deaf community is the overall umbrella term.
47:38
SPEAKER_00: People can choose whatever their identities are.
47:41
SPEAKER_00: It's not about, it's not about the paper, it's not about what the audiology test says.
47:45
SPEAKER_00: You're this percent, so that means you are this.
47:48
SPEAKER_00: And there's an identity, and there really is a pride in it.
47:51
SPEAKER_00: So impairment is not a term that people typically adopt.
47:56
SPEAKER_00: It's more these days viewed as a negative because a lot of deaf people feel this isn't a disability, this isn't an impairment, this is who I am.
48:05
SPEAKER_00: There's such pride in that because that language is such a beautiful thing, that culture, that community, that everything is such a prosperous environment.
48:18
SPEAKER_00: It's then how how to bridge that on those that don't know.
48:25
SPEAKER_00: And as you said in your tours to Germany, having your few words is just that next step of like, okay, so now we can work with this.
48:35
SPEAKER_00: So it's really exciting of just the prospects of either I whether it's in what I'm doing as my interpreting job versus what this business could be and just really the impact.
48:49
SPEAKER_00: So I'm very excited with that and uplifting the deaf and hard of hearing community.
48:58
SPEAKER_01: Kelsey, that was so beautiful, and I appreciate your thorough explanation, and it really just is beautiful to me because you're right.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: They're not impaired and they communicate differently, but they're still like the same person, but they communicate with a different language, and so you couldn't have said that better.
49:18
SPEAKER_01: I appreciate that, and that was a good shift for my lens.
49:21
SPEAKER_01: Yes, Kelsey, you have walked through so much pressure, high expectations, mostly placed just internally, and even loss.
49:32
SPEAKER_01: And instead of letting that harden you, you have chosen to meet life with reflection and not just avoidance.
49:44
SPEAKER_01: And I think that that is rare that you're this beautiful light in the world.
49:49
SPEAKER_01: What does your life feel like now compared to maybe middle school or high school years?
49:57
SPEAKER_00: It feels limitless.
50:00
SPEAKER_00: It really is just this excitement of I get to create whatever I want it to be.
50:07
SPEAKER_00: What do I want my life to look like?
50:09
SPEAKER_00: When I felt that I had the permission to move, it was that moment where I was like, I don't have, I don't have plants.
50:17
SPEAKER_00: I can't keep plants alive.
50:18
SPEAKER_00: I don't have pets.
50:19
SPEAKER_00: I don't have anything like I can do what I want because what's the wor what's the worst that's gonna happen?
50:24
SPEAKER_00: I move somewhere, I don't like it.
50:26
SPEAKER_00: The worst con is that I have a lease, and the lease is for a finite time.
50:33
SPEAKER_00: I just really have this growth and excitement mindset currently because it's so freeing that I get to build the life that I want.
50:43
SPEAKER_00: Whereas back then I didn't even know that I could do that.
50:47
SPEAKER_00: I just knew what was put in front of me, and I knew I wanted to succeed.
50:52
SPEAKER_00: So I felt like I had to match the hoops that were presented in front of me versus getting to be in my own sphere and build up whatever I wanted to be.
51:03
SPEAKER_01: For those listening on audio, I wish they could see you because it's so much fun to watch you speak.
51:09
SPEAKER_01: And Kelsey, you can tell she does sign and interpret because her hands are moving all of the time when she talks.
51:17
SPEAKER_01: And is it hard not to just bust into signing while you're speaking?
51:22
SPEAKER_00: It is it's a lot more of gesturing where I'm not fluently signing at the same time as I'm speaking, but it's it's become a habit where it's just putting my hands up to add the visuals.
51:34
SPEAKER_00: So it is very clear that I'm an interpreter once you meet me.
51:39
SPEAKER_01: And I think it's so interesting.
51:40
SPEAKER_01: You said there isn't a sign, um, what do you call it, gesture for podcast?
51:45
SPEAKER_00: There is no ASL sign.
51:47
SPEAKER_00: It's something that's fingerspelled, so you're just P-O-D-C-A-S-T, because that is really an untapped network.
51:54
SPEAKER_00: A lot of there's a lot of signs out there.
51:56
SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of words that are reserved for fingerspelling, but sometimes when there isn't that importance in the culture yet, it's reserved for fingerspelling.
52:07
SPEAKER_00: Because why create it when there's not even that bridge yet?
52:12
SPEAKER_00: It's kind of the goal for bridging that, creating access, allowing those same benefits of what I've received from the podcasting world of the self-development world, because there are those barriers up.
52:28
SPEAKER_00: So it's truly a whole community to be able to tap into and get to receive those same benefits.
52:35
SPEAKER_01: I'm so proud of you.
52:37
SPEAKER_01: And for listeners, I'm so excited because Kelsey is going to take this podcast and she is going to do sign language with it and interpret it.
52:46
SPEAKER_01: And we will release that video as well so that the deaf community can listen and hear our message.
52:53
SPEAKER_01: So beautiful.
52:54
SPEAKER_01: So I know this is a new venture for you, Kelsey.
52:56
SPEAKER_01: So where can listeners find you and all of your new work coming up?
53:00
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
53:00
SPEAKER_00: Um, at the current moment, we're still thinking of the name, we're still figuring it out.
53:05
SPEAKER_00: But you can find me on Instagram at this for this point as Kelsey Hammock.
53:11
SPEAKER_00: Um, also on my TikTok, I'm trying to bring things out.
53:15
SPEAKER_00: And that's also just the point of let's sign these videos so it's in that language, and I can add in those captions.
53:23
SPEAKER_00: If I would be posting something with my voicing in English, that's then something that is interpreted because I need to be walking the walk if I'm talking the talk and really showing up and providing that dual access.
53:38
SPEAKER_00: So at this point, search up Kelsey Hammock, but more to come and more that you'll be seeing in the near future.
53:46
SPEAKER_01: Okay, and one little coaching plug here for you.
53:49
SPEAKER_01: I don't want you to overthink the name of this so that it doesn't, it loses its momentum.
53:54
SPEAKER_01: I I hear some of that perfection.
53:56
SPEAKER_01: The name isn't there quite yet.
53:57
SPEAKER_01: It's coming, it'll be there soon.
53:58
SPEAKER_01: So, to everyone listening, I want you to just ask yourself one question: Is there a place in your life where you are performing instead of actually living?
54:08
SPEAKER_01: And what would it look like to let go of that constant pressure so you can live from a place of confidence and self-awareness instead of anxiety and stress?
54:20
SPEAKER_01: And if you're listening, someone comes to mind, your daughter, your son, a student, a friend, please send this to them because the A isn't worth the anxiety.
54:30
SPEAKER_01: And their life is meant to be so much bigger than that.
54:34
SPEAKER_01: This is your invitation to come back to yourself.
54:37
SPEAKER_01: If anything in today's episode landed with you, maybe the pressure to be perfect, the worry about what others think, or wanting to feel more confident in your choices, you don't have to navigate that alone.
54:50
SPEAKER_01: Sometimes having a guide, someone to help you entangle those thoughts and level up your life can make all of the difference.
54:56
SPEAKER_01: And that's why I offer one-on-one coaching to help people build confidence, trust themselves, and start living their own terms so they can have a life filled with joy that is more aligned.
55:07
SPEAKER_01: Message me if you think one-on-one coaching could help you or your teen.
55:12
SPEAKER_01: Kelsey, thank you so much for your honesty, your depth, for educating me and for your heart.
55:19
SPEAKER_00: Carrie, thank you so much.
55:20
SPEAKER_00: This has been amazing, and I've loved getting to listen and really benefit from the podcast and everything you're doing.
55:26
SPEAKER_01: I have adored you from the moment we met.
55:29
SPEAKER_01: And I think you are just living proof that you can be driven and have that peace.
55:36
SPEAKER_01: And you are reflective at such a young age and you're still growing, you're still pushing yourself.
55:41
SPEAKER_01: So successful without sacrificing yourself.
55:45
SPEAKER_01: It was such a pleasure to have you on today.
55:47
SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
55:49
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
55:55
SPEAKER_01: Have you ever had an embarrassing moment of signing where you totally flubbed up?
56:00
SPEAKER_00: Um, yes, for sure.
56:02
SPEAKER_00: There are a lot of signs that are very close in nature, and there's some signs that are not appropriate, and there's some signs that are.
56:12
SPEAKER_00: So it's also a piece of like making sure that you are doing it properly.
56:16
SPEAKER_00: And that's sometimes where learning from online and from hearing people that may not have that knowledge can skew some signs.
56:25
SPEAKER_00: So it is very important to kind of just root it back into the deaf community if you're ever looking.
56:29
SPEAKER_00: The rule is you're supposed to wait for a deaf person to give you a name sign.
56:33
SPEAKER_00: And my name starts with K.
56:34
SPEAKER_00: This is a K.
56:35
SPEAKER_00: Um, P also goes down like this, so K and P.
56:39
SPEAKER_00: And my friend, who's also like ASL 1, ASL two, we don't know.
56:42
SPEAKER_00: We're in high school, and she's like, She's that's so like you don't have a name sign.
56:45
SPEAKER_00: And she's like playing around and she's like doing something, and she's like, Oh, that's kind of cute.
56:50
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Oh, that is kind of cute.
56:52
SPEAKER_00: We go on a field trip where we're going to Maryland School for the Deaf, and we're meeting other high schoolers that are deaf.
56:57
SPEAKER_00: So, like, they are fluid.
56:59
SPEAKER_00: We're saying, again, please, slower, hello, uh.
57:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, and I was asked, Oh, do you have a name sign?
57:05
SPEAKER_00: And I thought, I was like, no, I don't, it's not from a deaf person.
57:08
SPEAKER_00: No, I don't have a name sign.
57:09
SPEAKER_00: Come to find out a week later, that girl signs my hearing name, given name sign.
57:15
SPEAKER_00: And immediately that deference is like, huh?
57:19
SPEAKER_00: That's the sign for something very inappropriate.